Pinnacle Hiring Restrictions

[Flyer1015]

Before the Oct '04 accident, Pinnacle hired new pilots with about 500 TT, mostly through flight academies.

Now, their minimums are 1000TT/200ME.

Is it true that there is an insurance restriction on Pinnacle that does not allow them to hire anyone with 500TT through flight academies?

 

[LoweringTheBar]

I've heard the same rumor.

 

[edge540t72]

...?hunh?

Pinnacle has ALWAYS had 1000 and 200, I think thye used to go to accademies and hired in that way, they may have stopped, or desire not to take the low time guys. There posted mins have always been this though.

 

[Flyer1015]

Pinnacle has ALWAYS had 1000 and 200, I think thye used to go to accademies and hired in that way, they may have stopped, or desire not to take the low time guys. There posted mins have always been this though.

No they didn't. It used to be 1500TT / 300 ME, and at the same time, they took 500 hr pilots (quite a few from Gulfstream), and some from other academies.

My question is though... it seems that Pinnacle no longer has any "hiring/interview" ties with any academy. So, is this due to an insurance requirement for hiring pilots?

 

[Mtnjam]

I Love Daddy

Actually for those of you have Have Super Daddy to come to the rescue you can plan your Lovely Airline Career with Pinchanickel Airlines!!!! A Capt. friend of mine here told me that just the other day he flew with an F.O. that had 280 hrs. total time, even after IOE was done!!!
But this F.O. Was a Super Pilot because he went to that program at ERAU that makes you fly like Chuck Yeager, therefore to get a job at an airline no experience is required!! Plus the guy already had a DC-9 Type!!! All from ERAU!!! So those of you who need that airline job and have Super Dad, give him a call and Enroll now!!!
Oh by the way Don't worry about learning how to speak on the Radio, we'll teach you that here at Pinnacle!! All you have to do is learn how to play that big video game called a DC-9 Sim and a CRJ/200 Sim and life is all good!! Oh yeah and remember some stuff like memory items and limitations!!! Boy oh Boy if the Pax only knew what was sitting in the Front Seat of that Jet!!! Come on down we need more Super Pilots at Pinnacle!!!!

 

[finnjl]

I find that very hard to believe. (280 hour FO) I think that may be BS. Unless I personally knew the guy I would not believe that. I think Pinnacle is getting more qualified folks. They have been attracting FOs from other Regional Airlines because of the quick upgrades. Of course we all know that has changed but I think since they are paying per diem and hotel plus bonus when checkride is complete they will start seeing a significate increase in pilots with more flying experience applying.

 

[Tank Commander]

Mtnjam, I'm in DTW. Where are you?

 

[BOHICAgain]

Actually for those of you have Have Super Daddy to come to the rescue you can plan your Lovely Airline Career with Pinchanickel Airlines!!!! A Capt. friend of mine here told me that just the other day he flew with an F.O. that had 280 hrs. total time, even after IOE was done!!!
But this F.O. Was a Super Pilot because he went to that program at ERAU that makes you fly like Chuck Yeager, therefore to get a job at an airline no experience is required!! Plus the guy already had a DC-9 Type!!! All from ERAU!!! So those of you who need that airline job and have Super Dad, give him a call and Enroll now!!!
Oh by the way Don't worry about learning how to speak on the Radio, we'll teach you that here at Pinnacle!! All you have to do is learn how to play that big video game called a DC-9 Sim and a CRJ/200 Sim and life is all good!! Oh yeah and remember some stuff like memory items and limitations!!! Boy oh Boy if the Pax only knew what was sitting in the Front Seat of that Jet!!! Come on down we need more Super Pilots at Pinnacle!!!!

Really because a freind of mine said that this super daddy rented a pinnacle CRJ so his son could do his commercial multi check ride. and the kicker is his son only had 150 HOURS!!!!. I couldnt believe it but i read it on the internet so it must be true. O yeah also his super daddy actually got a waiver to allow his 16 year old sonto get a commercial ticket so this is on lucky teenage boy.
You guys really think they FAA would allow a 280 TT to be seated at the right seat..Hell some Insurance companies wont allow a CFI to instruct in a C172 until the CFI has like 750TT

 

[logolight]

Another thing to add in case you guys didn't know yet. I talked to a buddy last night who has an interview lined up later in the month. He says Pinnacle is requiring the ATP written again for the interview.

 

[UZAInstructor]

Really because a freind of mine said that this super daddy rented a pinnacle CRJ so his son could do his commercial multi check ride. and the kicker is his son only had 150 HOURS!!!!. I couldnt believe it but i read it on the internet so it must be true. O yeah also his super daddy actually got a waiver to allow his 16 year old sonto get a commercial ticket so this is on lucky teenage boy.
You guys really think they FAA would allow a 280 TT to be seated at the right seat..Hell some Insurance companies wont allow a CFI to instruct in a C172 until the CFI has like 750TT

If you can show me the reg the FAA would use to keep that 280tt guy out of the right seat............

