New pilot eager for advice!!!!

[pilotyip]

MSW, you area rare sample of doing it all. I endorse your career path, because you did the important thing in your career. You flew airplanes, if you want to be a pilot you have to fly airplanes. The sooner the better. A 4-yr. degree has nothing to do with flying an airplane. Nice to have, fun to do, neat piece of paper to hang on the wall. You will most likely impress your future employers by your endeavor, but no more so than a pilot who took 6 yrs to get his degree and has 5000 hrs at age 25, with a 1000 hrs of TJ PIC. TJ PIC is still the resume fluff that separates the wanta be's from the pilots getting jobs. You are in good shape for the June 2007 hiring boom. BTW what is your degree in?

 

[Crimson03]

1. Go to college, any college, get an undergraduate degree in anything. Seriously.

2. Be aware that for some people, perhaps yourself hard to know until you've been there, what you do for work becomes work.

3. If you don't heed #2 you might run out of entertaining pasttimes someday.

 

[chrisdahut24]

wrong thread

 

[pilotyip]

If you want to be a college grad, by all means go to college for whatever reason motivates you to go to college. If you want to be a career pilot, fly airplanes. College has nothing to do with flying airplanes

 

[Onlyflyfreight]

Ooohhh! I wish it was like that!

Makes sense, but it's to bad some of the employers that I'd like to work for don't feel that way!

 

[Crimson03]

If you want to be a college grad, by all means go to college for whatever reason motivates you to go to college. If you want to be a career pilot, fly airplanes. College has nothing to do with flying airplanes

In some way I have to agree with this. The college is for when the flying is no longer fun, economically viable, tolerable, etc. That said college is easier to get done when you are young. Pilot wages are going to keep on falling, because they can. Flying as a profession already is but will become more so a job that people do for ten years or so and move on, with a few lifer stragglers that don't know when to or have the gumption to do something else.

 

[pilotyip]

Not crimson, you can still make a $100K per year by age 30 without a college degree and most likely have 11-13 days off per month. That is not a bad career goal. Especially considering you may be doing something you love to do. There many people in the US who would be envious of your position. According to the latest stats, household income more than $90K/yr puts that household in the upper 10% of US household income.

 

[msw]

pilotyip: To answer your question, my BS Degree is in Aeronautical Engineering.

To comment a bit more to the (presumably) young person who originally started the thread ........

I agree with Pilotyip to a certain extent, that a college degree really has nothing to do with the ability to fly an airplane, or to do so well. But for a young person just "starting out" in life, who knows they want to be a pilot, getting a college degree is all about having options for your future. When I was a 16 year old student pilot, I just KNEW I wanted to be an airline pilot. When I got my Private Pilot License on my 17th birthday, I still just knew I wanted to be an airline pilot. When I was 20 years old, flying sched 135 pax flights as a PIC in a Navajo Chieftain, I knew the airlines were where I was headed. By 23 years old, I was bored with gear up, autopilot on, tired of sleeping in motels and hanging out in airport lobbies, and was looking for a new career/adventure. Ironically, I ended up in another career field that also really had no great requirement for college educated employees ....... but which did satisfy my lust for action and adventure. But there were other career fields that I almost went into (at 23 years old) that would have required a college degree....... and having the college degree gave me the option to pursue those fields of endeavor, or not.

Two other minor points: A college degree is insurance (to a certain extent) if you lose your medical, as others have written. And..... I cannot tell you how many people I have met, over the years, who were in their 30's or 40's and WISHED they had gotten a college degree earlier in their life (before marriage, kids, families, jobs) when it would have been a lot easier and simpler for them to do so. It'll be easier now for you to get that degree, than later!

But my main point is this: Most young folks (teenagers) think they know everything - my two teenage kids certainly think so - but we all change as we mature, and sometimes our goals and desires in life change too. By all means, pursue your flying. But if you can also weave a college education into your current (flying) plans and activities as well, I think it will pay off in the future, but giving you more options.

 

[NYCPilot]

Nice post MSW.

 

[dream2fly2007]

Change your user name. It sounds ridiculous.

No it doesn't! It actually has meaning.....I dream to fly (don't we all???) and graduate in 2007 when I can actually realize my dreams....so I came up with dream2fly2007, which is cool. Unlike NYCpilot, which is gay.

 

[pilotyip]

Fall back value of degree over rated

Repeat post, but it fits here. You have to decide on what you want to be a college graduate or a pilot. If is a pilot, you fly airplanes and build resume stuff. It will take approximately 10 years to get to a career position in aviation. You have to commit to the time frame to make it. To not fly and get a degree may be fun but it does nothing for your flying career. Now to get a degree on the side while you are flying, nothing wrong with that. However, the fallback value of a degree is greatly over rated. I have a BS and a Master's in Management, but at age 53, I was making $250/wk loading cargo. After Zantop pretended to go out of went out of business in 1997, I had been a temporary High School Chemistry Teacher up until two weeks before the cargo job came along. However, they do not teach school in the summer so I had to take the cargo job. The value of an unused degree is highly over rated. 53 year old unemployed airline pilots are not eagerly greeted in any industry that I know of, even of having a couple degrees. Of course, I did not apply for many of the "College degree preferred jobs" such as apt manager, telephone direct sales, plumping floor manager at Home Depot, etc. If you get a college degree you have to use, the knowledge gained in college to develop a career or the degree is useless. After getting a degree, flying an airplane is not a knowledge expanding experience; it is skill development experience. Anyone care to chime in and share their experiences on entering the non-aviation job market after being out of college 20-30 years? Of we are going to hear from a guy who's brother knows guy that has a friend who dropped out of flying at age 51 and started his own company and now flies his 737 BJ becasue he makes 10M per year.

