Pinnacle finally gets fair with AA over jumpseating..

[igneousy2]

They should change the name of this board from the "Regional Board" to the "Children's Board".

My rule has always been...and always will be...if you make it past the gate agent and you're not a twit when you check in then you are welcome aboard.

I have noticed over the years a diminishing of the "priviledge" aspect of the jumpseat. Whether or not you have a seat in the back...you check in with the Captain and ask for a ride.

I am not sure what your jumpseat committee is trying to accomplish with this. Other than piss off a relative hand full of commuters that happen to rely on Pinnacle for their commute only bad things can come of this. Eventually you may get unlimited jumpseats on AA or not, but this would have had nothing to do with it. The only thing that is likely to happen is one or more of your pilots will end up left at the gate somewhere because they will happen to run into one of the few pissed off AA pilots that rely on Pinnacle for their commutes.

AMR uses the jumpseat as a bargaining chip during negotiations and I can gurantee you that this is very far down the list of priorities.

Good luck

 

[qratez]

They should change the name of this board from the "Regional Board" to the "Children's Board".

My rule has always been...and always will be...if you make it past the gate agent and you're not a twit when you check in then you are welcome aboard.

I have noticed over the years a diminishing of the "priviledge" aspect of the jumpseat. Whether or not you have a seat in the back...you check in with the Captain and ask for a ride.

I am not sure what your jumpseat committee is trying to accomplish with this. Other than piss off a relative hand full of commuters that happen to rely on Pinnacle for their commute only bad things can come of this. Eventually you may get unlimited jumpseats on AA or not, but this would have had nothing to do with it. The only thing that is likely to happen is one or more of your pilots will end up left at the gate somewhere because they will happen to run into one of the few pissed off AA pilots that rely on Pinnacle for their commutes.

AMR uses the jumpseat as a bargaining chip during negotiations and I can gurantee you that this is very far down the list of priorities.

Good luck

This has to be the one of the dumbest post I have read on Flight info in a long time. I rarely post, but I could not let this one slide. First off, get over yourself. If the regional boards are so childish then why are you reading/posting on them. Secondly, if an AA pilot gets left somewhere because Pinnacle has the exact same jumpseat agreement with AA that AA has with Pinnacle then that is just too ****** bad.

Please don't take this the wrong way. This is nothing personal with any AA pilot. I truly hate it has come to this, but this has gone on way too long. Just remember if you have to use Pinnacle it might be a good idea to carry an ID 90 pass just in case.

 

[JoeMerchant]

APA pilots-

When I was a jumpseat chairman a few years ago there were problems. You guys are worse than the DAL guys getting unlimited on CMR and ASA only to have this childish one jumpseat one jumpseater rule in return....

It all comes down to this.....

How much negotiating capital do you want to use on an industry standard jumpseat agreement....

It really rubs regional guys against the grain when you can fly open time making extra cabbage and still make your kids dance recital, knowing you can use unlimited on a CRJ, whereas, the regional guy can't pick up open time or misses Johnny's ball game or both because he knows the AA chances are slim...

Quit spending negotiating capital on yourselves while gaining benefits from others. The lame excuses like "its out of our hands" are weak.

Get your house in order....

Stop the presses! The world is about to end....I actually agree with something Rez O. Lewshun said!

 

[skidbuggy]

Thank goodness for Air Canada; they've been great at getting me to the Great White North!

Amen Brother!!

 

[NTS ALL 4]

I am not going to take it up with anyone, I don't jumpseat on Pinnacle anymore.

I read the letter very carefully. I am also reading a bunch of posters get giddying about sticking it to AA pilots on their jumpseat.

AA


Maybe you should read some of the other posts on here, I love the one calling the AA FO a biaatch.

Some classy guys you have over there.

I often wondered why everyone calls AA "the Sky Nazis".

Thank you for removing all doubt.

NTS

 

[sinkrate]

real professional.. did you call him a biaatch as well. You do know that AA management is the one the controls the jumpseat. APA can request and AA can deny. APA is in the middle of contract negotiations, sick time time issues, pay issues, one of the highest amount of grievances ever, and you would like us to use negotiating capital to get you additional seats.

Calling AA unreliable is funny, as numerous pilots including myself in the past could never make it on a restricted Pinnacle flight, and now AA pilots get to enjoy Mesaba agents who could care less about jumpseaters.

I can tell you when thing, this started a real ******************** storm, in the end you all may have more to loose than AA pilots

Last but not least taking it out on individual jumpseaters who do not control this is an unprofessional way to go. You can be sure it is getting around of here, and unfortunately some unlike myself are going to stick it back.

AA does Int'l differently and will not break things up for jumpseaters for Pinnacle pilots. Unlimited may be in option if AA approves it.

