NOW will you lemmings get IT??

[NewmanF16]

Well, I'm not sure which is right. The chart's title is "Average number of days worked to pay taxes..." and "Days spent Laboring...120 days"

Your right, on this chart http://www.taxfoundation.org/UserFiles/Image/Tax-Freedom-Day/2007/figure1large2.jpg you can see they figured this based on working 365 days.

OK, I feel better now(NOT), the average American only pays 33.3% of their income in taxes.uke:

 

[FlyFastLiveSlow]

Your right, on this chart http://www.taxfoundation.org/UserFiles/Image/Tax-Freedom-Day/2007/figure1large2.jpg you can see they figured this based on working 365 days.

OK, I feel better now(NOT), the average American only pays 33.3% of their income in taxes.uke:

Better than 46% any way you slice it.

 

[CitationLover]

33.3% is about 33.3% too much........

 

[FlyFastLiveSlow]

33.3% is about 33.3% too much........

Imagine how high a "consumption tax" would actually have to be. More like a European VAT.

 

[Andy]

I can't remember all of the details, and frankly, I don't care. Every legitimate economist in the country trusts these figures. Only crackpots who run websites allege that some sort of malfeasance is taking place. If you want to know the details of how the figures are calculated, what "average" means, etc...., then go do some research on the government CPI website. All of the data is available there.

I've got to disagree with you on that. There are ways to manipulate the numbers; it doesn't take much imagination to make it happen - just adjust the basket of goods with 'similar' (cheaper) items.
I give you props for branding the multitude of economists who have stated that the CPI doesn't accurately reflect the true inflation rate as crackpots. You have fairly effectively killed counter arguments. However, Bill Gross of PIMCO (if you don't know who he is, you don't know much about economics and the markets) discussed that exact topic in an article three years ago. Here's a link: http://www.pimco.com/LeftNav/Featured+Market+Commentary/IO/2004/IO+Con+job+redux+04.htm
Now, if you want to label Bill Gross a crackpot, so be it. You'd be the first that I've heard who labels him a crackpot.

 

[SNOWBUM]

The CPI is an accurate measurement of how much the increase in prices is affecting the average American. If you guys refuse to accept this basic fact, then have at your "sky is falling" mentality. There's simply no help for you.

:laugh::laugh::laugh:, you are clueless about how section 6 is conducted and are also clueless about economy.

You are a sad fellow.

 

[ferlo]

I completely agree with that angle of your post, however, $98 oil and euro = $1.47+ is not good for the consumer.

Labor will give management the finger this time around, I believe, and the costs will be passed onto the pax...however, pax will not book as much. That trip to Grandma's in Fort Myers is gonna be awfully expensive come Xmas time if this keeps up.

Thanks to our visionaries at the Fed, the dollar is going into the toilet.

You cannot have a sound economy with a Third World currency.

Good, if Grandma doesn't like it she take fu@king walk. Greyhound is a nice alternative too, more expensive, but it still works...

 

[PCL_128]

I've got to disagree with you on that. There are ways to manipulate the numbers; it doesn't take much imagination to make it happen - just adjust the basket of goods with 'similar' (cheaper) items.

Any talk of "manipulation" of the numbers implies some sort of government conspiracy to mask the truth. I don't believe in conspiracy theories.

 

[ReverseSensing]

Remember, there are lies, damn lies, and statistics.

Statistics are like loose women: Once you get them, you can do what you want with them.

 

[jetflyer]

Watch Presidential nominee Ron Paul schooling Federal Reserve Chairman Ben Bernanke on monetary inflation and the problems the PRIVATE Federal Reserve has caused and is causing to America as seen on CNBC Nov.7th when Bernanke addressed Congress :
Ron Paul Schools Ben Bernanke Again

and then watch:
Ron Paul: Why we should donate on November 11th(VETERANS DAY)

Did you know the TROOPS have donated more money to Ron Paul than any other Presidential Candidate??

Our country needs this honest man. He'll end the corruption in American Politics. He'll set this country on the right path economically and help lessen the hard times approaching through sound economic policies.

There is a reason Ron Paul broke the single day donation record for a Presidential nominee on November 5th earning $4.2 MILLION dollars:
This man is what America needs!!!

