Question For The Navy Folks

[pilotyip]

they did in 66

pilotyip: no disrespect sir, but the corps would never take a DOR......

I went throught training with a MARCAD USMC pilot who had dropped from the AVROC program. No college degree on his way to helo's and Vietnam. He may have come from the USMC reserve enlisted ranks? Never saw him again after VT-2

 

[Bavarian Chef]

If my ECMO buds that i've served with for years don't get a slot why should I let a quitter get his pilot wings before them?

There are NFO's with tons of real world experience that stuck it out just for the chance of getting a slot. Most of them never even b1tched. Tell me how Joey deserves a slot before them?

I didn't say he deserved anything, much less anything before your ECMO buddies. I said he deserved slack. Many NFOs are NFOs for a reason other than a "slight" astigmatism btw. And since when was the NFO or ECMO pipeline a prerequisite for snagging a pilot slot? NEVER. In fact, Stacy Bates put a nice exclamation point on that whole NFO to Pilot transition back in 1996. It only took a non-Aviator CNO in his infinite wisdom to reinstate it (to many mixed reviews).

I personally didn't join the Navy to be an NFO, nor did I join to fly EA-6Bs -- so I can only imagine how I would have felt if I somehow got either (especially if you had spent your whole life dreaming of something else). I guess some of us are "luckier" than others, but in this guy's case it sounds like he understands that he messed up and wants another shot.

 

[Bjammin]

And since when was the NFO or ECMO pipeline a prerequisite for snagging a pilot slot? NEVER.

I agree, but quitting is a big deal. You know as well as I there are some days, or weeks or months, that absolutly SUCK, even as a pilot, beyond our wildest imigination of what we think "suck" is. Joey persents a big "?" as to if he would survive those times, more so then any new-be.

There are many many guys out there with ZERO military experience that deserve a chance before Joey because they have the heart to stick it out and reach their dreams.

 

[PUCKFA18]

Bavarian Chef and Bjammin have good points. But, have we forgotten (including Joey) the reason we choose our dream. I never took it for granted!!!!!

I wanted to serve my country first and foremost. Everything else was a bonus.......

It is my opinion that Joey had his (Dream) shot and blew it..Life goes on!!!!!!!!

 

[Oh-ryan]

Bavarian Chef and Bjammin have good points. But, have we forgotten (including Joey) the reason we choose our dream. I never took it for granted!!!!!

I wanted to serve my country first and foremost. Everything else was a bonus.......

It is my opinion that Joey had his (Dream) shot and blew it..Life goes on!!!!!!!!

That's all well and good, but I joined to be a pilot. Period. Didn't care what service it was. I wanted to fly military aircraft and blow sh!t up. If I washed out my resignation from service would have been filed as quickly as possible. There was no way I was gonna "serve my country" as a NFO, Supply Corps O, SWO, AF vending machine stocker or whatever. I am sure there are plenty of others that feel the same way. I do applaud your dedication to serve though.

 

[Occam's Razor]

Note difference between Marine fighter pilot...and Navy patrol pilot...

 

[Bavarian Chef]

I agree, but quitting is a big deal. You know as well as I there are some days, or weeks or months, that absolutly SUCK, even as a pilot, beyond our wildest imigination of what we think "suck" is. Joey persents a big "?" as to if he would survive those times, more so then any new-be.

There are many many guys out there with ZERO military experience that deserve a chance before Joey because they have the heart to stick it out and reach their dreams.

Okay, but my point is, that he wanted to be a pilot, and he had no way of knowing he would be out on the street after the DOR (despite a sneaky suspicion). Or he could have sucked it up, been a RIO/WSO/ECMO/TACAMO etc and NEVER EVER had a chance to pursue his dream of being a pilot. Being an NFO was not one of his dreams, so I guess he wasn't willing to stick it out. And that must have been a terribly tough choice to make considering the repercussions. It did take some courage, after all.

I too joined because of a strong sense of purpose and a desire to serve my country -- in fact I have long evolved into a Naval Officer, which not every Naval Aviator is willing to due over the course of a career. In his case, he made a choice. No, I don't think he "weakened a country", and I don't begrudge him making that choice. Many pre-sub cones quit and still serve their minimum service requirements and their country.

