Pinnacle Air Services

[slickmagneto]

1. Hotels: If you can't find a hotel on your own you have no business flying a jet.
2. Staying in the same hotel: If you can't get your @ss out of bed and to work by yourself you won't hold a job anywhere.
3.OT: I doubt anyone employed by either company has the b@lls to email Wynn and say "I'm not coming to work if you don't pay OT.
4.Seniority: If you are senior you should be able to bid any position, aircraft and any base that you are qualified for.
5.Pay: Payscales should be published because everyone would know where they stand.
and MOST important
6. Lav service: I use clean water and lemon scented bleach.

 

[starcheckdriver]

3.OT: I doubt anyone employed by either company has the b@lls to email Wynn and say "I'm not coming to work if you don't pay OT.

You may be right about that....BUT, many pilots (including myself) have refused to fly on a scheduled day off unless they pay the overtime. I, and others, have told the CP and the DO directly on the phone that I am refusing to fly on a day off without the pay. The end result in most of these cases was the company paid the overtime. In addition, I have refused to fly on a day off even with an offer of overtime because I had other plans. My attitude is that the company needs to get the schedules and crew swaps done without a hinderance to my off time. Any problems that arise with that is Jetride's problem, not mine. If I have nothing going on, I'll work for the overtime. If I have other commitments, forget it!

No one is saying they won't ever fly if the overtime goes away. They are saying they won't fly on a scheduled day off without overtime pay. I never have and I never will. And I guarantee that I speak for many regarding this matter.

 

[slickmagneto]

The old school at PA was if you were called you had better show or you would be fired on the spot. That may not be the case now. We will have to wait and see what changes come into play. Don't think for one minute that I'm endorsing flying OT or days off without pay or other types of compensation. I think the min. should be $400.a day and you should have the right of refusal based on seniority. Hopefully the changes will come sooner than later.

 

[AirplanesSuck]

I'm surprised more people didn't leave that environment. There are too many companies treating their pilots very well (some better than they deserve, IMO) for someone to sit around and take that kind of abuse. Come in on your day off or you're fired??? You kidding me? You guys serfs or something?

It doesn't take "balls" to tell Wynn or our DO or CP what we think. Jetride isn't the wild west... the management has made sure of that. Many of us at JR have told management "no" to working days off. Just like many said "no" to this per diem system just yet. Why do you think they pushed it back? Discourse and communication... not balls. It's about respect. They show us respect... we respectfully and thoughtfully share our doubts about certain things. It's not bitching.

And on the hotel issue, I think we can all find rooms on our own. The complaints/questions arose from other issues related to the PA system. The JR CP told me that most of the PA guys seem happy with it, so he wants to trust that it will work. The whole priceline thing seems sketchy to me. And when not using that site, I've been keeping track of the hotel room prices through FBO's and even directly off the hotel sites, and it hasn't been favorable for a $141 setup per day. Some days it's really cheap for a good hotel, and some days it's way overpriced for a rathole. I guess it evens out over time (i.e. weeks, months). But, last week we had a string of "low per diem cities" with overpriced hotels and restaurants each night. We would have lost big.

 

[CFI4LIFE]

I'm happy to hear that you agree with us on this point Slick, from your previous post it didn't seem that way. I'm not about screwing the company, but flying on my time off without compensation is flat out wrong. If I had worked for a company that had the attitude of "you better or else," I think I'd make the decision for them a choose "or else."

The point of all this is being lost though. Wynn and the Jetride team are not your typical 135 scumbag. I choose to do whats best for the company because they choose to do whats best for us. I'm not saying all things are great, but I am very happy with my job. I've had offers and opportunities to leave, but I choose to stay because of the individuals running the joint and think we have a pretty good thing going.

Hopefully all this is just going to be a spring board to get the Pinnacle guys up to the Jetride level and then we can truly work as one voice to continually make improvements for all.

 

[Rokit88]

1. Hotels: If you can't find a hotel on your own you have no business flying a jet.
2. Staying in the same hotel: If you can't get your @ss out of bed and to work by yourself you won't hold a job anywhere.
3.OT: I doubt anyone employed by either company has the b@lls to email Wynn and say "I'm not coming to work if you don't pay OT.
4.Seniority: If you are senior you should be able to bid any position, aircraft and any base that you are qualified for.
5.Pay: Payscales should be published because everyone would know where they stand.
and MOST important
6. Lav service: I use clean water and lemon scented bleach.

