Netjets - The final stop?

[BengalsFan]

Jungle Jet

Will you elaborate on the "super military friendly" comment?

 

[Ultra Grump]

Money isn't my primary concern, but the opportunity is still greater at the majors. That being said I gladly earn 120k to work 9 days a month compared to working 15 days a month for 160k.

Take a 2-month unpaid LOA every year. All the time off you need, all in one block.

 

[bluepost]

I agree with what Kman says. Senior flying at any of the majors is a better job. More stable? Not necessarily. Now what airlines can you get senior in a reasonable amount of time? SWA, FEX, UPS. Anything else is a pretty big gamble.

Now if your willing to give up some money and stability, to each their own....I would rather sit right seat in a 767 international for 100k a year then fly NJA for 120k, any more then that, the money talks.


I get it. Big airplanes are cool, if given a choice I would fly one. Trip trading, picking your destinations, who you fly with, planning things on the road, I would love it all. If someone is willing to give up some money early on for that, and pretty sure they will make it up in 25 years, go for it.

I'm making too much money to leave, the money is enough to provide what I want in life and my wife doesn't work now, but will be again once the kids are older. I have a family and gave up the 747-400 dream for them, and was happy to do it. But I still long for them every time I see them on 28R at SFO.

 

[goahead]

A SWA friend of my Lives is his hometown, averages 19.7 days off a month and with vacation it drops down 22 days off a month. He can do day trips for a couple of months, longer coast to coast stuff or just drop most of his schd, and fly 3 days for the entire month. He still pulled in 170k last year and was home every single night of the year except for a couple mx issues that overnighted him somewhere other than home. I know things can change but When I think of great schedules and QOL he has it.

And how long has he been there?? What base Hou DAL just curious would love that QOL but don't think it exists for "or generation".

 

[Cavpilot]

Jungle Jet

Will you elaborate on the "super military friendly" comment?

I'll field this question. NetJets is without a doubt, "Super military friendly". I have never had a problem getting time off for drills, active duty, etc..

Not only that, the company takes time to send care packages and other stuff to those over in the sandbox.

 

[BengalsFan]

Cav Pilot

Do you just simply tell them (fax in your orders) that you are going to miss a trip (assuming you are on 7n7) because you are on orders? Basically, how does it work?

 

[JungleJett]

BengalsFan,

First off, being from Cincinnati, it is getting harder to root for the Bengals...I still like watching them but they are normally losing.

My bro has been with NJA for about 7 years and has NEVER had a problem getting off for mil leave and the fact that they "bring up" your pay if you make less in the military is freaking awesome! If I recall, while my brother and I were deployed to the desert in 2003, he got a letter from Santulli that was hand signed. (I am pretty sure it was)

Plus, the most prominant item in the NJA CMH lobby is a Blue Star Flag with all the names of those who served or are serving in OIF.

Says a lot to me...

 

[Semore Butts]

Yep they are great in supporting the military

I'm proud to say I have 2 brass plates on the wall at Netjets "Headquarters".

 

[BeechScrub]

I agree that it would be really cool to have a "senior" schedule of 5 on 7 off or something like that to reward the guys that have been here a while. I was talking the other day with a guy about an idea to work half time for 40% of your salary and you pay contributions toward your benefits. Not sure if that could ever happen because it would be hard for the company to get a good ROI on their investment in your training, but it's worth talking about.

In my opinion, the 7/7 schedule at NJA is the best thing going for real QOL. I like to take my days off in large blocks and I always know my schedule a YEAR in advance. It's great. The immediate QOL that NJA offers as a new hire is hard to beat. Not to mention I can live almost anywhere I want and move as often as my short attention span necessitates.

There is also a lot to be said for enjoying flying again. I absolutely love the flying here. Small airports, big airports, uncontrolled, resort destinations, challenging approaches, no hub and spoke crap. No tour is the same. It's great. Airlines are great at sucking the fun out of flying.

