NWA April 28th Class Stopped

[ACL65PILOT]

Depends whether is was verbal or not. That is why DAL sends the e-mail exactly 15 days before class. (Sometimes earlier, I know) That letter binds them. Good luck trying to prove a verbal offer.

 

[ACL65PILOT]

Occam
What time line are you hearing for this to unfold.

(Less than two weeks)

Has NWALPA been given the ultimatum yet?

 

[imlars]

I got the call from NWA HR today. Last time they called with bad news, today was more bad news. Thank goodness I have not given notice. My company will be peeved I'm still there! They figure they sent the pria forms, completed the background stuff and I'm still there milk'n the AMR cow. Time for a cold one.

 

[ACL65PILOT]

They do not care.

 

[NuGuy]

Occam
What time line are you hearing for this to unfold.

(Less than two weeks)

Has NWALPA been given the ultimatum yet?

Heyas ACL,

DALs picket permit in MSP starts on the 10th. I'd imagine something around that time....CoB on the 11th, maybe?

Nu

 

[ACL65PILOT]

I know about that.

 

[FmrFreightDog]

They made an offer which pilots accepted and in good faith resigned their seniority at other airlines.

HR might not know what they are doing, but that does not excuse their behavior. They need to get nailed on a breach of contract claim. Bastards.

Ok, the class was scheduled to start on the 28th. Today is the 7th. That's 21 days, otherwise known as 3 weeks. Giving 2 weeks notice in this business can often be a dicey proposition. Turning in a letter 3 weeks before a class date is just stupid, and I highly doubt anyone is that dumb.

First of all, I seriously doubt anyone that was scheduled to be in that class has resigned from their current job. Second, it's not a breach of contract as it was a "conditional offer of employment".


Bastards?? I agree. Guilty of a grievous wrong against the 4/28 class and legally culpable?? Not at all.

This is not the first time in history that an airline has canceled a new-hire class. Does it suck? Yeah. Does it make them "bastards"? Nah, they're pretty much already bastards.

I don't get you. Most of the time you seem levelheaded and intelligent, but then you come out with a half-wit "emotion trumps rational thought" post like this.... What gives?

 

[Ty Webb]

Turning in a letter 3 weeks before a class date is just stupid, and I highly doubt anyone is that dumb.

Maybe in your narrow little world, but I gave a resignation more than 3 weeks in advance once . . . .

. . . and when my newhire class was cancelled, my "previous" employer was gracious enough to let me keep working in the same exact position and pay. Why? Because they knew I had integrity and they appreciated it.

 

[~~~^~~~]

FRMRFREIGHT

I think your perspective is the result of years in the airline business where you have observed management behaving in ways that are not acceptable in the "normal" business world.

ACL was correct that it depends on the nature of the job offer....

 

[TNPILOT]

Wow I don't know what to think/say. Somehow I kind of expected this.

 

[cessnapilot]

Ok, the class was scheduled to start on the 28th. Today is the 7th. That's 21 days, otherwise known as 3 weeks. Giving 2 weeks notice in this business can often be a dicey proposition. Turning in a letter 3 weeks before a class date is just stupid, and I highly doubt anyone is that dumb.

First of all, I seriously doubt anyone that was scheduled to be in that class has resigned from their current job. Second, it's not a breach of contract as it was a "conditional offer of employment".


Bastards?? I agree. Guilty of a grievous wrong against the 4/28 class and legally culpable?? Not at all.

This is not the first time in history that an airline has canceled a new-hire class. Does it suck? Yeah. Does it make them "bastards"? Nah, they're pretty much already bastards.

I don't get you. Most of the time you seem levelheaded and intelligent, but then you come out with a half-wit "emotion trumps rational thought" post like this.... What gives?

Many people give more than two weeks notice to an employer who has been good to them. I once gave 2 months notice, only because I knew it would take some time to replace me. I didn’t want to leave this employer in a bad position.

As far as the two week notice, this is just a standard practice. Nothing legally requires two week notice by either side. Most states are “employment at will” states, and the employee or employer can terminate the deal any time.

Lastly, you may be in error by stating that they aren’t legally culpable. The short answer is “it depends.” There is a legal theory called “detrimental reliance.” Read here…

http://www.spsk.com/Articles/empobligations.cfm

best... cp

 

[Occam's Razor]

Occam
What time line are you hearing for this to unfold.

(Less than two weeks)

Has NWALPA been given the ultimatum yet?

Nobody has been given an ultimatum.

Nobody.

Information is seeping out from the Boards of Directors, and both sides are reacting to it.

 

[FmrFreightDog]

FRMRFREIGHT

I think your perspective is the result of years in the airline business where you have observed management behaving in ways that are not acceptable in the "normal" business world.

As is yours.... I fail to see your point.

 

[FmrFreightDog]

Maybe in your narrow little world, but I gave a resignation more than 3 weeks in advance once . . . .

. . . and when my newhire class was cancelled, my "previous" employer was gracious enough to let me keep working in the same exact position and pay. Why? Because they knew I had integrity and they appreciated it.

My "narrow little world" is pretty broad in scope, my friend, but thanks for your condescension. I'm glad that you gave a long notice one time when you were flying for some 2 bit outfit with 3 airplanes and 9 pilots. I admire your integrity. I'm glad it worked out for you and the job was still there when you needed to come back. Clearly, if the circumstances allow, that is the right thing to do. When I turned in my 2 weeks notice to Airline "A" to leave for airline "B", I specifically asked what my options were if the job dried up. I was, more or less, told, "no takebacks".

An airline with +/- 1500 pilots does not care about your integrity. The moment you turn in your notice you are a paperwork issue. Knowing that, why would anyone give one day more notice than necessary? Honestly, if they can't cover "your" flying with three weeks notice, then they probably can't cover it with two weeks notice, so it's not like you're doing the right thing by your employer by going above and beyond the two week notice that decorum and decency dictate. Resigning your seniority number two weeks before your last day is common decency. Resigning your seniority number any time earlier than that is just abject stupidity.

By the way, you don't know me, and you know nothing about my, "narrow little world", so you can happily keep your assumptions to yourself.

 

[FmrFreightDog]

Many people give more than two weeks notice to an employer who has been good to them. I once gave 2 months notice, only because I knew it would take some time to replace me. I didn’t want to leave this employer in a bad position.

Noble concept, but irrelevant when you're talking about an airline with 1000-1500 pilots and 30 more coming in every 2 weeks. It takes no time to replace you in that situation, and giving one second more than the standard two weeks is exposing yourself to unnecessary jeopardy.