Prefbid vs flightline----CDO's

[enuffalready]

Any truth that prefbid does NOT allow segregation of CDO's and regular trips. That means, as is, with prefbid you could be awarded a line with both together. I know most regular line holders hate CDO'S and most CDO holders hate regular 3/4 day trips. Sounds like lose lose and a non starter?

Anyone with info feel free to chime in. Curious..

 

[higney85]

The answer is complicated.

You can have pure CDO lines, pure regular lines, and "hybrid" lines with CDO and reg trips. It depends on the contract for CDO rules, open time constraints, etc. It also depends on how many bidders, bidders actually bidding for CDO's and the layout of pairings (some days have more/less CDO's than others).


Biggest hurdle? Contract language which dictates the programming and trip construction.

Biggest reality to learn "global feasibility". The flying needs to be flown by someone in the end, PBS finds "homes" for the trips, many times to the displeasure of a more senior pilot.

 

[enuffalready]

At LASA, you contract pros know.....we can't be awarded a hybrid line now....correct?

 

[79%N1]

The answer is complicated.

Biggest reality to learn "global feasibility". The flying needs to be flown by someone in the end, PBS finds "homes" for the trips, many times to the displeasure of a more senior pilot.

Flightline pbs does the same finding of homes for all the pairings, but DOES NOT do it at the expense of seniority as does the "global feasibility".

 

[higney85]

Flightline pbs does the same finding of homes for all the pairings, but DOES NOT do it at the expense of seniority as does the "global feasibility".

I'm not at LASA (or XJT for that matter), but am intimately familiar with the PBS program at 9E. As I said, it's ALL about the contract language. If your deal (whenever that occurs..) allows for "hybrids", the next step is limitations of how the hybrids can be designed. The bigger pieces of the puzzle become open time and daily stacking restrictions. With the new rest rules in 2014, there is actually a better leg to stand on if you are negotiating CDO's since the "default" option of CDO's won't even be legal for many CDO pairings created today. In hindsight of the PCL JCBA negotiations was the CDO allowance following a pairing. If PBS has to find a home for CDO's due to stacking, the program will literally work it's way up the seniority ranks to find someone who can do the CDO. This can be after a brutal 4-day since block on a CDO is typically very low. This was fought in negotiations,but something that didn't get cleaned up. It's something that has pilots upset, scheduling concerned (easy sick call targets and hard to cover), and the safety department looking at for the fatigue aspect.

You didn't ask for advice, but I will say that you really need to think about how the program will operate and how you can control it. The only way to do that is strong and in-depth contractual language and pilots directly controlling the PBS program and the pairing generator. If you don't have all 3 of those covered, it can be ugly for the pilot group. Remember, the job of the PBS program is to award work, nothing more. It lowers headcount and solves the "interface conflict" between months. For 9E, the program costed something like $1M at the beginning and about another $1M since in reprogramming. The company made all there money back in the first year, and saves money every year going forward. Don't be fooled, it's a company program, but with pilot control it can work well for both sides. The factor that I haven't mentioned yet, but is on a much higher level that pilots cannot negotiate, is the flying given before the generator gets to create pairings (from the major partner). It's pure junk in/junk out if the aircraft lines of flying are inefficient.

PBS is great for the top 30% in base/seat, OK from 30-60, and the bottom 60-99% will see a decrease in QOL from line bidding. "Build-ups" also cease to exist with a PBS program for those who are a senior reserve/junior line holder bidding for build-ups in a line bidding world.

 

[OCP]

I'm in the bottom 25% at LASA and quality of life is worlds better with PBS than with line bidding. Just for starters, I wouldn't even have a line with line bidding. That said I can actually control some amount of the types of trips I get, and a lot of control of specific days off.

 

[wms]

At lasa prefbid will not mix cdos into a line. You either have a CDO line or a regular line. You choose which type of line on your preferences.

 

[JumpersAway]

Everything you need to know about ExpressJet management and scheduling. If they "can", they "will". This is the exact reason the scheduling section is the thickest in the book. We have to close ALL of the loopholes and write ironclad language in the new CBA. First thing I'm doing when it's offered to us, is highlighting all the "Mays", "Discressions", and "cans"..............

People get into a rythm of CDO's or regular trips. I'm not interrested in flipping my body schedule around to accomodate ExpressJet's lack of ability to properly plan or staff our airline. The ability for this to be done is an automatic "no" vote. I'm done being scheduling's monkey here.

 

[79%N1]

Exactly! The thing where you bid 6 or 8 am reserve, and they call you up at noon and put you "back on rest" so you can now do naps is for the birds!

 

[flynd94]

Exactly! The thing where you bid 6 or 8 am reserve, and they call you up at noon and put you "back on rest" so you can now do naps is for the birds!

That's an easy fix.....call in fatigued if enough of us on both sides (erj/crj) do that then this terrible practice will come to a quick stop.