No MDA pilots take Republic deal..

[Traumahawk]

Another CFI that knows everything.

Well when you've got some former GIA PFT jerk trying to be the keynote speaker on an issue he knows thing about, and takes stabs at your entire pilot group of which he knows...um, 2 people, you might get defensive.

By the way, every CFI I ever worked with knows way more than the ignorant jerk I'm speaking of. And I don't think poopy pants has been a CFI for QUITE a while.

T-hawk

 

[Bart Simpson]

I am in LaLaLand.

 

[Swaayze]

Well I for one am proud of my fellow U furloughees and WO escapees at MAA. Right or wrong, win or lose, it's nice to see some solidarity and a push for what's right. I like to think I'd have the stones to stand with you if I were there!

 

[FlyingDawg]

"...the fact that some chose poorly"

I'm sorry. Could you just explain to me exactly what decision they made that you believe was "poor"?

Scope limitations on regional jets. This has allowed Delta to slowly take away passengers in every small city between ATL and BOS. In cities that US was the dominate carrier, DL has slowly become the carrier of choice. Look at GSP, AVL, LYH, RIC, GSO, RDU, HKY, TYS, CHA, CHS, and CAE just to name a few. They when they finally allowed RJs it was too late. Now LUV smells blood and goes for the jugular in the hubs.

Parity + 1%. A contract to keep payrates above the average of 4 airlines that were twice the size of US. They tried to compete contractually with carriers that flew from coast to coast, yet they hardly flew past the Mississippi river. Long range routes are the bread and butter of most legacy carriers.

You gotta allow you employer to profit if you want to stay in business. These two decisions spelled doom for US.

 

[stb]

What I dont understand is how many pilots are flying for REP today?

How can CHQ 121 cerificate pilots work for a new unissued REP 121 cetificate ask for their CHQ date of hire when in fact they will be working for essentially a new airline?

If a CHQ pilot gets transfered to the REP certificate, will they have to go through REP indoc and some form of training? Sign new 2 year $15,000 training contract for the new company?

If MDA was getting absorbed by the CHQ 121 certificate, I could understand the "super senority" battle cry.

The argument of the same company owns both airlines thats why the senority list should be the same.
Explain why Delta owns Comair and ASA, AMR owns American and AE, USAir Group owns Usairways, PSA and PDT/ALG. All have their seperate senority list but owned by a larger corporation.

 

[FurloughedAgain]

FlyingDawg:

Scope limitations on regional jets. Did you know that EVERY contract has scope? Scope is the language that defines WHO does the work. There was NEVER a limitation on how many "regional" jets US Airways could fly. The ONLY limitation was who could do the flying. US Airways could have gone out and bought 1000 regional jets in the mid-90s --- they simply had to be flown by US Airways pilots. In fact, they already had a payrate (group 4) based on F28 and BAe 146 pay. (roughly 80 seats). Denouncing "scope" is popular fiction.

Fact is, management wanted to outsource jobs to a cheaper bidder. As you can see, they were successful.

Of the cities you mentioned GSP, AVL, RIC, GSO, RDU, TYS, CHA, CHS, and CAE were ALL served by "regional" jets for YEAAAARS before you started working for Chatauqua. They were served by F28s, F100s, and DC9s. Those were, in fact, "regional jets". They were simply flown by US Airways pilots and not by the lowest bidder.

Parity + 1%. May I remind you that this was Stephen Wolf's idea? It takes TWO to sign a contract. If Brian Bedford came to you guys and said, "hey guys -- I want to start paying you $100/hr to fly the E145" would you tell him, "no. I'm scared that you might not be profitable if you pay me that much!"

No, you let management manage the company. Both sides signed the contract. Not ONE of the 99-01 newhires were on the property as of the date of that signing.

You said, "You gotta allow you employer to profit if you want to stay in business. These two decisions spelled doom for US."
With all due respect, were you even out of flight school in 1997/98 when the parity contract was negotiated? US Airways definately had some network problems that needed to be addressed -- but not the two you focused on.

 

[jaybird]

What I dont understand is how many pilots are flying for REP today?

How can CHQ 121 cerificate pilots work for a new unissued REP 121 cetificate ask for their CHQ date of hire when in fact they will be working for essentially a new airline?

If a CHQ pilot gets transfered to the REP certificate, will they have to go through REP indoc and some form of training? Sign new 2 year $15,000 training contract for the new company?

If MDA was getting absorbed by the CHQ 121 certificate, I could understand the "super senority" battle cry.

The argument of the same company owns both airlines thats why the senority list should be the same.
Explain why Delta owns Comair and ASA, AMR owns American and AE, USAir Group owns Usairways, PSA and PDT/ALG. All have their seperate senority list but owned by a larger corporation.

This is the exact reason why you clowns dog our contract. This is what we had to stop. Our company wanted to start an alter ego airline, non union, similiar to TSA and GJs. We had to sacrifice pay to get all flying under RAH by pilots on the CHQ master seniority list.

 

[FurloughedAgain]

Oh, and by the way Flyingdawg,

I believe that Stickman (page 5 of this thread) wasn't referring to scope or parity when he talked about, "...the fact that some chose poorly"

He did not come back and discuss his meaning so we are left to speculate -- but I believe that he meant that the decision to accept employment with US Airways was a poor decision.

Now I dont know if Stickman has a crystal ball, or other such Harry Potter magic, but if any of you folks were AROUND in 1999 you might have seen a very different world.

US Airways was taking delivery of a new airbus every week. They were hiring 100 pilots per MONTH. The CEO was known throughout aviation history for cleaning up and then merging airlines. After a 7 year hiatus in hiring, US Airways would offer the fastest upgrades of any major airline.

The airlines that you folks fall all over each other to fly for today weren't even on the career pilots radar screen. Jetblue did not exist. AirTran had just furloughed (Oct 98') and was still a dirtbag company.

To say that the decision to go fly for US Airways in 1999 was a poor one is frankly silly.

What would YOU have done?

 

[Crzipilot]

Parity + 1%. A contract to keep payrates above the average of 4 airlines that were twice the size of US. They tried to compete contractually with carriers that flew from coast to coast, yet they hardly flew past the Mississippi river. Long range routes are the bread and butter of most legacy carriers.

You gotta allow you employer to profit if you want to stay in business. These two decisions spelled doom for US.

don't let reality hit you in the face. but the parity+1% was shoved down alpa throats by management, it was their idea. It wasn't till after it resulted in pay raises that some of the alpa group started saying what a great idea it was. either way...at the time, prior to UAl and DAL getting their big pay raise contracts.....the 1% would have been a pay cut I believe.

 

[FlyingDawg]

FlyingDawg:

With all due respect, were you even out of flight school in 1997/98 when the parity contract was negotiated? US Airways definately had some network problems that needed to be addressed -- but not the two you focused on.

Already flying 121 service. Never applied to US. I wasn't impressed by their 10-K statements. I saw many of my fellow CHQ pilots leave to go to US. I thought US had too many in training during the Airbus buildup and thought they might furlough when Boeing products were cast aside. It just seemed that they were trying to fill a void while they transitioned to Airbus. I have since seen too many of those pilots leave come back to CHQ.

I agree that probably that wasn't what was meant by making poor choices. But going to US wasn't exactly the best decision to be made. My economics degree leads me to investigate the financials of any company before making such a leap.