One thing is for certain, if threats are made and jumpseats agreements are taken away. They are not going to come back here.

Careful what you wish for, you may just get it.

Regards,

AAflyer

For many years Pinnacle has had a history of extending unlimited jumpseat privileges to any pilot that had an Air Carrier ID. No matter what that carriers reciprical poilicy towards us was. When Delta's JS was closed to everyone we took everyone of their pilots that walked up to our gate. When FedEx's JS was closed to everyone we still took them everytime. When our own code share partner, NWA dicriminated against us and would only take one of our pilots, and then only if no other 121 carrier pilot requested the jumpseat, we still extended unlimited seats to them.

The difference between these carriers and AMR is these pilot groups all worked for us and eventually Pinnacle pilots were extended the same unlimited benefits on those carriers that we extend to them. AMR and APA however have told us, repeatedly, for years, it will never happen. All we will ever have is the policy that AMR currently has in place. If that is the case Pinnacle is going to extend the same reciprocal benefit to APA that they extend to us. It is not a war.

It is not done with hostility but with great hesitation, deliberation and dismay. It is the first time the Pinnacle Jumpseat Committe has not been able to secure the same benefits on a carrier that we extend to them. That Committee has been very, very effective. It has secured more Reciprocal Agreements than most 'major' carriers have.

 

[SBD]

Quick question, does the one jumpseater apply to PCL only? Because I've used American numerous times out of JFK to get home and there were Freedom guys, a DL F.A. and myself all on the flight with seats.

 

[snap145]

I realize we need to look at the "big picture" here but I am a Pinnacle pilot who has had Eagle and AA guys in the jumpseat numerous times and the one time I rode AA mainline from Minny to OHare, it was the best jumpseating experience I have had to date...Captain put me in First class....made sure I was taken care of the second I walked on board...this whole thing seems a bit over the top to me...but I understand where our MEC is coming from at the same time...

 

[flyboyike]

One thing is for certain, if threats are made and jumpseats agreements are taken away. They are not going to come back here.

IOW, it's only OK for the mainliners to make threats and treat people like ********************, because you fly real airplanes, right?

BTW, were you aware that Pinnacle pilots are also in negotiations? Or are your negotiations better than their negotiations?

 

[Mr Mojo]

Could an AA pilot please post who you offer unlimited to?

Just to name a couple of regionals; sky west, republic, xjt. NOT a complete list.

 

[AAflyer]

IOW, it's only OK for the mainliners to make threats and treat people like ********************, because you fly real airplanes, right?

BTW, were you aware that Pinnacle pilots are also in negotiations? Or are your negotiations better than their negotiations?

Actually according to my friend over there, it is the Pinnacle Pilots who will pull the plug on our reciprocal jumpseat agreement, later this fall if they do not get what they want. At this point whatever, like one of your pilots said. I don't care anymore.

I am very aware that you are in negotiations, and truly hope you get a great contract.

I have seen pilots work against each other and in the end both parties are unhappy. No threats on this end just explaining it as I have seen it in the past.

Where in the world did I say anything about real airplanes? A C-172 is a real airplane. The only reason I am here and you are there is my age and timing... If that is your way of sticking it me in your post and it makes you feel better, good for you.

I am done with this thread. I wish you all the best.

AAflyer "former commuter,regional, supplemental pilot who is not better than anyone else"

 

[MACH-TUCK]

I am not going to take it up with anyone, I don't jumpseat on Pinnacle anymore.

I read the letter very carefully. I am also reading a bunch of posters get giddying about sticking it to AA pilots on their jumpseat.

AA


Maybe you should read some of the other posts on here, I love the one calling the AA FO a biaatch.

Some classy guys you have over there.

deleted......

 

[flyboyike]

Actually according to my friend over there, it is the Pinnacle Pilots who will pull the plug on our reciprocal jumpseat agreement, later this fall if they do not get what they want. At this point whatever, like one of your pilots said. I don't care anymore.

I am very aware that you are in negotiations, and truly hope you get a great contract.

I have seen pilots work against each other and in the end both parties are unhappy. No threats on this end just explaining it as I have seen it in the past.

Where in the world did I say anything about real airplanes? A C-172 is a real airplane. The only reason I am here and you are there is my age and timing... If that is your way of sticking it me in your post and it makes you feel better, good for you.

I am done with this thread. I wish you all the best.

AAflyer "former commuter,regional, supplemental pilot who is not better than anyone else"

For the record, I'm not a Pinnacle pilot, I'm just tired of hearing how a mainliner's problem is always worse than an RJ guy's problem.

 

[N813CA]

I have nothing against American.