This place isn't for everybody and it certainly isn't perfect, but the bottom line is this is my dream job and I'm not going anywhere. Fedex or SWA would be cool for the extrea $$ and a little more time off; but there is so much more to this job that I like that those companies can't offer.

 

[skiandsurf]

The Not-so-typical Netjets week.

4 flights. 2 revenue and 2 repos.

5 pax total. 1 flight with no catering....easy.

The shortest flight was 4.9 miles (SMO-LAX).

The longest was a transcon (BUR-TEB).

4 airline flights. One, 1 hour delay (SWA), two, 3 hour delays (UAL, AA), and one on time departure. A first class ticket on a transcon.

 

[Jafo73]

Cav Pilot

Do you just simply tell them (fax in your orders) that you are going to miss a trip (assuming you are on 7n7) because you are on orders? Basically, how does it work?

For short term stuff (UTA, SIM) I just send an email with a scanned copy of a mil leave letter with the dates I will be on Mil Leave. I have yet to have them ask for a copy of orders, but if it was a long tour (a year or more) they might want a copy. And at NJA we don't have trips like 121, we have days worked so you are just taking days off your tour. I have never had a problem and neither have the other 4 guys from my unit working here.

Something else military friendly is the wounded vets rehab center Santulli help fund to get built.

 

[On Your Six]

I agree that it would be really cool to have a "senior" schedule of 5 on 7 off or something like that to reward the guys that have been here a while. I was talking the other day with a guy about an idea to work half time for 40% of your salary and you pay contributions toward your benefits. Not sure if that could ever happen because it would be hard for the company to get a good ROI on their investment in your training, but it's worth talking about.

In my opinion, the 7/7 schedule at NJA is the best thing going for real QOL. I like to take my days off in large blocks and I always know my schedule a YEAR in advance. It's great. The immediate QOL that NJA offers as a new hire is hard to beat. Not to mention I can live almost anywhere I want and move as often as my short attention span necessitates.

There is also a lot to be said for enjoying flying again. I absolutely love the flying here. Small airports, big airports, uncontrolled, resort destinations, challenging approaches, no hub and spoke crap. No tour is the same. It's great. Airlines are great at sucking the fun out of flying.

This place isn't for everybody and it certainly isn't perfect, but the bottom line is this is my dream job and I'm not going anywhere. Fedex or SWA would be cool for the extrea $$ and a little more time off; but there is so much more to this job that I like that those companies can't offer.

I think this paragraph above says a lot. Sure, we fly to live and don't live to fly necessarily. But most of us got into flying because we love it and flying a "desk" won't cut it for us. Netjets and other fractionals provide great variety of flying that can challenge you at times and keep you sharp. Although you will hit an airline hub here and there, you certainly won't be trapped doing ORD-JFK-MCO all the time like you would in the airlines. Watch your skills and your interest degrade quickly if you just connect hubs every day. Seeing new places and flying challenging approaches can keep things from getting too boring (which is the case a lot of the time).

While quality/mix of flying ain't everything, it certainly is a nice benefit and it keeps things interesting.

 

[AeroDMB]

NetJets has been the dominate player in the market since inception, however give it another 5-10 years and we'll see what other "products" are out there for customers. I'm all for the NetJets career track (if I had the time) but there is competition heating up that might present some challenges for NetJets in the future. Let's not rule out mergers, acquisitions, etc. for the fractional world at some point in the future. Hopefully it will never get to the extent the airlines face these days.

 

[old*art]

Most of my friends at the majors hate to go to work, most of the pilots I know at NJA love to go to work. That is all I know.

 

[RJ Bum]

The Not-so-typical Netjets week.

4 flights. 2 revenue and 2 repos.

5 pax total. 1 flight with no catering....easy.

The shortest flight was 4.9 miles (SMO-LAX).

The longest was a transcon (BUR-TEB).

