Nja/nji

[Trash8Mofo]

I don't think a lot of people get that because pilots are whores and will save that crew meal just to save perdiem.

Its arguable that per diem would be higher if crew meals weren't provided. For one, CONUS is averaging $55/day for meals in major cities. NJA's Per diem is 1.50/hr. Don't you think that your 3 crew meals are already factored into why the per diem rate is lowered than the CONUS rates? Its hardly being a whore when you are bagging away what you have already paid for IMO.

 

[Guitar Guy]

...NJA's Per diem is 1.50/hr...

Just to clarify, NJA "CONUS" per diem is $1.70, which amounts to $40.80 in a 24-hour period.

 

[G200_PILOT]

G200_PILOT,

Technically, NetJets could maintain separate operating certificates and separate operations, and at same time, have NJA/NJI/NJLA recognized as a "Single Transportation System."

Does it really matter under which certificate any of the NetJets aircraft are operated under? This holds true as long as, all NetJets pilots are placed on the same seniority list; and, all NetJets pilots operate under the same CBA. I.e. The Gulfstream pilots could remain on a separate certificate with recurrents conducted away from CMH.

LOA 01-013 currently states that the current CBA and attached LOA's will apply to all pilots on the NetJets seniority list equally. The only concessions LOA 01-013 gives the Company for the Gulfstream operation are: The 15-Day Flex Schedule will not be offered; and, certain amendments to the process of vacancy awards and the application of seat/equipment/program locks.

IDEtoNJA

OK, I'll reword what I'm trying to get across. REGARDLESS of whether or not we operate under one certificate or 100 certificates, the RULES and the WAY WE DO THINGS will be the same. If NJA pilots are to work under one set of rules and the NJI pilots under another, then what would be the point of going single carrier??? It would be no different than how we do things today. As far as where training will be performed, don't you think there's a reason why we're building a HUGE complex in CMH? Again, as far as that area is concerned, I could care less.

All I care about is that after the single carrier fiasco is complete, we're all wearing the same uniforms and all working under the same rules. That's it!

 

[CA1900]

I'm personally going to hate to see us go to perdiem. While the A side flies every day we just don't. The planes and trips aren't like that. So having nice dinners and lunches are a way for us to bond...

Keep in mind, though, that NJA guys can choose between meal receipts or per-diem when they're outside the CONUS. If I'm in a hotel in London for four days, you bet I'll be going on receipts. $60/day will barely cover dinner!

I can count on one hand how many times I went to dinner on the A side...

Maybe they just didn't like you?

I try and go at least once a tour, preferably more, if time permits. Doesn't always work, but two hands aren't enough for me to count the dinners this year alone. Some of that might be fleet-dependent, of course; the workload's been lighter for me in the Excel than this time last year.

I side, dinner if you'd like to, room service if you want, and its that simple task that can bring a crew and a company together....

Room service with the crew, eh?

imp:

 

[RTRHD]

G200_PILOT,

Under the provisions of the current NJA CBA the Company could and probably would require you to exceed any and all duty time limitation in case the duty period in order to accommodate extended international travel duty only!

Now, one would receive overtime compensation for any and all duty hours beyond 12, as well as, "compensatory" rest on the back-end.

IDEtoNJA

So G200 is Wrong.........Is that what you are saying?

 

[RTRHD]

G200_PILOT,

Technically, NetJets could maintain separate operating certificates and separate operations, and at same time, have NJA/NJI/NJLA recognized as a "Single Transportation System."

Does it really matter under which certificate any of the NetJets aircraft are operated under? This holds true as long as, all NetJets pilots are placed on the same seniority list; and, all NetJets pilots operate under the same CBA. I.e. The Gulfstream pilots could remain on a separate certificate with recurrents conducted away from CMH.

LOA 01-013 currently states that the current CBA and attached LOA's will apply to all pilots on the NetJets seniority list equally. The only concessions LOA 01-013 gives the Company for the Gulfstream operation are: The 15-Day Flex Schedule will not be offered; and, certain amendments to the process of vacancy awards and the application of seat/equipment/program locks.

IDEtoNJA

So G200 is Wrong Again .........Is that what you are saying? Sorry to be so blunt!

 

[G200_PILOT]

RTRHD, you better do some more investigating before coming across like some kind of know it all. The words "should" and "could" don't mean squat.

As far as LOAs are concerned, don't you think that once the merger or integration is complete, IBB2 will happen and do away with those LOAs? I'm not saying that at the beginning, during integration, there won't be differences. I'm saying that once it's all hashed out, all the rules will apply to everyone. There are 2800 guys over here that will flat out refuse to give you guys ONE single seniority number if, in the end, differences and/or favorites still exist.

Remember, up till now, I'm one of the guys that's looking forward to you guys coming over. It's the attitude of some that may ruin that for everyone. Keep riding around on that high horse of yours expressing how you guys are sooooo much different than us and see what happens.

