New Contract

[Occam's Razor]

I'm back up to 65 releases a day and doing my own CLC. There's no comparison to NWA dispatchers because they don't do that much work. Do you really think the TWU is going to help us out there, Razor? Twist that up and dissect it any way you want to but that's B.S. I don't care what you say.

Wow! Sounds like a heavy load.

Here are some options:

1. Walk into your bosses office by yourself and tell him/her that the workload is total BS, and you want it fixed!

2. Have all the dispatchers at your company walk into the office and tell him/her that the workload is total BS, and you all want it fixed.

Which method do you reckon would get their attention more?

That is the concept behind...wait for it....collective bargaining.

Certainly it's not quite that simple, since our good friends in the government think the Railway Labor Act is a fair way to ensure that managements get to play the white pieces...while your side plays the black. There are also inherent challenges with any organization that must collectively assign priorities to issues. You may value workload higher than your collegues do. Or it could be pay.

It's not easy, and it's not particularly fun. I've had to walk off my job with 100% of my collegues when my management didn't listen when we used method #2. After 15-days of no flight ops, we got the contract we wanted.

The success of your efforts will depend on the skills of your union leadership, and the degree to which your rank-and-file participate in the process. Union leaders won't tell you what's going on?

Fire 'em! NOW!

To do that you're gonna have to get engaged in the process...even if you don't like it.

Or you can just whine about it.

Your call.

 

[shooter]

I'm back up to 65 releases a day and doing my own CLC. There's no comparison to NWA dispatchers because they don't do that much work. Do you really think the TWU is going to help us out there, Razor? Twist that up and dissect it any way you want to but that's B.S. I don't care what you say.

65 a day, but how many in the air at one time? If you feel there is a safety issue with your work load you take it to your dept manager and if nothing gets done go to the FAA. Safety is above all else in our job, so speak up.

I don't know if a union would, could or should do anything about your work load if it is a safety concern, but I will say that O.Razor is an intelligent individual and while you may not agree with him, you should not disrespect him either. He does not hold a vote card in your office and is just sharing his views of what a union has done for him. Go ask the Delta Dispatchers why they formed PAFCA in the first place if you do not want a pilot’s opinion. There is great amount of Dispatch knowledge in that office, unless they all have retired.

I will take this space to tell you that yes, there are companies that do not need unions because the company treats them well. And then there are some that needed a union when the company first released an aircraft. JMHO

 

[XPOO]

Hey shooter,

Hey, why don't I just got and eat some hay. I can lay by the bay, make things out of clay, I just may, what do ya say?

 

[shooter]

Hey shooter,

Hey, why don't I just got and eat some hay. I can lay by the bay, make things out of clay, I just may, what do ya say?

okay Happy, whatever you say. making the assumption shooter is from that movie is like making the assumption you are a former piece of poo.

 

[ShutupandFly]

Go ask the Delta Dispatchers why they formed PAFCA in the first place if you do not want a pilot’s opinion.

This is the point 405 and I have been making all along. This office never needed a union. The problems in this office are of the kind unions can do nothing about. No dispatch office is perfect. We are not Delta, I don't care why they formed there union. The only office I am going to worry about is mine and for the past year and a half I have not recived any raises or bonus so the union could give me a TA with less money and time off than I had before they started negotiating.

 

[shooter]

This is the point 405 and I have been making all along. This office never needed a union. The problems in this office are of the kind unions can do nothing about. No dispatch office is perfect. We are not Delta, I don't care why they formed there union. The only office I am going to worry about is mine and for the past year and a half I have not recived any raises or bonus so the union could give me a TA with less money and time off than I had before they started negotiating.

I understand fully. thats why I said in my earlier post:

I will take this space to tell you that yes, there are companies that do not need unions because the company treats them well. And then there are some that needed a union when the company first released an aircraft. JMHO

But this thread started with a question about how something works with a union and an experienced union member replied only to be slammed. I dont think that was fair since all he was doing was answering a question. And it was your question to boot.

If your union worked out a TA that was less than before, you need to get rid of the mental giants that head that thing up. And I hate to hear that for you, that really sucks! I do not work in a union office since I feel we are being treated fair. But trust me, if it were not that way we would not continue to be held hostage by the company. I think most companies know that. We as Dispatchers require much initial training and we have great skills that can transfer into many jobs outside aviation. The company needs to invest in us (just like the pilot group) before we are legal to do our jobs. They should treat us well or expect to deal with a third party or high turn over that costs them money.

I understand your pain. sounds like you do not think your co-workers should have voted that in. what do you think their reasons were?

