NetJets Places Order For 96 New Aircraft

[fischman]

Actually, I would argue that Captains bidding into other other aircraft wouls actully open up more slots. As a pilot moves from fleet X to fleet Y that opens up a spot in fleet X, with a net gain of 0.

However, the more pilots that are in training the fewer are on the line. The company need the pilots on the line, not in the sims. Therefore if more pilots are in training, more pilots will be needed on the line while the first one is in training. Make sense?

 

[Ultra Grump]

And following that logic, if cldsfr79's dream of 3-year seatlocks comes to pass, it will slow down upgrades by 50%, since that many fewer people will be in the initial type pipeline at any given time.

 

[Ultra Grump]

I came over to NJs after the contract, but I was under the impression that some of the senior FOs were bypassing the upgrade, and allowing the junior guys to upgrade, therefore allowing as many guys to make captains pay. Now that mentallity is gone. Its more like "screw the newhires", they have domiciles and will be FOs forever.

:crying: Someone get this baby a bottle to stop the bawling.

You are wrong.

With 20 captain bids per month x 12 months=240 captains bids/yr.

At the rate of 5 "true upgrades"/month= 4 yrs for 240 "true upgrades".

I am hanging in there, and I know my time will come. The question is when???

:uzi: :crying:

From where exactly are you getting the "5 true upgrades/month" figures? Last awards, 15 of 36 awards were upgrades. 11 of 23 of the latest bid postings were Ultra, Encore, and 400 slots. Wait your turn and quit your bitching. If you can't deal with seniority, get out of aviation.

 

[skiandsurf]

:crying: Someone get this baby a bottle to stop the bawling.

You are wrong.

:uzi: :crying:

From where exactly are you getting the "5 true upgrades/month" figures? Last awards, 15 of 36 awards were upgrades. 11 of 23 of the latest bid postings were Ultra, Encore, and 400 slots. Wait your turn and quit your bitching. If you can't deal with seniority, get out of aviation.

I am bitching over a pay raise (QOL) issue, while you bitch about the plane you fly. Well, didnt you BID (want) to fly that plane in the first place?

 

[CA1900]

I am bitching over a pay raise (QOL) issue, while you bitch about the plane you fly. Well, didnt you BID (want) to fly that plane in the first place?

Be realistic. You're telling me you'll delay your upgrade and bid only bid the planes you want to fly for many years? Or are you going to bid the earliest upgrade slot you can get, so you can get that $40K raise that much sooner?



...


Yeah, exactly.

 

[skiandsurf]

Be realistic. You're telling me you'll delay your upgrade and bid only bid the planes you want to fly for many years? Or are you going to bid the earliest upgrade slot you can get, so you can get that $40K raise that much sooner?



...


Yeah, exactly.

I only question those that jump from 800xp to C-X to XL. I have no problem with anyone bidding out of the 400 and Ultras.

 

[CA1900]

Ah, understood then.

Keep in mind the XL is currently the highest paying aircraft up through year 9 (I believe), due to the differences pay for flying the XL and XLS. That's one reason a lot of guys are bidding over to it, I think.

 

[cldsfr79]

Fozzy, How long did you sit in the right seat at NJA? Given that you flew a Beech 1900, I'm going to say you came to the company 5+ years ago and was either a street captain or upgraded in 6 months. Some FOs, especially the new guys, may have to sit in that seat for 3 to 5 years, and it just may be a little annoying to see bids always being awarded to captains.

Look I understand the reasons captains bid other planes, maybe it's a bigger plane, a better schedule, more money. It would just be nice if the company was proactive by coming out with a large bid for Ultras, Encores, 400s, and other 1st tier type of aircraft at the same time as G200, Falcon, XL, etc, bids to anticipate the flow change.

I'm just saying that the upgrades have slowed and it doesn't help when captains take captain bids. Since January NJA has hired around 130 pilots (lot including those who left), but in the same time, only place around 70 captain bids. Of those bids, around 25% were actually awarded to FO.

While I’m stirring the pot…..let me address FO pay. No it’s not food stamp wages, but it could be better. Historically FO pay in the industry has always been between 40-60% of what a captain makes. At the fractionals it needs to be much more. Yes, FOs aren’t the “Pilot in Command” nor do they hold the ultimate responsibility for the aircraft in which captains claims to be the reason they need to get paid so well. FOs at the fractionals have to (on top of the regular flying duties) cater the aircraft, stock the aircraft, clean the aircraft, and assist in baggage handling. With these duties, the FOs should get a bit more compensation for what they do.

 

[Fozzy]

Yup, I was one of the lucky off the street guys. THAT is a story for another time and place.
Man I feel your pain. Been there and done that. Just keep in mind, you will make more your first three years at NJA as an FO than I did as a Captain.

Hope those slots come soon. Good luck.

 

[popgoesbubble]

[ Very few people want to be PICs on the Ultra, Encore, or 400 their whole NetJets careers.[/quote]


Guess you've never had the pleasure of flying with Bill Lucy then? Talk about a piece of garbage that needs to go away!

Ok I'll add to this whole Captain/Captain bidding going on as most of us that post on here are ex airlines guys most of our old companies had policy's that if you are a captain or FO and decide to down bid to a smaller A/c then you got a 5 yr seat lock vs the 2yr if you upgraded to a larger a/c

What we have happening here is you see Cat 2/3 guys down bidding to 400Xp when it was a new plane cuz they know they won't work. now those same guys will bid back to the 4000 when it comes and spend most of there career here not really working by chasing those new a/c types that come on property. Watch the same thing will happen when we get the encore+ XLS+ and the 900xp.

If you guys really want to stir the pot lets have the company follow the airlines and maintain an age 65 and your done policy. I'm sure plenty of you have had the pleasure of flying with a +65 yr old that says "they don't need the money, the wife just wants me out of the house" type. or met the guy with multiple retirement pensions but just tells you that he just "LOVE's" to Fly!

I've had the pleasure of flying with many ex UAL, and DAL guys that had the misfortune of lossing there pensions but each one will tell you that there here for max 5yrs to make up and then throwing in the towel. I just don't get the guys that say there gonna stay here til they can't find the airport anymore.