Pilot Shortage

[ualdriver]

I think that a good part of the reason that the pay is high is because fewer people want to make the required move, thus less applicants. If US bases were opened, then there would be more applicants and the compensation would go down. Simply put, supply and demand.

I would agree that compensation would likely go down. So they could kill 2 birds with one stone. They'd have plenty of pilots to fly their aircraft AND they could pay a lower total compensation package. Seems like a win-win for foreign airline management.

I would bet that whatever total compensation package they would end up offering would still likely be better than United's or US Air's, for example.

 

[ualdriver]

The little perks make a big difference don't they?

Rarely an MEL (I average about one or two MEL's per year)
Plenty of fuel on arrival
Always a clean cockpit
Motivated cabin and costumer service personnel
Never waited for ground crews to park us (not even once on the past 5 years)
Never waited for ground transportation anymore than 10 minutes (95% of the time they are already waiting)
They run a flight crew oriented operation, you ask for more fuel, different route, whatever it may be and they just go and get it done for you, that is it!
They dry clean your uniforms for you
They just don't bother you on your days off
Business class commute and you get to keep the miles and that brings many other perks once you get Diamond status.

I know not all the jobs abroad are good and that working overseas is not for everyone but there are few of us that actually enjoy it

Well, I hate to say it because me and mother United are not friends right now, but a lot of the stuff you list above is true for our international operation as well, or at least what I see. Well, not the "flight crew orientated operation" part

Domestic United, however, is an entirely different world.

 

[ualdriver]

The little perks make a big difference don't they?

Rarely an MEL (I average about one or two MEL's per year)
Plenty of fuel on arrival
Always a clean cockpit
Motivated cabin and costumer service personnel
Never waited for ground crews to park us (not even once on the past 5 years)
Never waited for ground transportation anymore than 10 minutes (95% of the time they are already waiting)
They run a flight crew oriented operation, you ask for more fuel, different route, whatever it may be and they just go and get it done for you, that is it!
They dry clean your uniforms for you
They just don't bother you on your days off
Business class commute and you get to keep the miles and that brings many other perks once you get Diamond status.

I know not all the jobs abroad are good and that working overseas is not for everyone but there are few of us that actually enjoy it

Hey, I assume your an ANA guy by your avatar. Why does ANA need foreign pilots to fly their jets? Don't they make their own pilots?

 

[Dumb Pilot]

Hey, I assume your an ANA guy by your avatar. Why does ANA need foreign pilots to fly their jets? Don't they make their own pilots?

I fly for an ANA subsidiary yes, the growth at mainline ANA coupled with their retirements and their current hiring numbers has them in a deficit, hence the need to hire foreign crews

 

[Freight Dog]

I would agree that compensation would likely go down. So they could kill 2 birds with one stone. They'd have plenty of pilots to fly their aircraft AND they could pay a lower total compensation package. Seems like a win-win for foreign airline management.

I would bet that whatever total compensation package they would end up offering would still likely be better than United's or US Air's, for example.

Yes! We can also give away our loyalty bonuses and replace it with the insanity called a seniority list and seniority-based pay. We can also take a very small additional 2% pay cut to get fine representation by ALPA. God only knows how we could ever survive without them.

Experienced with plenty of PIC time on type? Sorry, experience really doesn't matter - only date of hire matters, and that's worth $25 per FLIGHT hour.

Then we can also do the whole "regional" second class citizen thing too where we'll have pilots making less than my Ukrainian FA.

Yes!!! How could I forget.... then we can also have 1960's trolly dolly hotties - yes, the very same ones from the 1960's with never-failing ability to hip check you every time they traverse the aisle. God help you if you ever ask for a Coke or a plated meal!

God bless the USA... :laugh:

 

[pilotyip]

Yes! We can also give away our loyalty bonuses and replace it with the insanity called a seniority list and seniority-based pay. We can also take a very small additional 2% pay cut to get fine representation by ALPA. God only knows how we could ever survive without them. God bless the USA... :laugh:

What a happy pilot without a union, how can that be? Isn't that against the laws of nature?