But before this thread gets any longer than it has to be, I certainly understand that it is COMPLETELY unreasonable to expect that you will get what you want from the military as if it exists to serve you. That being said (as one who personally got his second choice at commissioning, yes aviation was my second choice, and then once again at my winging, yes F-14Ds were my second choice) their are plenty of people that join the military with some sort of guarantee -- GASP, including Marine pilots, Occam. I took what I got and loved every minute of it (okay almost every minute). All I was saying was that a comment like "kick you back to the regionals" as you sit in your 10k a month 747 job was a little harsh, considering he came to this board with more than enough humility. But your point about quitting and intestinal fortitude -- I get it. He alone has to answer to that.

And Occam, I have met PLENTY of d1ckhead self-serving Marine / Navy /AF fighter pilots in my day so no need to differentiate between patrol and pointy nose.

 

[PUCKFA18]

Guy's....we are wasting alot of energy on this. The simple fact is that JoeyC punched out (DOR) after he was commisioned, not before.... There is a BIG difference. We all know that his chances of getting selected again are .0000000001..at least in my opinion.

my .02

 

[Oh-ryan]

Note difference between Marine fighter pilot...and Navy patrol pilot...

I served with just as much pride as anyone in uniform there McFly. The point that I was trying to make is that I wanted to serve from the cockpit an nowhere else. When I saw my time in the cockpit coming to end (like it naturally does as you progress through the ranks)- I left. Proud to have served and grateful for all the military had given me. Like I said- I know plenty of other guys and gals that felt the same way and left when their flying days were numbered. Some of them were the best officers I had the honor to serve with. I see you flew "fighters"- would you have signed up to be a grunt if you couldn't be a superfantastic fighter pilot?

Oh, the other big difference is that Navy patrol pilots have much bigger wallets- from all the per diem ya know.

Now isn't there an ALPA bake sale you need to get ready for?

 

[Occam's Razor]

And Occam, I have met PLENTY of d1ckhead self-serving Marine / Navy /AF fighter pilots in my day so no need to differentiate between patrol and pointy nose.

I didn't. They did. I asked you to "Note" it.

I guess you didn't read what each of them posted.

Oh-Ryan told us: "That's all well and good, but I joined to be a pilot. Period."

Puck told us: "I wanted to serve my country first and foremost. Everything else was a bonus......."

Lemme know when you figure out the difference.

 

[Occam's Razor]

I served with just as much pride as anyone in uniform there McFly.

That wasn't my point there, McCan'tReadWell.

I pointed out the difference between what YOU posted, and what Puck posted. I think there's a difference and I think it matters. You appear to be a little threatened by that difference. I think that's entertaining.

I see you flew "fighters"- would you have signed up to be a grunt if you couldn't be a superfantastic fighter pilot?

Yes. I was an infantry officer too. 1stBn-7thMar. That puts me in the category as Puck...those who sign-on to be warriors.

Oh, the other big difference is that Navy patrol pilots have much bigger wallets- from all the per diem ya know.

FYI, Rockefeller...I'da paid them to be a Marine!

Now isn't there an ALPA bake sale you need to get ready for?

Yes, we're selling cupcakes and remedial reading textbooks for Squids who can't read for comprehension. I can get you a discount if you can prove you don't wear velcro shoelaces.

 

[Bavarian Chef]

I didn't. They did. I asked you to "Note" it.

I guess you didn't read what each of them posted.

Oh-Ryan told us: "That's all well and good, but I joined to be a pilot. Period."

Puck told us: "I wanted to serve my country first and foremost. Everything else was a bonus......."

Lemme know when you figure out the difference.

You're right I didn't read either that closely.

 

[guppygoshawk]

I wanted to fly military aircraft and blow sh!t up.

So why didn't you quit when you got P-3's? Your logic doesn't make sense. A fighter RIO/WSO blows up far more than a P-3 pilot, yet you'd have quit if put in that job?

 

[PUCKFA18]

So why didn't you quit when you got P-3's? Your logic doesn't make sense. A fighter RIO/WSO blows up far more than a P-3 pilot, yet you'd have quit if put in that job?

Ya....still scratching my head on that??? First it was I want to serve my country as a military pilot, than it's....I want to serve my country for all that per diem????

Confused????????

 

[Oh-ryan]

That wasn't my point there, McCan'tReadWell.

