Overheard...

[gunfyter]

I have a trip from LGB to SFO ... so i won't be seeing either....

 

[fischman]

Yes, and proud of the honesty I bring forth every day. I resemble that remark.



Look at all the turmoil that the NJA group and Flight Options has had to endure, and it's not over yet. Only the union fracs are whining. Would you like some cheese with that whine? :beer:

Honesty??? BWAAAHAHAHAHAHHAHA!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Tell me again. What turmoil has the CBA caused NetJets? That's right. NONE. NetJets would have furloughed 495 without a CBA.

I'm waiting to learn more about your wide-body, non-union, international turboprop carrier. Tell us how AWESOME it is KB!!!

 

[B19 Flyer]

Honesty??? BWAAAHAHAHAHAHHAHA!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Tell me again. What turmoil has the CBA caused NetJets? That's right. NONE. NetJets would have furloughed 495 without a CBA.

I'm waiting to learn more about your wide-body, non-union, international turboprop carrier. Tell us how AWESOME it is KB!!!

NJ has the highest pilot per airplane ratio in the industry forced by the CBA. Those pilots would have never been laid off because they shouldn't have been hired in the first place had the contract not been so greedy.

All of the other pilots that had to make decisions on their careers prior to that when the golden parachutes were offered lived turmoil each and every day trying to make decisions on their future.

That industry leading contract has been nothing but turmoil for the bottom of the seniority list while the top of the list is protected, just like the union always does. Nothing but greed.

My carrier has not laid anybody off or forced pay cuts and it is awesome to not have to worry about a union screwing things up. The only unhappy people on this board are union members.

I predicted NJ turmoil with that "industry leading" contract, it began with the packages, continued with the layoffs and the contract will be next after one more round of layoffs. Mark my words, expensive "industry leading" contracts NEVER survive, market forces always brings them back to reality. The FLOPS T/A may indeed be the industry leading contract before it's all over, and if 1108 hadn't waited so long they would have gotten a whole lot more than they did. What a waste of time and money.

 

[B19 Flyer]

I have no contract Butthead.. (or is it Beavis?)

Yes, cheese will go well with my whine? Can you help us buy some with that management paycheck (oh yea from that management contract you have)

I noted that 1108 wasn't going to have a contract for the FLOPS pilots for at least three years, (nearly four years ago), and that pearl of wisdom still applies to me. Just like FLOPS, I have no contract Butthead.. (or is it Beavis?)

 

[wolfpackpilot]

I have a trip from LGB to SFO ...

That's pushing the range on a Falcon isn't it? You're going to have wet footprint on that one!

 

[doh]

NJ has the highest pilot per airplane ratio in the industry forced by the CBA. Those pilots would have never been laid off because they shouldn't have been hired in the first place had the contract not been so greedy.

All of the other pilots that had to make decisions on their careers prior to that when the golden parachutes were offered lived turmoil each and every day trying to make decisions on their future.

That industry leading contract has been nothing but turmoil for the bottom of the seniority list while the top of the list is protected, just like the union always does. Nothing but greed.

My carrier has not laid anybody off or forced pay cuts and it is awesome to not have to worry about a union screwing things up. The only unhappy people on this board are union members.

I predicted NJ turmoil with that "industry leading" contract, it began with the packages, continued with the layoffs and the contract will be next after one more round of layoffs. Mark my words, expensive "industry leading" contracts NEVER survive, market forces always brings them back to reality. The FLOPS T/A may indeed be the industry leading contract before it's all over, and if 1108 hadn't waited so long they would have gotten a whole lot more than they did. What a waste of time and money.

We don't have a union at Flex, yet we have the same percentage of pilots laid off. Let me quote the Clintons: "It's the economy, stupid!" Management will not always get the staffing right sans union, so your argument is flawed. It is a combonation of things. And let me say one more time, just in case there is a stupid individual here who still doesn't get it, Flops management is solely responsible for having a union on property. They could have been Flex, but they didn't respond.