1. I'm flying your 8 million dollar jet for you. You can find me a hotel. I can do lots of things on my own. It doesn't mean I cant.
2. Staying together builds crew cohesion. Simple as that. Its not getting out of bed, its getting to the AP in a timely fashion when the Motel 6s one van is busted.
3. We at JR have always been told that "Your days off are sacred" We will not force you to work them. We've done a crew swap for a one day over trip because the crewman coming off had plans.
4. Seniority has never bothered me. As long as someone higher cant come in and force me out of my base, than I'm fine.
5. Publish the PAYSCALE! We beaten this horse for so long thats its jerky.
6. you carry lemon bleach in the airplane?


3.

 

[osy007]

Ok, so the next conference call is next friday.....
I think that we should all come to an agreement on what questions to ask and keep the conference going in our direction. I think that we need to come up with a list of questions for the call and have one person or few, ask from a list we create here.

From viewing the thread lately, I feel it should go like this.
1. Seniority # --strict adherence when bidding on positions
2. Pay scale
3. OT pay---across the board for everyone..Without being forced to work OT.
4. Hotels---????????

If the $50 day pay existed on the old Jetride side as it does on the old Pinnacle side. I would be fine with selecting my own hotel. But other than that, I dont think it works for me. I fly mostly in the northeast, it's pretty expensive up here.

 

[starcheckdriver]

Will someone ask about future bases i.e changes to existing bases and addition of new ones, and ask about replacement aircaft in LCK, ONT and LNS? I know the "Big 4" and Wynn were supposed to discuss bases this past week. And, they are probably tired of hearing me ask about it on every call.

 

[AirplanesSuck]

I'm on it. None of them like me anyway. I'm making a list of queries for the boyz in Buckeye and Wal-Mart lands.

We also need a team of covert operatives to infiltrate the physical meeting locations with large caliber weapons for coercion purposes.

Goes like this:

Pilot: "How soon will we have a standardized, progressive payscale?

Wynn: "The partners and I have been looking at it very closely and some more time is necessary to *POP* background voice- answer the question Peterson! Wynn again- ah, yeah, as I was saying NetJets payscale starting next week. And, uh, free popcorn every Friday!

Pilot: "Thanks Wynn! Give J.B. a smack on the ass for me, and put some STANK on it!"

 

[JJET44]

Look,
We're not gonna strongarm the company into making seniority the priority.
If we get a 737 on property their going to look for someone with 737 time and if they can't find someone internally than they SHOULD look externally.
This isn't our flying club, it's a business. Their not gonna fly the thing around empty so the most senior person can get time in type.

JUST AN EXAMPLE!!

Also if someone is displaced by his/her aircraft being sold, they should have priority. Should we lay off someone because he is too junior to bid a vacancy? The airlines (who live and die by senority, do this)

 

[macpilot]

Pilot: "Thanks Wynn! Give J.B. a smack on the ass for me, and put some STANK on it!"

Pilot: Now go make me a sandwich.


I will try to do some reconnissance work this week.

 

[slickmagneto]

6. you carry lemon bleach in the airplane?

Deodorizer and Sanitizer in a spray can.

 

[slickmagneto]

Ok, so the next conference call is next friday.....
I think that we should all come to an agreement on what questions to ask and keep the conference going in our direction. I think that we need to come up with a list of questions for the call and have one person or few, ask from a list we create here.

From viewing the thread lately, I feel it should go like this.
1. Seniority # --strict adherence when bidding on positions
2. Pay scale
3. OT pay---across the board for everyone..Without being forced to work OT.
4. Hotels---????????

If the $50 day pay existed on the old Jetride side as it does on the old Pinnacle side. I would be fine with selecting my own hotel. But other than that, I dont think it works for me. I fly mostly in the northeast, it's pretty expensive up here.

I agree. We should continue to add to this list and be sure all the questions are asked and answered.