I pointed out the difference between what YOU posted, and what Puck posted. I think there's a difference and I think it matters. You appear to be a little threatened by that difference. I think that's entertaining.



Yes. I was an infantry officer too. 1stBn-7thMar. That puts me in the category as Puck...those who sign-on to be warriors.



FYI, Rockefeller...I'da paid them to be a Marine!



Yes, we're selling cupcakes and remedial reading textbooks for Squids who can't read for comprehension. I can get you a discount if you can prove you don't wear velcro shoelaces.

Textbooks are stupid. I like how you capitalized "Squids"- shows respect. My shoes don't have velcro shoelaces either. Those can be just as complicated as regular laces. They have elastic bands so they just stretch over my foot. If you want to see what they look like check under your mother's bed. I think I left a pair there the other night. Who doesn't love a good mother crack? Did you think it was just as "entertaining" as my first response to you? I am pretty darn funny.

Maybe you should take some reading comprehension as well. I was replying to Puck who basically told Joey that you join the military to serve first and then be a pilot. I disagree. I joined to be a pilot (a military pilot). Most of the other pilots (both round and pointy nose) I came across had the same mindset. Being a FO, grunt, SWO whatever was not what they wanted to do. I commend you for being in the trenches before taking to the skies, but for most that is not the case. Many are military pilots because that is what they "wanted to be when they grow up". Does that make them bad officers? I don't think so. Here is the tricky part- I kinda agree with Puck in that you must have a desire to serve in order to be a military pilot otherwise you will never be able to cope with some of the sh!t sandwiches you are forced to eat during your tenure. I had that desire. I had it for 11 years, but when my time in the cockpit was coming to an end, the desire to continue to serve and eat the sh!t sandwiches dwindled. I left. I am a better off and so is the navy. I am a better person because of my service and I would like to think that the navy benefited from my service. I still fly and I still wear a government uniform cause I love to fly and I still have the desire to serve.

I think it was clear that Joey too wanted to be a pilot and when that didn't work out he quit. I don't blame him. I (and many others) would have done the same thing.

Love,
Daddy Rockefeller

For Gup- true a fighter RIO/WSO may pickle off more stuff than a P-3 guy (most TACAIR FOs do), but he is still a RIO/WSO. I wanted to fly AND (not or) blow sh!t up. A RIO/WSO only blows sh!t up.

 

[Oh-ryan]

Ya....still scratching my head on that??? First it was I want to serve my country as a military pilot, than it's....I want to serve my country for all that per diem????

Confused????????

Humor and sarcasm bro. I'll work on it.

 

[kingairip]

Yes. I was an infantry officer too. 1stBn-7thMar. That puts me in the category as Puck...those who sign-on to be warriors.

Get over yourself.

 

[PUCKFA18]

Get over yourself.

Ya, you say that on here big guy...... I like to see you say that to our face. I hope you enjoy sleeping at night, being that we have provided you with safest accomidations in the world.

Sleep Well

 

[Bjammin]

All I was saying was that a comment like "kick you back to the regionals" as you sit in your 10k a month 747 job was a little harsh, considering he came to this board with more than enough humility.

Maybe that was a little harsh, drunk talk. I apologize for that. However, I think we both agree that Joey doesn't stand a chance, not only because the Navy won't take him, but if they did he would be looked down upon from all NFO's and most single anchor guys.

BTW, I put my 20 in as an enlisted seaman and officer, did 3 tours over in the sand. I deserve the 74 job. Come on over, we're hiring like mad.

Let's get over the BS pointy nose, who gets more per-diem, and who's the bigger bada$$ crap. We only make ourself's look like idiots. ANYONE who has put in anytime serving our great country deserves much respect.

 

[Bavarian Chef]

Maybe that was a little harsh, drunk talk. I apologize for that. However, I think we both agree that Joey doesn't stand a chance, not only because the Navy won't take him, but if they did he would be looked down upon from all NFO's and most single anchor guys.

BTW, I put my 20 in as an enlisted seaman and officer, did 3 tours over in the sand. I deserve the 74 job. Come on over, we're hiring like mad.

Let's get over the BS pointy nose, who gets more per-diem, and who's the bigger bada$$ crap. We only make ourself's look like idiots. ANYONE who has put in anytime serving our great country deserves much respect.

You said seaman.