 

[XPOO]

okay Happy, whatever you say. making the assumption shooter is from that movie is like making the assumption you are a former piece of poo.

You eat pieces of poo for breakfast?

 

[ShutupandFly]

sounds like you do not think your co-workers should have voted that in. what do you think their reasons were?

Not that it matters since they have almost all left the company and left us with this POS union but. They wanted and MEL manual on every desk, they wanted one of the duty managers not to be mean to them, they wanted 10 hr of holiday pay instead of 8, they wanted highter raises than the 3 to 5% merit raises the company was giving. And the big one for a couple of them, They were upset at the company and wanted to hurt it.

 

[SKC]

they wanted highter raises than the 3 to 5% merit raises the company was giving.

So, they were getting 3%-5% raises, and they weren't happy? Isn't that pretty much industry standard (for those companies that actually give pay raises)?

 

[405]

Not that it matters since they have almost all left the company and left us with this POS union but. They wanted and MEL manual on every desk, they wanted one of the duty managers not to be mean to them, they wanted 10 hr of holiday pay instead of 8, they wanted highter raises than the 3 to 5% merit raises the company was giving. And the big one for a couple of them, They were upset at the company and wanted to hurt it.

The main complaint I always heard was "the computers are always messed up."

So, they were getting 3%-5% raises, and they weren't happy? Isn't that pretty much industry standard (for those companies that actually give pay raises)?

No, apparently they weren't happy. I used to hear people actually complain about the bonus checks we used to get. It was unbelieveable.

65 a day, but how many in the air at one time? If you feel there is a safety issue with your work load you take it to your dept manager and if nothing gets done go to the FAA. Safety is above all else in our job, so speak up.

Anywhere from 8 to 22 moving (taxiing out or in and flying) at one time. I'm going to talk to the Director on Tuesday.

I will say that O.Razor is an intelligent individual and while you may not agree with him, you should not disrespect him either. He does not hold a vote card in your office and is just sharing his views of what a union has done for him... JMHO

He seems like an intelligent individual. I simply don't agree with his opinion on our situation. I don't go spewing my opinions about ALPA on the Regional or Majors boards either. It's not my place to do that. Sure ALPA may do wonders for 500 or 2500 pilots but he doesn't really have a firm grasp on what's going on in our office with 30 dispatchers (soon to be less) other than what's been said here.

I'm not even going to comment on the "you should not disrespect him either" statement. I about spit my drink all over my screen when I read that.

 

[405]

Or you can just whine about it.

Your call.

Are you interested in seeing what the conditions are like at our office? I'd be more than happy to pick you up from the airport or hotel one day if you have a layover in MEM so you can see it for yourself.

 

[shooter]

Not that it matters since they have almost all left the company and left us with this POS union but. They wanted and MEL manual on every desk, they wanted one of the duty managers not to be mean to them, they wanted 10 hr of holiday pay instead of 8, they wanted highter raises than the 3 to 5% merit raises the company was giving. And the big one for a couple of them, They were upset at the company and wanted to hurt it.

sounds like you guys are in hell over there. Now that they are gone what would it take to get rid of the union? And the BIG question, what (if anything) would you get from the company if they are gone?

hope it gets better!

 

[shooter]

....
I about spit my drink all over my screen when I read that.

hope it was not a beer.

 

[Occam's Razor]

Are you interested in seeing what the conditions are like at our office? I'd be more than happy to pick you up from the airport or hotel one day if you have a layover in MEM so you can see it for yourself.

Nah, I can take your word for it, without actually seeing it. (Kinda like a dispatcher understanding the importance of braking action reports even though he/she won't use them)

I'm not questioning your unhappiness or frustration. I'm offering advice based on data I have. Kinda like a dspatcher...

You may not think the advice is timely or appropriate, based on your priorities right now. Kinda like....ah, you get the picture.

Your union has a set of rules and bylaws that it must abide. Your immediate recourse will be through those rules. If you feel they aren't in compliance, I recommend you contact the Dept of Labor. If you think the DOL is not being responsive to your concerns, your Congressman has a Chief of Staff who can make a couple of phone calls for you. Those tend to generate action at the DOL.

In a earlier post you mentioned that you were able to track down the bylaws of the TWU, so the procedure for replacing your rep(s) is available. If others in your shop feel the way you do, it shouldn't be too hard to get them onboard an effort to replace them. That could be another option,

 

[405]

Razor, thank you for your last post. We are exploring any and all options at this point.

I believe the rep has already been replaced.

Is that normally done by an election process or is someone appointed?