 

[Freight Dog]

Fly because you like to, if you are in it for the respect, prestige, recognition or money you may be disappointed.

... and that is the problem is in this country for professional pilots.

Yes, I fly "because I like to":

- when I'm at home
- gliders, small GA planes or experimentals
- when it is purely for my enjoyment on my own time, and dime.

Never mix business with pleasure...

 

[pilotyip]

... and that is the problem is in this country for professional pilots.

Yes, I fly "because I like to":

- when I'm at home
- gliders, small GA planes or experimentals
- when it is purely for my enjoyment on my own time, and dime.

Never mix business with pleasure...

Then do you experience disappointment in your chosen profession?

 

[ualdriver]

Yes! We can also give away our loyalty bonuses and replace it with the insanity called a seniority list and seniority-based pay. We can also take a very small additional 2% pay cut to get fine representation by ALPA. God only knows how we could ever survive without them.

Experienced with plenty of PIC time on type? Sorry, experience really doesn't matter - only date of hire matters, and that's worth $25 per FLIGHT hour.

Then we can also do the whole "regional" second class citizen thing too where we'll have pilots making less than my Ukrainian FA.

Yes!!! How could I forget.... then we can also have 1960's trolly dolly hotties - yes, the very same ones from the 1960's with never-failing ability to hip check you every time they traverse the aisle. God help you if you ever ask for a Coke or a plated meal!

God bless the USA... :laugh:

Ummmmm.....OK.

 

[Freight Dog]

Then do you experience disappointment in your chosen profession?

You know... in 2008, I would have said yes. But now that I've 'seen the 'light' and actually make a much better living than I ever could flying for a US airline, I have to say no.

It's actually pretty sad that one has to leave the US to make a good living as a pilot.

 

[Freight Dog]

Ummmmm.....OK.

Exactly! That's why I fly overseas.

 

[Adios]

Me too!!! I don't want to brag, but I now have over 120 days off a year and make twice as much with a much better QOL. As for my previous 135 company, they were happy to give me "NO" hard days off a month, and a chocolate cake as a Christmas bonus, not to mention the poorly paid skipper salary. It is sad that a professional pilot has to move overseas to enjoy what they should in the USA.

Ching Ching

 

[keebird]

Wow! You got chocolate cake? Are they hiring?

As for my previous 135 company, they were happy to give me "NO" hard days off a month, and a chocolate cake as a Christmas bonus, not to mention the poorly paid skipper salary.
Ching Ching

 

[Fubijaakr]

Hey, at least you never got a "Payday" candy bar in your mailbox as an annual bonus.

 

[Dumb Pilot]

EMB190 Direct Entry Captains wanted for Tianjin Airlines

* $15,700 USD/per month + Overtime - Year 1
* $16,000 USD/per month + Overtime - Year 2
* $16,250 USD/per month + Overtime - Year 3

Your choice of (6 Weeks ON / 3 Weeks OFF) OR (6 Weeks ON / 3 Weeks OFF with 24 days of leave)

* Interview in St Louis, Missouri or Beijing, China

Please respond to this email with your name, current location and phone number (including country code) and you will be contacted immediately. Please forward this email to any other individuals that might be interested.

Best regards,

Ted Revis

www.vorholdings.com

 

[sniper]

Exactly! That's why I fly overseas.

Good for you...save all your money to find your health when you get back in the States

 

[Dumb Pilot]

Good for you...save all your money to find your health when you get back in the States

Why would you assume that his health is compromised?
I am a lot healthier now than I was when flying the six leg rat race, my cholesterol is lower, also my blood pressure, food over here in S.E. Asia tends to be healthier (lots of vegetables and fish) much better hotels so there is a fully equipped gim everywhere I go and I take full advantage of it, weather and scenery is nicer so I go out jogging much more than when I was flying in the states, as a result I am 25 pounds lighter now than I was before I started here, sorry but your comment doesn't make any sense

 

[Freight Dog]

Good for you...save all your money to find your health when you get back in the States

Don't forget that we also live in subhuman conditions and in daily fear for our lives simply because we're Americans too.