The FAA has no say over that. If he's got the multi-commercial, and Pinnacle decides to hire him at 280, he'll be in the right seat.

 

[Tank Commander]

As long as the underwriter aproves it. They had heart burn over 500 hrs F/O's

 

[BOHICAgain]

If you can show me the reg the FAA would use to keep that 280tt guy out of the right seat............

The FAA has no say over that. If he's got the multi-commercial, and Pinnacle decides to hire him at 280, he'll be in the right seat.

I meant to say the insurance companies sorry I just saw that I wrote the FAA down...

 

[Mtnjam]

No B.S.

I'm not Pulling legs on this one guys............. I also flew with a Check Airman the other day that said he just finished IOE on a girl that went through the same Program. Don't ask me how they get these guys in the R. seat? I have no clue. Do some research. I guarantee this is for real.

 

[FO4life]

This is the kicker! I have 2000Hrs with ATP and LR-JET type, Applyed with pinnacle last yr and Still not called. However a 500hr pilot flying rt seat.
Thats me God's hacky sac.

 

[135fr8r]

You guys really think they FAA would allow a 280 TT to be seated at the right seat..Hell some Insurance companies wont allow a CFI to instruct in a C172 until the CFI has like 750TT

280 hrs, 500 hrs, 800 hrs Hell, what's the difference?

 

[Lear70]

MTNJam is 100% correct.

I have flown with pilots right in the 300 hour +/- range. One was the only time I've had to take an aircraft away from a pilot at this company in 5 years.

There may be some great pilots out there with 500 hours, but I'm happier when the guy or gal in the right seat has about 1,500 hours and some 121 or 135 experience prior to coming hear flying freight or whatever... Makes it easier to rely on the information they're giving you, fly the aircraft when you have other things to do (such as the many nuisance abnormals we run into around here), and, God forbid, take care of you and your pax in case you have a medical emergency.

Wouldn't happen you say? Do some research, pilots become incapacitated because of kidney stones, food poisoning, and stroke/heart attack every day. Happened to my dad about 7 years ago flying PIT-SFO - the F/O had to divert into LAS.

Low time = bad.

 

[satlol]

Sounds like all the interviews scheduled for next year are for real...as of today, all Dec. 1 displacements have been cancelled due to "increase of nwa flying and higher than expected attrition"...only 3 more years and the 280 hr wonder child can upgrade...gosh relax

 

[Flyer1015]

As long as the underwriter aproves it. They had heart burn over 500 hrs F/O's

That's what my original question was.

So if there are 280-500 hour pilots at the company, then I guess the insurance company is "allowing" it.

 

[Tank Commander]

If Lear70 say so, I guess thier is. I was a 500hr. wonder child. satlol, I up grade this year.

 

[Lear70]

Sounds like all the interviews scheduled for next year are for real...as of today, all Dec. 1 displacements have been cancelled due to "increase of nwa flying and higher than expected attrition"...only 3 more years and the 280 hr wonder child can upgrade...gosh relax

That's not EXACTLY what the memo says...

Pinnacle Flight Operations management has informed the MEC that the displacement scheduled for December 1 will be cancelled.

Another displacement is being planned for January 1 that will affect fourteen Captains. We do not know at this time which bases will be impacted.

The December 1 displacement is being cancelled due to some additional flying from Northwest and higher than expected attrition.

So, in a nutshell, the company has POSTPONED and REDUCED the number of displacements. They MIGHT go away entirely, but I believe it depends on how many people leave in December - if we have another month of a bunch of Captains leaving,,,

If Lear70 say so, I guess thier is. I was a 500hr. wonder child. satlol, I upgrade this year.

Actualy, you're the lowest time guy I've flown with in a while.

The lowest time ever was the guy from Gulfstream who had a problem keeping his hands off the girls and was about to get fired so he quit (he's also the guy I took the airplane from) but that was back in 2004.

Since then two girls from Crew Scheduling have come over with around 300 hours and that was early 2005.

Haven't seen any extremely low (less than 500 hour) pilots in the last 8-10 months.

Don't mean any offense Tank, and I'm glad you're here and I've enjoyed flying with you, but I've been saying for a long time that the FAA needs to have a Part 121 minimum flight time limit higher than just "Commerical License" minimums.

Personally, I'd be happy to see an ATP certificate required (which would require 1,500 hours total time), and would have the added benefit of probably reducing the number of people who flock to the "buy-a-job" flight schools, but that's just me.

Opinions vary...