Sorry to be so blunt.

 

[Diesel]

Problem is when you just land from a foreign country at 2am and want to order some room service, your messed up on time zone 40 bucks perdiem isn't going to cover your coke and salad plus the service fee.

perdiem, its gonna suck. I think most here would agree. I wouldn't have thought so looking from the A side over at the I. But i've been on both sides of the fences.

 

[gutshotdraw]

We won't be coming to CMH for company indoc since NJI will continue to operate as a separate company, with a separate operations center, a separate operating certificate, and yes, some different company policies. The only difference after the "merger" is that the entire pilot group will be represented by NJASAP and the collective bargaining agreement (and applicable LOA's)./QUOTE]


OK, can you please tell me where you're getting your information from? I know you're a smart guy. You passed a Gulfstream type ride so you have to have SOME brains! Nonetheless, I don't quite think you know what "single carrier" means. If you think the only thing that will change is that you will now be part of a Union, you're in for a rude awakening. No, I don't know how the specifics will pan out but I can tell you that IF the two entities were to join in recognition of a "single carrier", then we won't be operating as two separate companies. Please keep that in mind while you're typing away trying to explain to me how it's going to be.

1. Merger is the wrong term. Integration is more correct. That is, at some point in the next 6-24 months, the company will integrate the pilot groups so that ALL pilots hold a seniority number (based on DOH) with NJASAP and are subject to the collective bargaining agreement and ALL CURRENT AND SUBSEQUENT LETTERS OF AGREEMENT. That means, there will be LOAs regarding the pilot list integration and the SEPARATE operations of NJA and NJI much the same as NJLA.

2. "Single Carrier" can only be determined by the National Mediation Board after the petition is filed, arguments heard, and a decision rendered. I don't think it will get that far. I believe Woodbridge will opt for an orderly, friendly, and timely integration of the pilot seniority lists while maintaining a separate operating identity for NJI.

3. Tell you what G200. You go the store and pick your favorite $50-$75 dollar Cabernet. Buy a case and find a nice, cool, dark corner in your house to store it. I'll do the same. Five years from now, if NJI no longer exists, I'll bring my case of wine to indoc at CMH and leave it for you. If, on the other hand, NJI is still operating as a separate entity with operations, training, HR, accounting, etc. still down in Okatie (albeit with all pilots proud members of NJASAP), you can bring your case to Savannah for me when you bid the G and we'll open a bottle of each and see which is best. He11, we'll even invite Diesel and RTRHD for an independent opinion.

Bottom line, I expect to be paying dues, earning hourly overtime, and otherwise working under the terms of the CBA sometime between now and the end of 2010. Other than that, I don't expect much to change.

 

[RTRHD]

He11, we'll even invite Diesel and RTRHD for an independent opinion.

Now thats funny, I don't care where your from!!!

Hey G200 I am not really a bad guy,a bit of a smart asss granted. I am not a smart man. (Forrest Gump voice) But it just don't make sense to through away a company and say what you want RTS is pretty sharp. I know about the duplication HR,payroll,yada,yada.

 

[Diesel]

It better not be two buck chuck. While a critically acclaimed wine lets make sure that RTRHD and I don't have to suffer.

 

[CA1900]

Hey, Two Buck Chuck was up to about $4 at the Trader Joe's in CMH. :laugh:

 

[IDEtoNJA]

1. Merger is the wrong term. Integration is more correct. That is, at some point in the next 6-24 months, the company will integrate the pilot groups so that ALL pilots hold a seniority number (based on DOH) with NJASAP and are subject to the collective bargaining agreement and ALL CURRENT AND SUBSEQUENT LETTERS OF AGREEMENT. That means, there will be LOAs regarding the pilot list integration and the SEPARATE operations of NJA and NJI much the same as NJLA.

2. "Single Carrier" can only be determined by the National Mediation Board after the petition is filed, arguments heard, and a decision rendered. I don't think it will get that far. I believe Woodbridge will opt for an orderly, friendly, and timely integration of the pilot seniority lists while maintaining a separate operating identity for NJI.

3. Tell you what G200. You go the store and pick your favorite $50-$75 dollar Cabernet. Buy a case and find a nice, cool, dark corner in your house to store it. I'll do the same. Five years from now, if NJI no longer exists, I'll bring my case of wine to indoc at CMH and leave it for you. If, on the other hand, NJI is still operating as a separate entity with operations, training, HR, accounting, etc. still down in Okatie (albeit with all pilots proud members of NJASAP), you can bring your case to Savannah for me when you bid the G and we'll open a bottle of each and see which is best. He11, we'll even invite Diesel and RTRHD for an independent opinion.

Bottom line, I expect to be paying dues, earning hourly overtime, and otherwise working under the terms of the CBA sometime between now and the end of 2010. Other than that, I don't expect much to change.