 

[be99fr8dog]

I noted that 1108 wasn't going to have a contract for the FLOPS pilots for at least three years, (nearly four years ago), and that pearl of wisdom still applies to me. Just like FLOPS, I have no contract Butthead.. (or is it Beavis?)

Hey B19 why don't you let your identity be known, because when I meet you I want to kick your ass. you are a real dip sh*t. Pull your head out of your anus. You know what you are? You are a single use, disposable, feminine hygiene product. Even your Mom knows you are a dip sh*t.

 

[CRJFlyer]

B19 is ******************************...But I do agree there will be one more round of layoffs (or atleast threat of layoffs).

Apparently mgmnt has changed their tune a bit and is still telling recurrents that they have to wait until March/April to re-evaluate staffing. AND they could have cut another 800 jobs without too much impact on operations. BUT didn't want to because they would have to call back too soon once things picked up....How soon will it be before some of the junior captains start getting worried about layoffs? Once layoffs start threatening the captain ranks all bets are off as to what will happen. Guaranteed!! IMO

If I wasn't furloughed I'd be willing to put money down as to the intent of these "re-evaluations"...Same mgmnt playbook, different company. Aviation managers will either threaten us with jobs, or in the case of SJS, will dangle an E-170 or promise of upgrades to a regional pilot group.
I've said before on NJASAP.. They're(mgmnt) is going to try to get into the contract. Guaranteed, DS came here, saw our pay vs. other fractionals, and thought.."WTF, our guys make way more than the others!!" He's not an aviation guy, all he see's is dollars and cents.

Hopefully I'm proven wrong, and hopefully everyone still left will see this. Our group is fairly strong, but when faced with a furlough, or downgrade, all bets are off.

 

[brokeflyer]

NJ has the highest pilot per airplane ratio in the industry forced by the CBA. Those pilots would have never been laid off because they shouldn't have been hired in the first place had the contract not been so greedy.

All of the other pilots that had to make decisions on their careers prior to that when the golden parachutes were offered lived turmoil each and every day trying to make decisions on their future.

That industry leading contract has been nothing but turmoil for the bottom of the seniority list while the top of the list is protected, just like the union always does. Nothing but greed.

My carrier has not laid anybody off or forced pay cuts and it is awesome to not have to worry about a union screwing things up. The only unhappy people on this board are union members.

I predicted NJ turmoil with that "industry leading" contract, it began with the packages, continued with the layoffs and the contract will be next after one more round of layoffs. Mark my words, expensive "industry leading" contracts NEVER survive, market forces always brings them back to reality. The FLOPS T/A may indeed be the industry leading contract before it's all over, and if 1108 hadn't waited so long they would have gotten a whole lot more than they did. What a waste of time and money.

well, if you're managment, then go fix it. we cant do anything about the union that management allowed to be placed there.

only YOU can change it.

Pay your pilots a liveable wage and dont abuse them. Unions will then be obsolete.

Do your job.......manage.

We all know you hate unions, stop crying about it so much and deal with it. Quit crying about it and be a man. Fix it if you hate it so bad.

 

[glasspilot]

It's funny how relitive seniority affects your view on furloughs. I went throgh it at ACA / Indy.

Feeling toward furlough vs. Seniority:

Middle of road Captain (as high as I ever got)
Well, furlough sucks for those guys, but we'll get 'em back soon.

Junior Captain on reserve:
Well another round of furloughs, reserve sucks but at least I held on to the left seat.

Senior FO
Wow! I can hold any line I want! Pays not as bad as I thought with these cherry lines. Suks the guys I fly with are clueless to the plight of those below them.

Middle of road FO
Man! Why won't this company turn it around?!?

Now on reserve FO
Am I gonna get the axe?? This company ain't gonna make it! Start going to road show and give money to Kit.


The whole time I KNEW guys were losing their jobs but didn't really understand until it was me on the block. I just rationalized it with seniority and the hope that it would be a quick furlough.

Good luck all.