 

[Crimson03]

dream2fly2007 understand that pilotyip's position is valid onlywith the qualifier of being a pilot without other options. Of course not having flown for a living you really don't know whether or not it is for you. And college is easier and a lot more fun at 18 than 30.
Go to college fly on the side, party. Then try flying for a living.

 

[pilotyip]

You can never make into a flying career by trying it out for a couple years and findings out you are not a major Captain. The love of flying has to be there to make this career a go. You have to give it a 10-year try. If you are in it for the money, respect, or recognition as a potential astronaut candidate, you may be disappointed.

 

[aviatrix]

No it doesn't! It actually has meaning.....I dream to fly (don't we all???) and graduate in 2007 when I can actually realize my dreams....so I came up with dream2fly2007, which is cool. Unlike NYCpilot, which is gay.

Oooohhhh.....busted by the 16 year-old!! That hurts!
My advice would be this:
There's a lot you can learn about aviation before you ever spend a dime! Get your hands on some of the classic reads out there: "Stick and Rudder," "Flying the Line," etc. Anything by Ernest Gann! In reality, this job can be obtained with little more effort than a $70,000 check and a few checkrides passed! But there's a lot more to it! Dont get into so much of a hurry that you bypass all the fun stuff! There's a lot of character built by washing a few airplanes for lesson money, hangar-flying with generations-older aviators and listening to their tales, spending your hard-earned money on an early morning lesson!
In this era of pilot factories churning out 20 year-old ERJ pilots with braces still on their teeth and a backpack slung over their shoulder, I implore you....to take the time to really discover the great things about flying! I'll tell you this......it's not about the number of hours you have, or who flies the cooler RJ, that's for sure!
Good luck, kid! Stay humble and always keep learning! It's a blast, but it's also important to preserve the dignity of this profession and not add to the "race to the bottom!"

 

[BoDEAN]

Can anyone give me any pointers into how I can make my dreams to obtain the world's best job a reality, in the shortest time? I've looked at some posts and found some useful information, but can't find anything that would give a good breakdown of the route it takes to get to a commercial airline job.

The most direct advice would be: There is no "ONE WAY" to go. If there were, everyone would go that route. There are so many roads to get to your dream job (aviation college, big ten college, CFI, Military, bush pilot, freight pilot, etc, etc). What ever route lands in your lap, follow it, and make the best of the long road ahead. Been 8 years since I started flying, and just had my first airline interview yesterday. Best of luck to you! Great family on here too, you found a great home.

 

[Goose Egg]

The value of an unused degree is highly over rated. 53 year old unemployed airline pilots are not eagerly greeted in any industry that I know of, even of having a couple degrees.

No offense, but an unemployed 53 year old anything is not greated eagerly in any other industry, and there's not a freakin' thing that any of us can do about it because it's a risk associated with life. Nobody has a crystal ball. But I'd sure as heck rather be a furloughed 30 something with a backup rather than having nothing because I skipped college.

Heck, I might not even like flying for a living (aside from instructing, which I find quite fulfilling.) Because of my education, I could really do anything else I'd want.

And what's the big hurry in life anyway? It's too short as it is. Experiences such as college are good for you. I'm glad I didn't miss out on that!

What would I do if I could do it all again? The same, only I'd make a few adjustments. But then again, it all has worked out pretty well.

Baby steps, baby steps.

-Goose

 

[414Flyer]

I would suggesting not "dreaming" to fly either. Too many go into it because its their dream and end up dispensing with all rational thought, and then do things like fly for free or pay to fly, because well its their "dream"

A lot of pilots do things they would not normally do, like fly broken planes, break FARs, all because its their dream and they have to fly they feel. Dont let people crap on you, because they know flying is your dream and you wont do anything else

While I guess having it as a dream is fine, but try and be rational when going about it. Dont toss ones brain out the window on takeoff, just because its aviation.

Try and treat it like a real job, because it is. I think if more did, maybe we would have less pilots, or at least ones who would not accept such pathetic pay because they are too busy dreaming about the next step on the ladder, instead of thinking about their present reality.

I think if you go visit one of those academies all starry eyed with your head in the clouds, and talking about your dream of flying, they will take advantage of that and feed you every line of BS they can, because you are going into it emotionally, and that salesperson sees a big commission coming his way.

Try and be as rational about this as you can. Think about costs incurred to you, how long it will take to finish, what you can REALISTICALLY expect to make. Also expect to possibly have to pay more than the flight school tells you.

And dont go by best case scenarios, be realistic, or even worst case.

 

[dal72]

If you want to be a pilot skip college and start flying airplanes, you will be logging TJ PIC long before the guy who goes to college and be in the front of the line when looking for a career job.

Don't most airlines these days require a college degree?

 

[WillowRunVortex]

Heck, I might not even like flying for a living (aside from instructing, which I find quite fulfilling.) Because of my education, I could really do anything else I'd want.



-Goose

Great post Goose

 

[WillowRunVortex]

I would suggesting not "dreaming" to fly either. Too many go into it because its their dream and end up dispensing with all rational thought, and then do things like fly for free or pay to fly, because well its their "dream"

A lot of pilots do things they would not normally do, like fly broken planes, break FARs, all because its their dream and they have to fly they feel. Dont let people crap on you, because they know flying is your dream and you wont do anything else

.

Man, this should be part of the PVT test. I'm not kidding, this is profound.

414 has a good head on his shoulders. What he desrcibes is exactly what happens, especially in freight aviation.