Pay to play this time UAL

[Freebrd]

Who's fault is it? ALPA and the mainline MECs created the problem, then ignored it for years....The chickens have come home to roost and you will see more deals like this going forward..

Bingo! And the majors are still allowing it. 100 seaters next.

 

[pilotyip]

The 80's

This is what happens when you let other people fly your passengers.

Gup

isn't that because in the 80's real airline pilots told their companies they would not fly those little prop airplanes. I mean after they will never amount to anything flying 200 NM legs to hubs. They could never compete with maniline. Maybe should have put those planes onm the certifcate?

 

[jhill]

for 50% of the pay...nice

More like 80%

 

[bluefin]

More like 80%

Not for long. That is if you want to remain, "COMPETITIVE"

 

[maxcackel]

isn't that because in the 80's real airline pilots told their companies they would not fly those little prop airplanes. I mean after they will never amount to anything flying 200 NM legs to hubs. They could never compete with maniline. Maybe should have put those planes onm the certifcate?

They also did not want their military buddys to get out of the service and have to fly a little barbie jet. Hey MAINLINE GUYS figure out how to quit giving your flying and my future job away. Sacrifice now with what ever it takes, are you willing to do that to keep the flying. It just keeps getting worse year after year. Get these planes on your property for lower wages now, stop the bleeding then later raise the bar back up. Mainline alpa is in charge of the future not the regionals, so don't bitch about the furloughs and the scraps we get from the leftovers you throw out.

 

[enuffalready]

said it before.. and I'll say it again. it ALWAYS comes down to leverage and regional pilots have none, zero, nada. 100% of the responsibility lies with mainline pilots and what they negotiate for and what they negotiate away. There is NOTHING a regional pilot can do because we have NO leverage and thus NO POWER. If the mainline pilots dont like it, they can negotiate what they do like

The problem mainline guys now face is that the regional companies ( not pilots) and taking advantage of great cash postions and using them to wield power and control.

 

[Mr.B]

They also did not want their military buddys to get out of the service and have to fly a little barbie jet. Hey MAINLINE GUYS figure out how to quit giving your flying and my future job away. Sacrifice now with what ever it takes, are you willing to do that to keep the flying. It just keeps getting worse year after year. Get these planes on your property for lower wages now, stop the bleeding then later raise the bar back up. Mainline alpa is in charge of the future not the regionals, so don't bitch about the furloughs and the scraps we get from the leftovers you throw out.

90 sears are on the way......MAINLINE ONLY

Soon, all those 50 seaters will be too expensive. We may finally see the beginnings of mainline growth. ARE YOU LISTENING MORSE?

 

[Jiminmem]

isn't that because in the 80's real airline pilots told their companies they would not fly those little prop airplanes. I mean after they will never amount to anything flying 200 NM legs to hubs. They could never compete with maniline. Maybe should have put those planes onm the certifcate?

Exactly

 

[sstearns2]

Great Scott, you should be so proud... tell all you friends and family you are a UAL pilot, well truth is you are pretty much if they stay domestic.

Don't you all see that this is just draining the mainline, but now the stakeholders will be the regional carriers because they have the cash. This is RAH and Frontier, albeit on a much smaller scale, but it is the first step. Maybe someday soon it will be RAH vs. Skywest vs. SWA in the Denver market and UAL will carry the international pax from SFO, IAD, and ORD.

Against my better judgement, I'll reply....

My brother is a pilot for UAL who may be facing another furlough. I wish UAL-ALPA would have kept anything with a jet engine in house. They, of course, did not and put all of us the path the we are all now on.

I was simply stating my impression that this deal would put Skywest Inc at the front of the line for whatever additional flying from whatever sourse may come up. I can pretty much assure you, knowing our managment, that they are getting something more than just their 11%. Whether that will be good or bad for me, my family, or this profession I don't know.

