Pay during training at Southwest

[ASADFW7]

The company wants you to work and be creative. They want you to eat well and be happy.

 

[jhill]

Uh yea, like the company ad hears to the "intent" of the contract. it gets worked both ways. If a first year can give their stuff away and pickup for more, then more power to them. Just like someone giving away their line and sitting on the VJA list, if you can do it, good on ya.

What the He!! does ad hears mean? Did you hear an advertisement?

 

[TrumanSparks]

darn that spell check

 

[SWA GUY]

Everyone please disregard what ChestRockwell has said about second year pay. He/she has no clue, and is making an ill-informed opinion.

It's no uncommon for (motivted) first year pilots to make in excess of $80K, and still have very good QOL.

 

[Chest Rockwell]

SWAGUY,

This is a program intended to reward first year pilots who fly extra - more money for the 1st year pilot and reduces the staffing requirements for the Company. It is a wiin/win thhat epitomises what thoughtful, interested-base negotiations can produce. To those who make $80K in their first year flying extra, that is great. If you do it flying 90 trips per month, I do not see how that is right.

 

[FatesPawn]

SWAGUY,

This is a program intended to reward first year pilots who fly extra - more money for the 1st year pilot and reduces the staffing requirements for the Company. It is a wiin/win thhat epitomises what thoughtful, interested-base negotiations can produce. To those who make $80K in their first year flying extra, that is great. If you do it flying 90 trips per month, I do not see how that is right.

Chest,

I'll use my own 1st year experience as an illustration (last year BTW)

My total pay for my first 12 months was $74,000. I did this by AGGRESSIVELY maniuplating the system But I was all about QOL too - and a non-commuter.

My PERFECT month was my last month on 1st year pay. The only 1st year pay I earned that month was my PC.

So, how did I HONESTLY do this? The first thing I did is put EVERY trip i had in giveaway. I would trade 3 days for 2 days+1day trips and 4 days for 2-2days to make them more palatable. Someone actually picked up a 4 day trip off my line for goodness sake!

Additionally, I would AGGRESSIVELY watch elitt like a hawk for any net-zero's to pop up. That means that one of our pilots had already picked up an extra day for the company, so I snatched it back. Even trade. Then I would use the time off I created by picking up UNCOVERED Daily open time or Extra Fly.

Now, the CRAP I would pick up (DOT/EF) as a 1st year guy (19.5 3-day trips) simply would NOT be palatable to the same guy that's picking one of my 26.0 3-day's out of my giveaway line. So, if I didn't give away my FAT trip, that 19.5 3-day would still be stuck in DOT for some reserve to cover....

Are there any points you disagree with?

-fate

 

[FatesPawn]

oh, and one more thing. My average TFP was probabaly 110-120 to make that $75,000. I don't really see how you can fly less as a first year guy and make that much. Basically, working smarter not harder was my motto and I was more productive for the company at the same time.

 

[Chest Rockwell]

I am just saying that the intent of this benefit was to reward flying over and above your awarded line. It was not intended to replace first year pay with second year. If not, why not just give everyone second year pay for the first two years. Replacing one trip with another is what trip trade and elitt are for. Sometimes a giveaway and pickup are the only way to make a QOL event work out.

Are we talking huge sums in the overall scheme of things? Probably not, but it is a small step that could lead to the erosion of trust and goodwill between the Pilot's union and the Company.

 

[FatesPawn]

I am just saying that the intent of this benefit was to reward flying over and above your awarded line. It was not intended to replace first year pay with second year.

Chest,

I guess that's the crux of the argument. The PILOT GROUP is flying more block hours utilizing the system as I described. We are just shifting productivity from one pilot to another AND being more productive in the process.

2nd year pilot - sees crappy 3 day in DOT, but won't pick it up - or simply doesn't want to wait around until 8am the day prior and run the risk that another more senior (read that more highly paid) pilot bids on it. Then he sees a 1st year guy's 26.0 3 day in giveaway and takes it.

Zero gain for the company, right?

But NOW, the 1st year guy picks up that crappy DOT 3 day at 2nd year pay.

Result? Everyone's happy - INCLUDING THE COMPANY... because they didn't have to burn or even STAFF as many reserves because all the flying is being covered by lineholders. Much cheaper than hiring a couple of extra bodies to cover the extra reserves that would be required.

Great system!

-fate

 

[737tanker]

I am just saying that the intent of this benefit was to reward flying over and above your awarded line. It was not intended to replace first year pay with second year.

Just like the .74 DHR were intended to cover open time and QOL for training was intended so a pilot wouldn't have to train on his off days. Since SWAPA didn't nail down the wordings on those intentions the pilot group has to live with the results. Since SWA didn't nail down the wordings for 2nd year pay they have to live with the results. As FatesPawn says by giving away his pairings he is able to pick up pairings that would normally have to go to a Reserve. SWA is happy it didn't because the Reserve is now available for other flying.

 

[Benhuntn]

As a new guy good luck giving away your hard line month or after that your reserve....I found it easier to just pick up open time.

 

[GuppyWN]

Rock... is this your first airline job?

Gup

 

[StopNTSing]

As a new guy good luck giving away your hard line month or after that your reserve....I found it easier to just pick up open time.

When I was a FNG, commuting on reserve, I found it easier to forget about picking up anything!

 

[Dangerkitty]

As a new guy good luck giving away your hard line month or after that your reserve....I found it easier to just pick up open time.

I heard that in OAK it was/is almost impossible to give away a hard line much less reserve, however I did hear that it was very doable in the other bases.

Is that true?

 

[ivauir]

Making more for working more is great. This incentive was intended to reward those who flew more than their line.

Says who? I don't see anything written in the contract about the "intent". You are being remarkably judgmental, as well as incorrect.