 

[e=mc2]

Once again the scrimp Dick Pinnacle pilots show why they are the sewer of the industry. Having this discussion on an anonymous board - Scrimp. Thinking that leaving people behind proves anything - Scrimp.

At this point with all the BS you airline pucks have to deal with seems screwing you buddy would be low on the list.

I concur – our company will not fly on Pinnacle.

 

[BoilerUP]

I really don't see the need for all the emotion.

Company P offers unlimited jumpseats to Company A, yet Company A does not reciprocate after years of requests. Company P, tired of their pilots being left behind due to Company A's policies, decides to restrict the benefit provided to Company A to the exact same policy Company A provides them.

And somehow, this newfound equality is starting "a war"?

This is the exact same nonsense BS that went on when UAX pilots sent a letter to the UAL MEC asking them to get their jumpseat priority straightened out last year...UAL pilots jumped up and down and cried bloody hell and made all sorts of threats toward UAX pilots, talking about how they weren't in control but management was and that "this will hurt you more than it will us", when all those UAX pilots wanted was the same benefit from UAL pilots that they were provided.

Some of you people really need to stop acting so butthurt when the playing field gets leveled, and work TOGETHER for everyone's mutual benefit.

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

I really don't see the need for all the emotion.

Company P offers unlimited jumpseats to Company A, yet Company A does not reciprocate after years of requests. Company P, tired of their pilots being left behind due to Company A's policies, decides to restrict the benefit provided to Company A to the exact same policy Company A provides them.

And somehow, this newfound equality is starting "a war"?

Agreed...

This is the exact same nonsense BS that went on when UAX pilots sent a letter to the UAL MEC asking them to get their jumpseat priority straightened out last year...UAL pilots jumped up and down and cried bloody hell and made all sorts of threats toward UAX pilots, talking about how they weren't in control but management was and that "this will hurt you more than it will us", when all those UAX pilots wanted was the same benefit from UAL pilots that they were provided.

.

Not true....


The issue at UAL was not that the UAL pilots refused reciprocity....

It was a software issue with Apollo. The UAX pilots expected the UAL pilots to solve the problem for them... instead of the UAX pilots getting together and working with the UAL pilots to confront UAL IT dept, the UAX pilots threaten the UAL pilots...

Much different than the APA pilots providing unlimited to one regional pilots group and not affording the same to another....

 

[rtmcfi]

Agreed...

Not true....


The issue at UAL was not that the UAL pilots refused reciprocity....

It was a software issue with Apollo. The UAX pilots expected the UAL pilots to solve the problem for them... instead of the UAX pilots getting together and working with the UAL pilots to confront UAL IT dept, the UAX pilots threaten the UAL pilots...

The UAX jumpseat coordinators tried for quite some time to get the UAL Pilots (By pilots I mean jumpseat commitee types, as by and large the average UAL pilot had no clue this was going on) to work with their company to fix the problem. The UAL pilots had no real reason to cooperate, as the status quo benefitted them. So, the didn't put forth any effort to fix the problem till it started to negativly impact them. After the UAX pilots took measured action, the non-commuting UAL JS coordinator took heat from the average line pilots at UAL. The problem was then quickly solved.

Much different than the APA pilots providing unlimited to one regional pilots group and not affording the same to another..

While the problem may not be the same, the cure is identical. Simply, make the average AA pilot aware of the situation, perhaps by making them miss out on a ride to/from work. They will let the JS coordinator know their displeasure. JSC will then lean on AMR to fix the problem.

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

The UAX jumpseat coordinators tried for quite some time to get the UAL Pilots (By pilots I mean jumpseat commitee types, as by and large the average UAL pilot had no clue this was going on) to work with their company to fix the problem. The UAL pilots had no real reason to cooperate, as the status quo benefitted them.

Explain why the UAL pilots were obligated to do anything. Where was the UAL pilots responsibility?

This was an issue between the regional carriers, regional pilots and their contract company.

So, the didn't put forth any effort to fix the problem till it started to negativly impact them. After the UAX pilots took measured action, the non-commuting UAL JS coordinator took heat from the average line pilots at UAL. The problem was then quickly solved.

No, the UAL coordinator did not take heat from line pilots... The UAX pilots simply used an unprofessional tactic and the UAL pilots to get what they wanted from UAL corp.

While the problem may not be the same, the cure is identical. Simply, make the average AA pilot aware of the situation, perhaps by making them miss out on a ride to/from work. They will let the JS coordinator know their displeasure. JSC will then lean on AMR to fix the problem.

Doubt it.... but we'll see...

 

[BoilerUP]

Rez, I'm kinda surprised you think pilots who seek 'self-help' to compel issue resolution is "unprofessional".