 

[macpilot]

should someone email this list to him and ask to cover this in the conference, or should we designate someone to ask these questions during the call. I guess we have just formed our own FAC. w/ stage names

 

[osy007]

should someone email this list to him and ask to cover this in the conference, or should we designate someone to ask these questions during the call. I guess we have just formed our own FAC. w/ stage names

The email or letter should go accordingly:

Dear Wynn,

Slick Maganeto, Osy007, Airplanes Suck guy, FL410 and the anally probed Elmo guy, would like to .........blah blah blah...

Sincerely,
Starcheck Driver

Actually, I think it would be a good idea to give them a list of items that we are concerned about and will bring up during the conference call. They could get the list ahead of time(days, week,etc.). The will then have time to think about the stuff and give us a legitimate and un-political answer.

 

[Rokit88]

The will then have time to think about the stuff and give us a legitimate and un-political answer.

How long have you worked here? (sarcasm)

 

[starcheckdriver]

The email or letter should go accordingly:

Dear Wynn,

Slick Maganeto, Osy007, Airplanes Suck guy, FL410 and the anally probed Elmo guy, would like to .........blah blah blah...

Sincerely,
Starcheck Driver

Why did I get designated as the hit man for this? I don't want to be the one signing the letter!

 

[macpilot]

1. Seniority # --strict adherence when bidding on positions
2. Pay scale
3. OT pay---across the board for everyone..Without being forced to work OT.
4. Hotels---????????

5. FAC
6. SOP;s standardization training( for PA )

I can type something up and take it there first thing in the morning if yall want. I have already typed one for number 5 & 6 but not sure if I should send it.

 

[AirplanesSuck]

Some thoughts about what we plan to suggest:

1. Seniority: As of now, at JR at least, it means very, very little. It should mean more. I have to disagree with osy007 and agree with Elmo a little on this. Complete disregard for everything else BUT seniority could be chaotic. Our base structure and living/travel arrangements are inherently different than the airlines. I was thinking about a bidding system something like this:

a. Open position in a fixed base: available to all pre-qualified pilots based on seniority alone. (current base and type NOT considered)

b. Open position in a floating aircraft: available to all pre-qualified pilots based on seniority alone. (current base and type NOT considered)

c. A/C lost from base, then new a/c of same type replaces it: Pilots in that base are given first priority, based on seniority within the base (must be pre-qualified in the type. New aircraft type [such as G4 replacing a LR60] would revert to scenario [a.].)

d. New A/C added to base (regardless of type): available to all pre-qualified pilots based on seniority alone. (Current base and type NOT considered)

e. New A/C type added to certificate: available to all pre-qualified pilots based on seniority. (Current base and type NOT considered) However, if no one in the company can be found pre-qualified, external hiring should take place. Not contract pilots, but pilots hired on a temporary basis (as in a year or two) to continue revenue service WHILE internally bid SIC positions help amass time necessary in type to take over as PIC in the airframe. As an alternative to the aforementioned, it could be required that two of the positions be filled externally with qualified pilots who enter our system permanently, and that one or two more of the SIC positions be exclusively required to be filled from within to guarantee some semblance of movement toward these large aircraft types.


2. Payscale: A progressive payscale similar to other companies that rewards more than a cost of living increase each year for time in service. Also, would provide for great equity among similarly-qualified pilots operating the same aircraft in the same seat position. Similarly, differences in pay between certain types should be eliminated, e.g. all Lear series should pay the same on the standard scale, considering the complexity and qualification of job task, not the revenue potential of the airframe. In the situation of larger aircraft such as Falcons and Gulfstreams, it is understood that these are inherently more demanding and complex pilot positions that require more renumeration.

3. Overtime: Current Jetride system, basically. Captains will be paid $300 a day and first officers $250. Overtime is strictly voluntary.


4. Per Diem: TBD. Pilots should expect to stay at least at Hampton Inns or similar quality hotels at no expense to themselves.


5. Uniforms: I'd like for the pilots to have some input as to the style, even if they don't take the advice. Also, especially since the company will ultimately pick the uniform, they should pick up the tab. Gas stations pay for their employee uniforms. If we are to pay for our own, then they should enforce a standard, not a specific type uniform.


Give me your thoughts. Just thought this might be a good starting block for what to bring to the table next friday.

 

[CFI4LIFE]

I can't believe what I am seeing... flightinfo actually being used for a good cause!!

Does anybody have good computer skills, like Napoleon Dynamite, that can start up our own Jetride message board? Like we had at Airnet (Starcheck55.com)?