Gutshotdraw,

I agree with most of your postings as of late! However, I do not believe that additional LOA's are certain.

NetJets management may or may not approach the NJASAP leadership to negotiate amendments to the Agreement. Furthermore, the NJASAP leadership, and, its membership may or may not agree to some or all of the requested amendments.

I believe that LOA 01-013 can be used as the sole framework for the integration. Do I believe that additional amendments would help NetJets as a whole with the integration? Probably! But, such amendments are not certain due to the nature of the process.

IDEtoNJA

P.S. I know that you don't know me; but, am I not invited?!

 

[G200_PILOT]

Now thats funny, I don't care where your from!!!

Hey G200 I am not really a bad guy,a bit of a smart asss granted. I am not a smart man. (Forrest Gump voice) But it just don't make sense to through away a company and say what you want RTS is pretty sharp. I know about the duplication HR,payroll,yada,yada.

Well I'm glad this conversation is calming down a bit. It's not where I wanted it to go. Who knows what the future holds. I hope we all integrate and live as one big happy family but that's just MY hopes and desires. To me, single carrier always meant getting rid of the whole "They're NJI and we're NJA" bull. As I always understood it, single carrier would get rid of all that and we would all be one.

Guess we'll just have to wait and see.

PS... I'd love to share some wine and conversation with ANY of you down in SAV while I'm there! It's one of my favorite overnights.

 

[RTRHD]

Well I'm glad this conversation is calming down a bit. It's not where I wanted it to go. Who knows what the future holds. I hope we all integrate and live as one big happy family but that's just MY hopes and desires. To me, single carrier always meant getting rid of the whole "They're NJI and we're NJA" bull. As I always understood it, single carrier would get rid of all that and we would all be one.

Guess we'll just have to wait and see.

PS... I'd love to share some wine and conversation with ANY of you down in SAV while I'm there! It's one of my favorite overnights.

Heck this is not and out of hand conversation,remember back in 05 that was a all out internet war.:laugh: I do think we will all be the same soon with differences. But I don't know shtt. I will drink beer while yall drink wine I can't ever find straws long enough for the wine bottles.

But Diesel does lose the dinner bet if so single carrier lawsuit is not filed.LoL

 

[G200_PILOT]

He's a gold tie and always will be....:beer:

 

[Helmsalee]

Hey! I'm in. I love good red wine and Savannah. Shoot, I graduated from high school with Paula Deene. BTW, did you know she was the cap of the cheerleaders.

 

[flyjetspeed]

Well I'm glad this conversation is calming down a bit. It's not where I wanted it to go. Who knows what the future holds. I hope we all integrate and live as one big happy family but that's just MY hopes and desires. To me, single carrier always meant getting rid of the whole "They're NJI and we're NJA" bull. As I always understood it, single carrier would get rid of all that and we would all be one.

Guess we'll just have to wait and see.

PS... I'd love to share some wine and conversation with ANY of you down in SAV while I'm there! It's one of my favorite overnights.

Here's my .02


I expect the virtual seniority list will become the NJA/NJLA/NJI Pilot Seniority List, By agreement IAW LOA 01-13…….Soon

I expect that the NJI Operations Center (NOC) will continue to schedule, flight plan and dispatch the GIV, GV, G-450 and G-550 after the integration just as they do now. I believe the Falcon 2000’s 7x’s, BBJ;s and any other internationally capable fleet normally crewed by 2 pilots and a flight attendant will also wind up being handled out of the NOC at Okatie as well.

I expect the work rules at NJI will be adjusted to fit the business and our owners needs while maintaining the excellent QOL for the crews. Obviously that adjustment would be best negotiated in IBB2 and any concerns about fairness or favoritism will be settled in that process.

I expect the involvement of NJASAP in the lives of the NJI pilot group to be a positive one and look forward to that participation with high hopes, in return for the dues I will pay as my QOL improves even beyond what it is now.

As for per diem, uniforms, crew meals, badges, nametags and any other minor incidentals…….Well……..Don’t care!



PS If I can get an invite I will gladly buy the first (or last) bottle of wine or round of single malt as my friend with the Helo obsession can attest. CU in Savannah

 

[RTRHD]

PS If I can get an invite I will gladly buy the first (or last) bottle of wine or round of single malt as my friend with the Helo obsession can attest. CU in Savannah

Yea we will all crash Gut Shot's party. BUT I WILL NOT DRINK WINE WITH YOU REMEMBER LAST TIME!!!!
Beer only :laugh:

 

[flyjetspeed]

Yea we will all crash Gut Shot's party. BUT I WILL NOT DRINK WINE WITH YOU REMEMBER LAST TIME!!!!
Beer only :laugh:

Oh Oh Oh ya blame me! I STILL can't show may face in the Park Lane Hilton without looking around to see if anyone recognices me. oK buddy Then the BEER is on me!