Pinnacle vs Mesaba

[flap operator]

FOs cannot change equipment, however if you didn't have the opportunity to upgrade after 3 years one can at that point, change equipment. Any position change between equipment is subject to another seat lock of 2 years.

Alot of this is going on right now... mostly saab pilots bidding to the avro for a change of pace. There is no wage incentive, but over all pay might be a bit less. Saab schedules are generally more productive and lucrative.


FO

 

[Flyer1015]

FOs cannot change equipment, however if you didn't have the opportunity to upgrade after 3 years one can at that point, change equipment. Any position change between equipment is subject to another seat lock of 2 years.

Alot of this is going on right now... mostly saab pilots bidding to the avro for a change of pace. There is no wage incentive, but over all pay might be a bit less. Saab schedules are generally more productive and lucrative.


FO

Oh okay. So if most junior Saab Capt has 5 years of seniority, then you could technically move from Saab F/O to Avro F/O after 3 years. .. Seat lock for another 2 years, and then could either hold Saab Capt, or stick it out for Avro Captain?

Did I get that right?

 

[xjcaptain]

Right on the money. Clear as mud.

 

[Flyer1015]

Thanks.


Just curious, is the three-year F/O position lock something that came up in the new contract, or has that been around since the previous one?

 

[Mel Sharples]

Thanks.


Just curious, is the three-year F/O position lock something that came up in the new contract, or has that been around since the previous one?

Not new. The only thing that is new is if a captain voluntarily bids back to F/O, there is a two year seat lock. Used to be no seat lock (probably an oversight by the company). But the F/O lock is the same as it has always been. That was their "justification" for the blended F/O pay rate.

 

[Crizz]

Not true... Just had a new hire transfer from DTW to MSP before their green line was even awarded... I think they were maybe a month out of training... Granted they are straight reserve in MSP, but it was much shorter than 6 months.

Clarify that... that was a Saab FO. If you are awarded the jet you have a LONG line of people in front of you to get to MSP. You should expect 1-1.5 years just to hold Minneapolis. I have gone through 2 bid cycles, and I cant even hold DTW in the avro yet, let alone MSP.

 

[Mel Sharples]

Not true... Just had a new hire transfer from DTW to MSP before their green line was even awarded... I think they were maybe a month out of training... Granted they are straight reserve in MSP, but it was much shorter than 6 months.

Keep in mind that the award date and the effective date are not one in the same. Even after getting the award, all F/O's have done a month or two in a foreign land. But it is nice to see it is going quicker than it has since 9-11.

And yes, that is only for the Saab. If you are on the Avro, God be with you. It's gonna be a while until you make it back up north.

 

[CubanSmoker]

Well said Mel!

I've been here just under a year now and there are 8 to 10 guys between me and the most junior Avro FO in MSP. I'm based in CVG and commute out of MSP. If I see MSP two years from now, I'll be happy. That maybe a little pessimistic, but more realistic than the newhire in my crashpad that was told he could home MSP Avro FO in 3 months from some guy in the training dept.

About a year ago, a bunch of new hires got MSP in the Avro fairly quickly. Now that it has slowed to a trickle, the senior Saab FO's that want a change of scenery move over to the Avro and have a nice cushion of junior guys to soak up the reserve lines... It's their seniority, they've earned it, more power to them.

I left a much better paying, left seat 135/91 corporate gig to come here for better QOL. I still am very happy here and our work rules are great compared to other regionals.

To answer the original post, if you were to go back in time a year ago and deciding on XJ or 9E, I would have said go to Pinnacle. I have 3 friends that did and they are all CA's based in MSP. But now that their growth is quickly slowing, I'd try for Mesaba. You're not upgrading anytime soon so why not try for better work rules & pay (especially during training)?



Cheers

 

[Workin'Stiff]

Keep in mind that the award date and the effective date are not one in the same. Even after getting the award, all F/O's have done a month or two in a foreign land. But it is nice to see it is going quicker than it has since 9-11.

And yes, that is only for the Saab. If you are on the Avro, God be with you. It's gonna be a while until you make it back up north.

I stand behind what I said. However, I should have clarified alittle more. Yes, it was a Saab FO and I am fully aware of the differences between award date and effective date. Alittle more info would have cleared that misconception up real nicely.

 

[DetoXJ]

Lately, a lot of the MSP Avro FO slots have been awarded to senior Saab FO's. I have flown with a lot of Avro FO's with 1+ years who are nowhere close to holding MSP. The lineup is long and the few vacancies that open up in MSP will more than likely be filled with senior MSP Saab FO's who will bid over.

Of course I'm biased, but I think Mesaba has much better pilot group. The stuff I witness on a daily basis (From Pinnacle Pilots) is flat out disappointing, concerning and embarassing.