Donate to Ron Paul on November 11th at www.ronpaul2008.com !!
I will be..........

 

[FlyFastLiveSlow]

Any talk of "manipulation" of the numbers implies some sort of government conspiracy to mask the truth. I don't believe in conspiracy theories.

Once again, you surprise me. It doesn't have to be a "conspiracy theory". Why WOULDN'T the numbers be manipulated to make themselves and their policies look better, and whole host of other reasons to make things appear more rosy than they are?

I conclude from your statement then, that management does not manipulate any numbers either, correct?

 

[SDF2BUF2MCO]

Seriously though. A consumption tax would be nice in replacement of the income tax, with rebates on necessities for low income people. A nice side benefit might be for people to think twice before buying all the useless crap they buy, and maybe some of this senseless consumerism would finally be tempered.

While in theory that may be correct but you underestimate our government's insatiable appetite to grow which means more money/taxes. If we stop buying "useless crap" the government will have to make up for that lost tax by raising taxes and/or rates on something else. They have a total dollar figure in mind. How they get there doesn't matter. Kind of like if people stopped smoking cigarettes-the government depends on that tax so they urinate away on something we don't need. In addition, if that "useless crap" is made in America (unlikely today though, see China) then you put Yankees out of a job which means no wage taxes. In turn, we get more lotteries and casinos to make up for the lost taxes - yea!

 

[PCL_128]

In turn, we get more lotteries and casinos to make up for the lost taxes - yea!

Which, much like the cigarette tax you mentioned, are mostly a poor tax. Studies show that very few upper-income Americans participate in these activities. The middle- and low- income Americans end up getting screwed more than anyone else under such a setup.

 

[Patriot328]

www.fairtax.org read it, learn it. Not perfect, but it is much better than the clusterfuk of a tax code we have today.

 

[jetflyer]

www.fairtax.org read it, learn it. Not perfect, but it is much better than the clusterfuk of a tax code we have today.

You know what's better than the tax code we have today? How about NO TAX CODE!?

Flat tax/national sales tax, etc. they're all the same. They're all unnecessary.

Without the Personal Income tax, the governments income from the other taxes including the Corporate Income tax would still be at 2000 levels.

So it's not that radical like Ron Paul argues.
Once again: It's NOT RADICAL. It is if you want to police the world and have government pork and large government bureaucracies that get nothing done and waste money.

Ron Paul will eliminate the income tax for all Americans by incredibly reducing the size of government and bringing our troops home from the 737 overseas bases.

Education is paid for mostly by states.
Roads are paid for by the gas tax.
Social Security has its own tax.
Medicare has its own tax.

The CORPORATE INCOME TAX is exactly the amount of money we CURRENTLY, with our escapades overseas, pay for military expenditures.

He will bring our troops overseas home, which is costing this country close to $1 trillion a year. He still believes in protecting the country and a strong military but wants to end the foreign escapades which has historically been a VERY CONSERVATIVE POSITION as well as the position of the founding fathers.

The country ran fine before the income tax was forced on the American People in 1913.

Learn more about Ron Paul's ideas of reducing government and ELIMINATING the Income Tax here at MINUTE 27:
http://www.ronpauldvdproject.com/

CONSERVATIVES used to believe in limited government and lower taxes. Ron Paul is the ONLY real CONSERVATIVE.

We don't need the income tax if we do as Ron Paul proposes.

We really need smaller government in this country and less taxes. Do you realize how well our free markets would do if we could reduce taxes to even half of what they are today? Ron Paul might be able to do atleast that.

Wouldn't it be amazing to even have your income tax reduced by half!? People could save for their own retirements then and we could phase out the Social Security tax and the Medicare tax like Ron Paul wants to.


I'll take the extra money and save for my own retirement thank you. I'm voting for Ron Paul:
www.ronpaul2008.com

Give this man 5 minutes and Watch this video.
Let him cure your apathy!:
Ron Paul: A New Hope 2.0

There will also be another major Money Bomb like the record $4.3 million Ron Paul earned in one day on November 16th, the anniversary of the Boston Tea Party.
Watch this video about the first RECORD money bomb and the next one:
Ron Paul: Tea Party 07
Then DONATE to Ron Paul....Many others are on these boards.
Jet