Cheers,
Scott

 

[OHGOON]

Senior ALPA pilots created this mess when they were too proud to take a pay reduction in order to bring the new "little jets" in-house. The ultimate results are now plain to see. Of course most of those rocket scientists who were actively involved with this are now long gone and have left the rest of us to deal with the catastrophe.

Further proof that we continue to do it to ourselves and without lube too!

 

[Twisted Mind]

isn't that because in the 80's real airline pilots told their companies they would not fly those little prop airplanes. I mean after they will never amount to anything flying 200 NM legs to hubs. They could never compete with maniline. Maybe should have put those planes onm the certifcate?

That is why I say all airplanes must be flown my mainline. Mainline flew t-props in the past and should fly them agian. Other wise the 100 dash 8 will become reality.

 

[BLUE BAYOU]

Don't forget that Air Wisconsin also extended a loan to US Airways a few years back...after UAL decided that a good business partner for years wasn't as important as cost cutting was--

 

[beytzim]

Senior ALPA pilots created this mess when they were too proud to take a pay reduction in order to bring the new "little jets" in-house. The ultimate results are now plain to see. Of course most of those rocket scientists who were actively involved with this are now long gone and have left the rest of us to deal with the catastrophe.

Further proof that we continue to do it to ourselves and without lube too!

Yep! I flew with one of MEC members who voted on it (while I was at Netjets, and he a retired UAL guy with a mansion in San Fran). Anyway, he stated very clearly to me that if they brought RJ's into the fleet, they would have to lower 747 Captain pay rates (he, as a senior UAL pilot, was amazingly, a 747 captain). Well, there was no way in he11, he would take a pay cut just so new hires could fly those itty bitty 35-50 seaters. So they voted for the RJs to go to the regionals.

What's amazing, is that he told me this in 2004, after all the furloughs after 9/11 etc. I told him right to his face "YOU ARE THE REASON WHY THERE ARE THOUSANDS OF MAJOR AIRLINE PILOTS ON FURLOUGH!!"

He was my f/o, so I could be a$$ like that

 

[waveflyer]

Good for you! I'd have landed in deliverance and dropped him off.

 

[saabservant]

Proves it again, mainline mec's throw everyone else and the profession overboard. Greed and entitlement are not exclusive to the management suites....

 

[RedRum]

I might even lend UAL money at 11%. My impression from the letter skywest managment sent us is that this also put skywest inc at the front of the line for any UAX flying that comes up.

Scott

Rad cockpit Scott, er.... Captain Scott.

 

[IBNAV8R]

11% might be "sub-prime" but, given the borrower, it's not exactly a low-risk investment either.

 

[texman]

Yep! I flew with one of MEC members who voted on it (while I was at Netjets, and he a retired UAL guy with a mansion in San Fran). Anyway, he stated very clearly to me that if they brought RJ's into the fleet, they would have to lower 747 Captain pay rates (he, as a senior UAL pilot, was amazingly, a 747 captain). Well, there was no way in he11, he would take a pay cut just so new hires could fly those itty bitty 35-50 seaters. So they voted for the RJs to go to the regionals.

What's amazing, is that he told me this in 2004, after all the furloughs after 9/11 etc. I told him right to his face "YOU ARE THE REASON WHY THERE ARE THOUSANDS OF MAJOR AIRLINE PILOTS ON FURLOUGH!!"

He was my f/o, so I could be a$$ like that

Dude that is funny you say that because we had the same at CS. The UA guys there it was because of greed.

 

[10nCLR]

Pay to play? Skywest is making 11% a year on their money. Airlines are getting liquidity from places other than banks these days.

Poor thread title.

You are so right.
I wonder if SkyWest will up the ante with TRIP this upcoming year. 15% up to 20% ownership? Brazil definitely has potential. Their economy is having a robust recovery and the middle class population has surged in the last few years. TRIP has continued to expand this year and have plans for next year as well.
http://www.eturbonews.com/12351/trip-linhas-aereas-expand-operations-invest-198-million
so now if the government decides to raise the foreign ownership which they might do(49%), who knows. Yet again, another brilliant business transaction was made by JA and crew. Nice.