Passenger weights Pt. 91

cappydd

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Hey folks,
What kinds of weights are you using for your passengers? Also whatever weights you use, is that including personal luggage (carry-on such as computer bag or briefcase)?
Do you increase or decrease these weights for summer and winter?
And last but not least, what kinds of weights are you using for baggage?

I know that there are different methods such as the average weights listed in the FAA Advisory Circulars, but have also heard of using actual weights as well.

Just curious what some guys out there are using and how they derived at that or those weights.

Thanks,
 

Hawker800

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We use actual weights if possible. Add 10lbs for personal items and another 10 in the winter. Baggage is actual.
 

THE Flying Ace

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Also actual weights. Our scheduler will ask all pax their weight and we add 20# per person for baggage.
 

ksu_aviator

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Actual weights when the total weight will be near the max take off weight.

For example, my aircraft has a MTOW of 16,000. If the BOW + Fuel = 13,500 and I have 10 small women, I'm good. If I have 10 big guys, now I'm using actual weights. But, I'm lucky. I've run all kinds of W&B scenarios and it is dang near impossible to get the aircraft out of CG. I literally have to have a heavy copilot, 4 big guys sitting in the front club and no luggage for the aircraft to be out of CG forward. Due to limitations on cargo, I can never go out of CG aft.

The hidden point is that you need to make decisions based on the situation for today.
 

NCherches

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Actual weights when the total weight will be near the max take off weight.

For example, my aircraft has a MTOW of 16,000. If the BOW + Fuel = 13,500 and I have 10 small women, I'm good. If I have 10 big guys, now I'm using actual weights. But, I'm lucky. I've run all kinds of W&B scenarios and it is dang near impossible to get the aircraft out of CG. I literally have to have a heavy copilot, 4 big guys sitting in the front club and no luggage for the aircraft to be out of CG forward. Due to limitations on cargo, I can never go out of CG aft.

The hidden point is that you need to make decisions based on the situation for today.
What kind of Citation are you driving?
 

NCherches

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We use actual weights... about 200 for guys if I don't know and about 150 for women... I know I like them more like 115 lbs but oh well
 

2dumb2drive

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Just my personal opinion, but asking actual weights in a jet seems ridiculous. Take a educated guess and if it is so close that ten pounds is going to make a difference, you take less fuel and just stop anyways. I know, i know this reg says, this AC says.... just be a professional.
 

o2bflyn

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Just my personal opinion, but asking actual weights in a jet seems ridiculous. Take a educated guess and if it is so close that ten pounds is going to make a difference, you take less fuel and just stop anyways. I know, i know this reg says, this AC says.... just be a professional.
weird...I though following regs and Ac's WAS being professional.

Why is asking weight ridiculous? What is so unprofessional about that?
 

ksu_aviator

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weird...I though following regs and Ac's WAS being professional.

Why is asking weight ridiculous? What is so unprofessional about that?
Bluntly asking an individual what they weigh is usually offensive. Being offensive to your passengers is not professional.

If you must ask, ask in advance and ask the lead pax to gather the information for you. This way, the personal information that many people are very touchy about can be handled by someone that is more familiar to them.
 

heywatchthis

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This is a good threat. Another question?

What about total weight on the aircraft. I am flying a G200 and I’m not so concerned about using 200lbs vs 175lbs, but I am very concerned about all the uncounted weight on board.

When I started flying an aircraft that has a FA, with all the cabin amenities and Crap onboard the uncounted weight went through the roof.

We have Jepps, computers, printers, DVDs, Magazines, headsets, ton and tons of food, and food prep items, toiletry items, bathroom supplies, cleaning supplies, chocolate, dinner ware, serving ware, cooking ware, coffee makers, tea makers, a ton of water bottles, 10 to 20 lbs on ice, deserts, snacks, beer, wine, blankets, pillows, soda, flowers, slippers, it just keeps going on and on. Then we stack a crap load in the luggage too.

None of this weight is really counted, and then pilots like to add 170lb per passenger and fill the fuel to max TO weight. It really concerns me about how much weight we actually have. And that’s not even for an international trip.

For a 5 day trip with 6 pax, the FA drives her car out to the aircraft and unloads about 30 grocery bags, plus all the standard crap we already have on board.

We must have an extra 500lbs that just doesn't get counted. But try to increase the BOW by 500lbs and see how much slack you get about range. Pilots just love to carry GAS!

Does anyone else have this problem and what kind of solutions do people have?

 

heywatchthis

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oops.

"This is a good Thread!" Is what I meant to say.
 

ProFracPilot

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Our airplane was emptied of all stores, non-required equip that we carry, etc. All itmes were weighed, arms determined and IS now figured into our BOW. We operate with 3 crew PLUS this 600+ pounds of extra stuff. If we ignored this number in the aircraft I fly we would be routinely (unknowingly??) loading the aircraft outside the fwd limit of the CG envelope. Knowing this number we can specifically load pax, bags, etc to keep it within CG. Yes, it sucks losing the payload / fuel. But, IMHO, it is the proper way - and the only way - to do it.
 
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o2bflyn

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Bluntly asking an individual what they weigh is usually offensive. Being offensive to your passengers is not professional.

If you must ask, ask in advance and ask the lead pax to gather the information for you. This way, the personal information that many people are very touchy about can be handled by someone that is more familiar to them.
I never said anything about being blunt. No one in there right mind would ever be offensive to passengers. If it is truely important there are ways of finding out weights without bluntly asking the person.

My point was it is not unprofessional to find out a person's weight for w&b purposes. Should you walk up and say "hey fatty, what's you tonnage today?"....No! Sometimes you need that information and its your job to get it. Be creative, find a way.

When I get ramped, I don't think the FAA will accept " I was going to do W&B, but I did not want to be rude and ask their weights."
 
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