 

[HA25]

Me too!!! I don't want to brag, but I now have over 120 days off a year and make twice as much with a much better QOL. As for my previous 135 company, they were happy to give me "NO" hard days off a month, and a chocolate cake as a Christmas bonus, not to mention the poorly paid skipper salary. It is sad that a professional pilot has to move overseas to enjoy what they should in the USA.

Ching Ching

Amen Brother... Amen!

 

[Adios]

Yeah, this year I will actually be home for (two weeks) skiing Santa Fe, and NOT traveling back home on Christmas day to fly the usual day after Christmas trip. WOW!! just thinking about it sounds awesome....can't wait.

 

[d328pilot]

I've actually had every Christmas and Thanksgiving off since I left the US. Compared to never while I was there.

 

[atpcliff]

Just got called for a job...from a resume I dropped off in Apr, 2009. They couldn't find guys so went back into their files and called every number that they had on hand.

cliff
HNL

 

[pilotyip]

Just got called for a job...from a resume I dropped off in Apr, 2009. They couldn't find guys so went back into their files and called every number that they had on hand.

cliff
HNL

Didn't you tell me that Atlas has dropped their minimums to 2000TT from 4000 TT when you applied? All part of the coming 2012 hiring boom, places like the on-demand guys at KYIP are going to really be redefining competitive minimums

 

[atpcliff]

yes, Atlas is down to 2000 TT, 500 Turbine Total. This is the 2nd time in 1 1/2 years that they have lowered their mins.

cliff
HNL

 

[Avpilot]

Not bragging, just showing what it can be like if you're open-minded and willing to travel internationally...

45 days on / 45 days off. That works out to 182.5 days off per year (or 26 weeks), on average. The pay is improving soon, but currently $10,000 per month plus per diem (~$1,500), medical insurance, etc. Good hotels, good flying, good destinations. The boss treats us well. It is a private jet operation. When I'm off for half the year, I'm OFF without having to even think about work.

This same aircraft type would pay perhaps $90,000 in the states with 2 or 3 weeks of vacation per year and perhaps medical insurance if you're lucky. Plus my tax burden is greatly reduced by being a resident of another country.

Not that I want a flood of applicants into my line of work, but think about it guys.

Tim

 

[NEDude]

Just hope Europe opens up soon for expats.

(Not really holding my breath for that one)

I think it is Hainan that is offering A330 positions with U.S. and European basing for experienced A320 captains.

 

[pilotyip]

The shortage is already showing at the lower end of the industry. On-demand operators of the bigger airplanes DC-9's, 727's have higher mins along with marginal QOL. Then management says don't hire any commuters, they are harder to find to fly on their days off. They are having trouble filling classes. A buddy of mine his company is going to the bottom of their resume stack, some over a year old to find piltos. Most of the old resume already have jobs. All part of the 2012 hiring boom.

 

[NEDude]

Any chance the middle eastern companies (Emitrates, Qatar, etc) will ever look at basing outside the middle east? Or at least look at commuting type employment?

 

[Dumb Pilot]

Any chance the middle eastern companies (Emitrates, Qatar, etc) will ever look at basing outside the middle east? Or at least look at commuting type employment?

Who knows really, our opinions are speculative in nature because these companies make decisions based in part on cultural influences and as westerners we don't understand that aspect of their decision making process, but my opinion is that I don't think they will, for a commuting job or international basing you have to look at the opportunities in Asia

 

[HA25]

The shortage is already showing at the lower end of the industry. On-demand operators of the bigger airplanes DC-9's, 727's have higher mins along with marginal QOL. Then management says don't hire any commuters, they are harder to find to fly on their days off. They are having trouble filling classes. A buddy of mine his company is going to the bottom of their resume stack, some over a year old to find piltos. Most of the old resume already have jobs. All part of the 2012 hiring boom.

keep pouring the Koolaid Yip, I'm sure some 22 year old kid with rich parents is reading this and excited at the prospect of working on a 40 year old DC9 .. ready to come in on his days off and give you 25 days a month for $40K/yr