4 airline flights. One, 1 hour delay (SWA), two, 3 hour delays (UAL, AA), and one on time departure. A first class ticket on a transcon.

You X guys work too hard!

 

[tk855]

NetJets has been the dominate player in the market since inception, however give it another 5-10 years and we'll see what other "products" are out there for customers. I'm all for the NetJets career track (if I had the time) but there is competition heating up that might present some challenges for NetJets in the future. Let's not rule out mergers, acquisitions, etc. for the fractional world at some point in the future. Hopefully it will never get to the extent the airlines face these days.

You bring up a good point that people rarely think about! It takes a lot of work to stay on top, but it is definately a challenge the 1108 and its membership are up to. Competition is good for everyone, it keeps us on our toes. RTS has even acknowledged this and has commented on it. It will be interesting to see where the cards lie ten years from now. If I were to place a bet, I bet you will see Netjets still on top if not very close.

 

[RJ Bum]

Most of my friends at the majors hate to go to work, most of the pilots I know at NJA love to go to work. That is all I know.

Isn't that the truth

 

[Voice Of Reason]

Not to burst the bubble, but....

....A little reality check is in order for most here. NetJets is just as much of a gamble as ANY other company in the aviation industry.Period. People tend to forget that the industry CONSTANTLY cycles, and there is just no way to ensure that NetJets or ANY COMPANY will be a feasable "final destination." Sure, it looks great now, but United looked great 10 years ago. FLOPS looked great 7 years ago. NetJets looked pretty pathetic until VERY RECENTLY. Only very recently did they get a contract which, I hate to break it to you, is not effective for "infinity and beyond," just as a number of other seemingly "unbeatable" contracts have led to less than desirable work conditions later.
I would certainly consider it a gamble to deem NetJets a "final destination" when they were a pretty low choice until very recently. There is a risk EVERYWHERE, but if you're going to "risk" do it where the LONG TERM prospects have a HISTORY of cycling back to the good (long standing major airlines), not the flavor of the month where you will spend your entire career away from your family in ridiculous blocks of 7 days. Regardless of the resulting scheduled days off (for NOW) it is insane to think that you will spend the bulk of your LIFE away from your family in blocks that LONG. When you are in your 50s and 60s it especially will get to you. You will NEVER be away that long at a major airline, regardless of seniority.
Bottom line, no matter what the flaming retorts...the contract is NEW and the long term history speaks for itself.
7 days is a long time to expect a spouse to "hold down the fort" regardless of days off after (where you spend half of it recovering from work, and the other half catching up on all the crap you couldn't do all week...not exactly the "vacation" that those so desperate to have you look up to them want you to believe).

 

[Seat 0A]

(where you spend half of it recovering from work, and the other half catching up on all the crap you couldn't do all week...not exactly the "vacation" that those so desperate to have you look up to them want you to believe).[/B]

Not sure where you got your info but when I get home after 7 days my few minutes of paperwork is already done and the most I need to do is put away my suitcase. Not more than 15 minutes is devoted to work. Stuff papers in an envelope that is pre-addressed and then grab a cold one.

Recovery is not an issue. With adequate rest in good hotels, and proper nutrition while on the road, I just do not come home NEEDING recovery.

Also, having actually worked other schedules in my prior life I can tell you that having every other 7-day period off allows a lot more things to get done at home than short out and backs or any traditional "9-5" schedule.

But to each their own. If you have done both types of flying (airline vs. NJA) then you can make an informed decision. If not then it's just an assumption. And we all know what happens when you ass-u-me.

 

[Voice Of Reason]

Not sure where you got your info but when I get home after 7 days my few minutes of paperwork is already done and the most I need to do is put away my suitcase. Not more than 15 minutes is devoted to work. Stuff papers in an envelope that is pre-addressed and then grab a cold one.

...and yet here you (and many like you) are...on your "vacation" needing to justify why your job and time off are so great. Not how I'd spend MY "vacation"