NJA B757 & 767 aircraft

[xpdriver]

Well the guys initials are M.A. and he is your (NJA Large Aircraft LLC) Director of Standards and Safety. I seriously doubt that he is paying for this training at Delta out of his own pocket. Good luck as it sounds like things are moving over there, which is more than you can say for most operations these days.

Well I hope it is true but if will be awhile before someone with my number will see it,if at all...M.A. I will have to look him up.. until next time...

 

[NetjetsFalcon]

Diesels' absolutly right. I got screwed out of a BBJ captain bid in 2001 because of all our "highly skilled" contract pilots. I will not happen again. Ever. I've been waiting a loooooong time for this job to payoff, and If 75/76's show up, WE are DEFINATELY flying them. The contract is airtight in this respect.

NJACMH you sir are an idiot. You can't even tell how NJA, NJM, NJI works.

 

[NJACMH]

(NJACMH)Oh your back, didn't you have enough during our contract. About your post,maybe but I don't think so. NJA will manage from the air,as in the cockpit. Unless this is rts,cuts are coming, lookout!!!

LMAO!

 

[Diesel]

The only ones that are laughing are njacmh's coworkers upstairs at what a spectical he's making of himself.

 

[notaNJApilot]

Well the guys initials are M.A. and he is your (NJA Large Aircraft LLC) Director of Standards and Safety. I seriously doubt that he is paying for this training at Delta out of his own pocket. Good luck as it sounds like things are moving over there, which is more than you can say for most operations these days.

I hope you aren't trying to conceal his identity, because anyone with a seniority list can figure out who your source is.

 

[Spooky 2]

Was not. Just trying to be discreet about it since some one previously seemed to doubt the verasity of this report. Again good luck to all of you.

 

[filejw]

Ref EMJ.If they take over a corporate flt operation the pilots generally come with and fly the same a/c.B757 or C150.

 

[NetjetsFalcon]

I don't recall EJM ever taking over a 121 air carrier operation. I Netjets buys a B757 from a coporate flight department and uses it for charter, quarter shares, marquis or whatever, our scope clause prohibits anyone but NJA pilots from flying it. If EJM did happen to manage it, they could only use it for that individual private corporation.

Ref EMJ.If they take over a corporate flt operation the pilots generally come with and fly the same a/c.B757 or C150.

 

[NetjetsFalcon]

Here's the reference for your viewing pleasure...

1.5(d) EJM or Subsequently Acquired Aircraft Management Companies 1.5(d)(i) Flying of owned, leased or managed aircraft by EJM or subsequently acquired aircraft management companies, which are neither fractionally owned nor part of the Company’s core fleet, is not covered by Section 1.3(a) of this Agreement, provided, however, that flying performed for NJA or flying (other than charters or on a managed basis) for (a) the Company's fractional owners, (b) its Marquis Card Program owners, or other jet card leaseholders of Company aircraft, or (c) other comparable programs, is not subject to this exception and remains covered by Sec. 1.3(a). Neither EJM nor any subsequently acquired aircraft management company shall engage in scheduled operations subject to Parts 121 or 135, or fractional operations subject to Part 91k of the Federal Aviation Regulations. This provision is subject to Paragraphs 1.5(c) and 1.5(d)(iii). 1.5(d)(ii) EJM may not operate aircraft in excess of 100,000 lbs GTOW in which the Company has a financial interest; EJM will not operate other aircraft in excess of 100,000 lbs GTOW in situations where the union agrees with NJA to operate the aircraft under the terms of the business agreement with the customer, at rates of pay and rules equivalent to those established by the CBA or as established pursuant to Section 1.11

Ref EMJ.If they take over a corporate flt operation the pilots generally come with and fly the same a/c.B757 or C150.

 

[Correcting]

EJM may not operate aircraft in excess of 100,000 lbs GTOW in which the Company has a financial interest; EJM will not operate other aircraft in excess of 100,000 lbs GTOW in situations where the union agrees with NJA to operate the aircraft under the terms of the business agreement with the customer, at rates of pay and rules equivalent to those established by the CBA or as established pursuant to Section 1.11

That is why EJM won't be flying the planes, if they come. And yes, for those of you who don't keep track at home, EJM is owned by NJA. NJI won't fly them either. Why? Because that's also in clear, black and white, language in the scope clause. So that leaves only us lowly NJA pilots.

Now sure, there are you cynics out there from ALPA that have been raped up and down because of your sh!!ty scope clauses that will say "scope doesn't mean anything." Well, I guess that's for lawyers and judges to decide if it comes to that.

 

[RTRHD]

Now sure, there are you cynics out there from ALPA that have been raped up and down because of your sh!!ty scope clauses that will say "scope doesn't mean anything." Well, I guess that's for lawyers and judges to decide if it comes to that.

Now that is a correct statement. And they will use case law from the ALPA cases. Opps

 

[xpdriver]

Ref EMJ.If they take over a corporate flt operation the pilots generally come with and fly the same a/c.B757 or C150.

Not really, That usually happen at NJI with the gulfstreams. Ejm hires pilots for the plane that are leased back from a company or person.And when those aircraft are gone so are the pilots. How do I know this, ask the 10 or so that had to start over at the bottom after the layoff from EJM. There is always adds looking for pilots with a type to come and fly a particular aircraft.

