No comment on ASA PBS LOA yet?

[USCtrojan]

How bout them Trojans!

How about them Trojans Speedtape? Who is your team, the Atlanta Falcons?

All 136 is NOT true. As there would be a mix of OO pilots that would be in ATL as well (assuming OneList).

United is already seeing an increase in Summer '10 bookings. Not arguing they are in trouble, but I believe they'll be fine longterm. No, I've not seen the language on the DCI Contract, however, that being said, it was announced the "80%" rule was now changed from ASA to SkyWest Inc. I believe SH announced it awhile back.

Delta does have all control. However, Inc. can be very persuasive in controlling certain costs associated with who flies where. Inc. CONTROLS ASA.

I'm not arguing ASA will be going away. Never have, Speedtape. It will be widdled down as we are the punching bag. As long as things get good, we'll get scraps. When things get bad, we get to be the punching bag (furlough while SkyWest operates in and out of ATL-- yeah yeah yeah, Delta controls that, right?).

I'm fine with commuting the rest of my Career. I can make a change anytime I feel like it. How would you know how I feel about commuting as you have never heard me complain about it? It also affords me the opportunity to see Family much more often than I would. As far as commuting with OneList, fine by me. I gain greater job security. Thank you very much. Inc. can take us into Ch. 11 anytime they want to. They are extremely savvy and their turnaround of ASA is proof (Did Delta control that too? other than the sale?).

I don't argue against ALPA representation Speedtape. I am in favor of it in our present state. I'm not worried about losing representation in favor of OneList. I believe together the pilot groups can decide what is best, since we BOTH have a vested interest in Inc.'s success.

How have I attacked ALPA chump? You beating your chest right now? Watch out for that oncoming traffic, and stay safe you hear?

Trojan

 

[buscap]

OK!!

Shark jump was about 2 pages ago.

For a while the debate actually yielded great points and folks learned some things.

But now the thumb wielding leather jacketed waterboy coaching waterskiing fool has taken to the air!!

It is time to pull the plug on HAL!!



Dave...

Stop..

Will you stop?....Dave...I'm afraid

 

[OCP]

How can there be a “worse PBS system”? Maybe by using a different computer program.
There really isn’t much in this LOA concerning PBS. The vacation bit is about the only thing I noticed. I just can’t see the pilots voting in a PBS system with no vacation language in it, and I doubt that the company would wait until it went to arbitration. Plus the union could say no to arbitration.

Yes there is a lot to do with PBS in this LOA!!! Read it! not the least is it gives the union input in creating the pairings. They have to run the bid solutions together and have to agree before they are published. Maybe you should read it again and focus a little less on what you want to see and what is actually there.

 

[USCtrojan]

OK!!

Shark jump was about 2 pages ago.

For a while the debate actually yielded great points and folks learned some things.

But now the thumb wielding leather jacketed waterboy coaching waterskiing fool has taken to the air!!

It is time to pull the plug on HAL!!



Dave...

Stop..

Will you stop?....Dave...I'm afraid

What you don't like the evolution? ;-).

Trojan

 

[aircombat]

Speedtape, you consistently are trying to make it sound like people wanting an easier commute is the primary reasoning behind OneList. Your reasoning if flawed and also you are a hypocrite because it’s you that has the ulterative motive by wanting to be bought back by Delta.

Skywest may own us, but Delta still controls our destiny. What would be so wrong with being sold? If we were sold, I would imagine the Party who has the most vested interest in us would be the Principal. For that reason, I don't want one list, and don't want to go down that road spending one cent of capital trying to achieve it. (I know that it will never happen, and for good reason!) We are much more valuable as a separate company and it is more beneficial to keep us separate. If I had to guess, I would say that there may be something contractual somewhere that dictates that we will remain separate to protect the interests of Contractor.

You are like the orphan that wants to stay in the orphanage just for the chance that your real parents might come back to pick you up. And to say that it’s less risky is just the furthest thing from the truth. The only way that it would be more risky is if we negotiated a staple.

It’s highly unlikely that we will operate as a separate company forever. That leaves one of three possibilities. We could be sold (not likely), We could be dissolved (a full dissolve is unlikely), or we could be merged (most likely). Waiting around until Skywest is unionized and this goes down on their terms and giving up our leverage, is not a wise idea.

Reference Shuttle America/Rupublic merger. Not much is written about it. I guess people don’t like writing sad stories. Republic wanted a staple, and Shuttle wanted wanted date of hire, since Shuttle America had nothing to bargain with it went to arbitration. The end result was a partial staple for Shuttle America. More than half of the Shuttle pilots were upset with the results. I feel that it’s a little ironic that right before all of that Republic displaced all of Shuttle America from Pittsburg to…., you guessed it, Dulles.

If we had leverage (PBS) we could negotiate “in good faith”. If this goes to arbitration a similar outcome is likely.

 

[buscap]

Die thread!!!

Die!

Die!

Die

 

[aircombat]

Yes there is a lot to do with PBS in this LOA!!! Read it! not the least is it gives the union input in creating the pairings. They have to run the bid solutions together and have to agree before they are published. Maybe you should read it again and focus a little less on what you want to see and what is actually there.

Wow.. It sounds like you should read the LOA. I wrote many pages back how the PWG is a complete false sense of control. I hate repeating myself but I will recap.

The PWG members will “work” 18 days a month and each be credited 108 hrs plus what ever pay they get for union work. There is a provision in there that allows them to do the “work” at home on “weekends, holidays, and scheduling conflicts“. They have no binding input in pairing construction. I repeat no binding input in pairing construction. It will only be taken into “consideration”. Regarding the bid run solutions, for the most part if you bid properly and don’t leave vague preferences there should only be one bid run solution. Since most people will bid properly the wiggle room is going to be very limited to say the least. This safety net has little control and if the PWG argues it will come down to a coin toss.

So I ask again how can there be a “worse PBS system”?

 

[WWEfan]

So I ask again how can there be a “worse PBS system”?

ALPA has the ability to accept and reject bid run solutions. No one else has that. No one. If management starts to exploit "loopholes" in the agreement all ALPA has to do is reject the bid runs. It really is that simple.

 

[OCP]

ALPA has the ability to accept and reject bid run solutions. No one else has that. No one. If management starts to exploit "loopholes" in the agreement all ALPA has to do is reject the bid runs. It really is that simple.

Seems so simple doesn't it? I'm done. I know which way our friend is going to vote. Good luck to us all.

 

[atlcrjdriver]

Die thread!!!

Die!

Die!

Die

This thread must die now....

Combat will vote no to this LOA no matter what anybody on this board posts thus why waste anymore of you time. His mind was made up 24+ pgs ago.