NWA wants DOH

[FDJ2]

Those darn computers!


Bye Bye--General Lee

Garbage in, garbage out.

 

[Donsa320]

But didn't Red Book cry murder about their wide-body "career expectations"?

Oh, they did indeed and in fact they gave many Republic guys a very hard time in DC-10 transition. One of them left a tape recorder running in the sim break room and caught a conversation between a couple of red book instructors as to how they would make sure the green book pilot would fail his ride. The lawyers had a ball with that. Nasty times.

I would hope that this merger goes more smoothly but I would not bet on it. It is all up to the people involved on both sides.

 

[General Lee]

Oh, they did indeed and in fact they gave many Republic guys a very hard time in DC-10 transition. One of them left a tape recorder running in the sim break room and caught a conversation between a couple of red book instructors as to how they would make sure the green book pilot would fail his ride. The lawyers had a ball with that. Nasty times.

I would hope that this merger goes more smoothly but I would not bet on it. It is all up to the people involved on both sides.

True Don, and it all starts with the opening positions. They went one way with DOH (far left), and we could have gone the polar opposite and said "Staple." Instead, we threw in relative seniority with a small chunk at the bottom due to outgoing airplanes. You can't really say "let's find some middle ground" since they started far left and we started in the middle. We'll see who we are dealing with soon I suppose.


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[castle bravo]

Oh, they did indeed and in fact they gave many Republic guys a very hard time in DC-10 transition. "


This is the entire point. Now that the shoe is on the other foot.............

 

[Donsa320]

True Don, and it all starts with the opening positions. They went one way with DOH (far left), and we could have gone the polar opposite and said "Staple." Instead, we threw in relative seniority with a small chunk at the bottom due to outgoing airplanes. You can't really say "let's find some middle ground" since they started far left and we started in the middle. We'll see who we are dealing with soon I suppose.


Bye Bye--General Lee

Yes, General, I understand your point.

I am long gone now but NWA was my 3rd merger, Southern and then Hughes Airwest were first. Southern went the easiest IMHO. I would like to add that Southern had a 13 airplane commuter operation as well. But those Metro pilots were on the Southern list and they came right along with the mainline pilots. We had no problem with that. Too bad that is not the way it is now.

Good luck to you all.

DC

 

[recallsomeday]

So, you're only going up $15 an hour? Going up 4 years in pay, and then getting a 15-20% raise in pay rates? Really? You see, if you are in the bottom 5% of NWA, shouldn't you be in the bottom 5% of a new company? But, you guys are losing a bunch of planes soon, and we aren't. That is called inequity. You are only adding 18 mystery planes that haven't flown yet. You are adding some retirements, though, just like we are 5 years from now. (of course, we don't know if all of your pilots WILL retire at 60, just like ours).

Bye Bye--General Lee

I can see if one were 5% on the pre merger list, and 5% on the merged SLI.

Why would the DAL proposal put someone who is 10% on the pre-list and barely over 5% on the merged list?

Bottom line is this, you can keep the raise ... seniority is not for SALE. You keep trying to cover your seniority grab with a few dollars and the argument of credit for time on furlough.

 

[MJ42]

I can see if one were 5% on the pre merger list, and 5% on the merged SLI.

Why would the DAL proposal put someone who is 10% on the pre-list and barely over 5% on the merged list?

Bottom line is this, you can keep the raise ... seniority is not for SALE. You keep trying to cover your seniority grab with a few dollars and the argument of credit for time on furlough.

Exactly. Can someone please explain to me how the current DAL eight ball, who has only been on line for a couple of months, can be(relatively speaking) senior to a 00 DEC 19 NWA pilot (baby bus block holder) that has a few hundred pilots below?

I just don't get it.

Bottom line is all DAL pilots think NWA's DOH is unfair. ALL NWA pilots think DAL's relative seniority is unfair for many reasons. We do not think DAL's proposal was in the middle, no matter how you guys try to say it is! Hopefully the arbitrators gave a bit of insight and y'all (practicing my southern lingo) will wake up and realize a middle ground from both PROPOSALS is probably the fairest to all.

I'd like to see DOH for everyone hired after the last recalled pilot on both sides. Also, any new hire after 14 APR on the DAL side (about 48???) knew what they were getting into and therefore shouldn't complain about being on the bottom. Do you think ANY of them would have turned down the offer if they knew they would be on the bottom of the combined list? I don't.

 

[ACL65PILOT]

The pilots that were in the first few classes at DAL came to a Company that was still in BK protection, and knew they were on the front end of a major hiring wave. One that got cut short by the merger.
Doing DOH to these pilots would change their relative seniority by more than 6-7%. That is a major sticking point for DALPA and its membership.
The first few classes at DAL in 07 now put these pilots as line holders on everything except the 765 and 777. Their relative seniority is 88.5-91%. That is a big deal.

 

[castle bravo]

"Exactly. Can someone please explain to me how the current DAL eight ball, who has only been on line for a couple of months, can be(relatively speaking) senior to a 00 DEC 19 NWA pilot (baby bus block holder) that has a few hundred pilots below"?



Because there are 2008-hire DAL eight balls who are 767 international block holders right now? Could that be it? Are there any 2008-hires on the 330 as block holders? Are there even any 1999-hires as 330 block holder?

 

[MJ42]

"Exactly. Can someone please explain to me how the current DAL eight ball, who has only been on line for a couple of months, can be(relatively speaking) senior to a 00 DEC 19 NWA pilot (baby bus block holder) that has a few hundred pilots below"?



Because there are 2008-hire DAL eight balls who are 767 international block holders right now? Could that be it?

What??? The eight ball is THE LAST guy(singular) on DAL's list, and he's no line holder.