 

[Dassault]

If you don't think scope clauses work, you need to read a little more about all the issues the regional airlines are having trying to operate larger and larger RJ's without violating their mainline scope clauses.

 

[Ultra Grump]

If you don't think scope clauses work, you need to read a little more about all the issues the regional airlines are having trying to operate larger and larger RJ's without violating their mainline scope clauses.

That's exactly right. It's not the courts poking holes in the majors' scope clauses, it's the companies' and pilots' concessionary agreements doing that.

 

[imotis]

Here's a thought. NJ approaches an individual and says "Hey, how 'bout you getting a 757 and putting it on EJMs certificate. We'll charter it from you and make it worth your while." Wink, wink, nudge, nudge.
Not owned by any NJ entity, not flown by NJ pilots, yet doing what NJ needs it to do.
I'm sure some one will show the errors in my thinkin' and I'm too dumb to figger out all the legalees in the contract that I don't have access to anyway.

 

[Guitar Guy]

...I'm sure some one will show the errors in my thinkin' and I'm too dumb to figger out all the legalees in the contract that I don't have access to anyway.

If you want to view the contract, go to http://www.ibt1108.org/, click on "NetJets Pilots", then "Info for New Hires" and then select "Contract". It's all there for the viewing by any interested party and no password is required.

 

[imotis]

OK, thanks. I'll still probably be overwhelmed and cornfused with the legal-speak though.

 

[Guitar Guy]

OK, thanks. I'll still probably be overwhelmed and cornfused with the legal-speak though.

No problem and good luck if you decide to try to wade through verbiage containted therein with regards to scope.

 

[Publishers]

There are a bunch of aircraft on EJM certificate that are owned and crewed by others. A different level certificate is required for 757 and 767.

 

[Fozzy]

There are a bunch of aircraft on EJM certificate that are owned and crewed by others.

Pub,
You are a idiot. What do you thing EJM does?

 

[Publishers]

Probably but there may be some people on this board who do not understand the relationship between all the companies and who crews what plus what certificates are held by who what and where.
Obviously you are one of those superior people that knows all this. BTW I would be at EJM if I wanted to live in CVG however I am allergic to winter.

 

[Diesel]

you can't be that stupid. EJM has planes all over the country.

 

[gunfyter]

He meant in management

 

[Diesel]

I guess he would be the perfect manager. He knows all and will make sure the pilots know that he does.

Eeeeech

 

[Publishers]

We have already established that I started and served in management positions in several 135 and 121 carriers, was a transport aircraft category trader for a major lessor, published a magazine, am involved with several aviation associations.

 

[FLYLOW22]

We have already established that I started and served in management positions in several 135 and 121 carriers, was a transport aircraft category trader for a major lessor, published a magazine, am involved with several aviation associations.

AND you are SMELI rated. Don't forget that fact!

 

[realityman]

Sigh. It's funny, but if you read the threads on this board long enough, you begin to see a lot of repetition. Same old stuff, different topic.

Basically, I'm seeing nearly the exact same people who claimed we'd never get a decent contract, management would never meet our demands, we were way out of line with our actions to get our contract, and that our new local was corrupt and didn't really have our (the pilots') best interests at heart, now spouting the same crap along the lines of you guys are dreaming if you think management can't make an end run around your stupid scope clause, the union will have surprisingly little power to enforce anything, and my absolute favorite: my source can beat up your source!!!

Sheesh! Don't you doomsayers ever get tired of being so negative? IF we ever get airline equipment (beyond our present BBJ's), it WILL be flown by pilots on the NJA seniority list. Heck, I remember a time when certain people were so SURE that the BBJ's would go to NJI. That turned out to be really accurate, huh?

I could care less about flying 75's or 76's. I enjoy the "small iron" and don't care to roam the globe for 3 or 4 weeks at a time away from my family, so personally I could care less who flys them. but we have pretty ironclad scope and a local union that doesn't sit on its hands when it looks like the rules are being broken.

Besides, when the planes show up on the ramp, painted in our colors, and laoding pax for the first trip, I'll believe the "sources" that say we're getting them.

 

[FLYLOW22]

Man! Those two pilots flying the 767 are gonna have to show 4 hours prior to load the bags into the cargo pods while the rampers sit around and pick their noses.

BTW... Scope. It ain't just for bad breath anymore. We're some of the last in the industry to actually have some. Ask the NWA guys... they are the latest victims.

 

[brokeflyer]

A friend of mine who has been a part of the management team over at the Large Aircraft division at Net Jets says they have purchased two B767-200ER's. I happen to be familiar with the aircraft in question and was wondering how these aircraft, along with the B757's will impact the pilot group at NJ? Will these be handled and manned the same as the BBJ's. Sounds interesting for the pilot group. The guy I know is down at Delta at this time doing a requal in the 757 as he had prior experience about 10 or 12 years ago.

I think the impact will be that some of us don't have to fly the BBj anymore.

 

[Apache06]

Cav

Go, they applied for it last year and the last I heard we were blessed 121 as of last fall and it will go under EJM.

What Cav units were you in? I was in 3/7th in Schweinfurt and 1/17 Air Cav 82d Abn Div.

Garry Owen!