 

[BOOYA]

This is the kicker! I have 2000Hrs with ATP and LR-JET type, Applyed with pinnacle last yr and Still not called. However a 500hr pilot flying rt seat.
Thats me God's hacky sac.

That's because they think guys like you and me with the extra 1K hours are disgruntled because we aren't flyin a 757 now! It's not our fault, the industry owes us at least that. Did I forget to mention Left seat?

 

[turbinej]

ERAU grads at PCL

Yes, we have 250tt guys coming through. I flew with one directly out of college. These individuals are from ERAU w approximately 250 tt in airplane. in addition to this they get 200 hrs MD-90 sim time. So say 450tt. This is the airline training that ERAU offers. The guy maybe had 25 hours in an actual multi engine airplane before coming to pinnacle besides his MD-90 sim time.

 

[OUT]

That's just plain wrong.

 

[edge540t72]

over the top

I can personally say that I have advanced faster than I should, I'm 21 and meet most reginal mins. Flying larger aircraft to early in your carrer makes you not appreciate it. IE I went to a big school with lots of nice planes, I came back and worked at an FBO I respect nice aircraft and hard work soo much more than I use to. All I wanted to do was go fly an RJ when I really wasn't ready. I think there is something to say for the growing up you do as a professional pilot by flying a Cessna 152 every day for a few months.

And the harder you have to work for it you really respect it a little more

just 2 cents

 

[dondk]

in-house programs.. they have gone under 300TT but wanted 75 ME or better. Not all of those made it, and some are still waiting for a class date (some have waited over a year)

141 programs... What Lear70 and others are saying are true.. again under 300TT but those are few and far between. Maybe 1 or 2 per class and some class sizes have had 30.

GIA program.. still a handful coming through that program...

Lately.. I have seen more CFI's than freight dogs and corp pilots. Most of the CFI's have better than 1000TT with some in the 2000+ range.

The one thing that I found intersting is that those with experience are lasting about 6 months before moving on.

Those that came from those 141 programs/GIA are lasting about the same and moving to another regional that they did not qualify for when they came to Pinnacle.

Nonconnah is aware of the revolving door, although they don't have an answer. It is so bad that we actually have people leaving in the middle of OE or within in days of completion.

 

[Lear70]

The one thing that I found intersting is that those with experience are lasting about 6 months before moving on.

Those that came from those 141 programs/GIA are lasting about the same and moving to another regional that they did not qualify for when they came to Pinnacle.

Nonconnah is aware of the revolving door, although they don't have an answer. It is so bad that we actually have people leaving in the middle of OE or within in days of completion.

ROFLMAO !!

GOOD! Let management see that the QOL is so bad even NEW HIRES ON PROBATION leave after the company just spent $15k to $20k on them for training.

Buddy C is smart enough to put the two together, although I don't know if any good will come of it, but it would be an amusing negotiating session:

"Well, maybe YOU think the current contract is good, but HOW much money have we spent on pilots who don't even stay here a YEAR before they find a better job?" *snicker*

 

[PCL_128]

I just flew with one of the ERAU CAPT program grads a few days ago. He certainly lacked the experience and needed help with some minor stuff, but overall he was a pretty good FO. I believe we currently have 4 CAPT grads on line with more on the way.

 

[pilotdiscretion]

About 18 months ago Pinnacle Airlines began an aggressive program to start a second certificate and gain more regional flying from other carriers. They held them selves out to be the lowest cost operator with high operational reliability and a great safety record. It was easy to hide the poor operating conditions due to no infrastructure. It was easy to hide reliability failures with the excuse of weather. It was not easy to hide an aircraft wreckage in Missouri. Not to worry there was a plan. But that plan failed and this mess started when the NTSB bared the New York public relations firm from joining the accident investigation or those assholes from ALPA showing the companies total lack of safety culture, safety programs or experienced pilots.

Plan B. Admit failures and blame everyone else for them. The first step was an aggressive media campaign against ALPA. ALPA held up safety programs for political gain. Step two. Show the world you have to be qualified and experienced to fly a Pinnacle Airplane with a national recruitment campaign.

These numbers mean nothing to you and me. They are nothing but image enhancement for a company that is still aggressively pursuing other flying.

 

[Enterprise]

I too have flown with one of the ERAU CAPT grads. I also just flew with a FO that had been here less than 3 months and 8 of his classmates were already gone.

 

[CL600Pilot]

This is the kicker! I have 2000Hrs with ATP and LR-JET type, Applyed with pinnacle last yr and Still not called. However a 500hr pilot flying rt seat.
Thats me God's hacky sac.

You should send a thank you note to the HR staff at Pinnacle! You can't even imagine the magnatude of the favor they've done you by not calling. Take your corporate experience and get a real job. Trust me, and all of us on this board, being at Pinnacle(especially right now) is NOT a job to be upset about not having!


CL