NetJets Places Order For 96 New Aircraft

[Ultra Grump]

I am bitching over a pay raise (QOL) issue, while you bitch about the plane you fly. Well, didnt you BID (want) to fly that plane in the first place?

I'm sorry - can you point me to the post where I bitched about the plane I fly?

In every instance, your payraises come with time. Yearly payraises per the contract and the upgrade raise when your SENIORITY number comes up. Show me one other seniority-based aviation company where you will upgrade into anything other than the smallest, lowest-paying, and least desireable aircraft. If you can find one, I respectfully request you put in your resume there.

 

[acaTerry]

I am bitching over a pay raise (QOL) issue, while you bitch about the plane you fly. Well, didnt you BID (want) to fly that plane in the first place?

Seniority entitles him to bitch about more than those who are junior to him. Besides, I just don't see why it's a "bad" thing that someone can change planes after 2 years. That's one of the things that makes NJA a good place to work. You'll get to do the same thing one day. And payraises will come with each successive contract, unlike the airlines where more concessions seem to come each time.
Money CAN be made IF you will work reserve. I am yr 3 RSV as an SIC and make more than I did as a 4 year CA at the airlines. It aint terrible here. Let seniority run its course and soon enough you'll have people throwing mud at you too.

 

[skiandsurf]

You SENIOR guys bitch about the lack of service at First Aviation at TEB. Personally, I only go through there maybe once a month, and I have never had a bad experience there. You SENIOR guys bitch about someone putting "SUGENITE" in the transponder on the C-X, yet you protect some idiot that takes a picture of himself, in uniform, shooting at the companies propaganda. You SENIOR guys, bitch about the company not getting incident info out to you fast enough. You SENIOR guys bitch about the TSA treating you like terrorists, instead of crewmembers. Guess what, we are NOT airline pilots...we are airline passengers. Again, I have never hada problem with any TSA personel. I do not check my bags. I just play the game, and be nice to them.

Seems to me that you SENIOR guys bitch about the little stuff, while us JUNIOR guys are bitching about MONEY.

 

[pilotpat]

Can someone pass the popcorn?

 

[CA1900]

You SENIOR guys bitch about the lack of service at First Aviation at TEB. Personally, I only go through there maybe once a month, and I have never had a bad experience there.

OK, I'll play: I'm a junior guy, and I've gotten some godawful service from First. Repeatedly. The pleasure last week was walking 1/4-mile back and forth repeatedly to stock my airplane because we were parked way around the corner, as far from the locker as possible.

You SENIOR guys ... you protect some idiot ...

Having met the gentleman in question, he's not "some idiot." He's one of the nicest guys you'll ever meet. And if you do something stupid that causes an unjust firing, that same union will work to help you keep your job, too.

You SENIOR guys, bitch about the company not getting incident info out to you fast enough.

So do us junior guys.

You SENIOR guys bitch about the TSA treating you like terrorists, instead of crewmembers. Guess what, we are NOT airline pilots...

We are pilots for an FAA-certificated air carrier. That it doesn't cater to the general public does not change that fact.

Again, I have never had a problem with any TSA personel. I do not check my bags. I just play the game, and be nice to them.

So all the liquids you bring with you are in 3-oz containers, in a quart-size ziploc bag? Or do you depend on your "being nice to them" -- and your uniform from your air carrier -- to exempt you from the rules the rest of the airline passengers follow?

Seems to me that you SENIOR guys bitch about the little stuff, while us JUNIOR guys are bitching about MONEY.

Were you that guy in ground school telling your fellow pilots to find a vending machine for dinner and keep the equipment moving?


Let go of the hatred, man. The end result will be the same, you'll live longer, and you'll enjoy your day a hell of a lot more.

 

[gunfyter]

We have been through this already.

PICs switching fleets has no affect on the number of SIC upgrades.

If there are 3000 pilots there will be 2000 PICs and 1000 SICs.

Switching fleets just increases the total number of training events.


I don't know what seniority number you are ... but whatever it is ... divide it by 2 then multiply by 3. Thats how many pilots need to be on the property before you will upgrade.

In the meantime my standing bid for the 2000EX and the G-IV stands.

 

[Ultra Grump]

Seems to me that you SENIOR guys bitch about the little stuff, while us JUNIOR guys are bitching about MONEY.

Since you don't want to answer any of my questions, I'll have to assume you don't know what you're talking about. If this job is such a financial hardship, maybe you shouldn't have come here.

I started here at $27000, and was exceedingly grateful to the pilots here for the incredible effort required to make the bypass drives a success. Do you know what captain pay was then?

For the 7&7 and 17-day (similar to current reserve, except defined days off and no extra money for extra days worked): Yr 1 = $37560; yr 2 = $39816; yr 3 = 47208. I was happy to get it.

Your current payscale? On 7&7 (not an option as a newbie when I started), $39000-$42998 yrs 1-3. On reserve, $46,286-51,030. You're working less for more money. Quit yer bitchin'! If you didn't know you were going to be on FO pay for a few years, you shouldn't have come here, and in fact have no business being in aviation, since it's that way everywhere.

I'd be happy to see the IBB result in a pay raise for FOs, but you definitely do not have it bad. Be a man and stop blaming your lack of financial planning on the bad ol' "type-collecting" PICs.

 

[skiandsurf]

Be a man and stop blaming your lack of financial planning on the bad ol' "type-collecting" PICs.

Its because of my financial planning that allows me to continue this job.

I have no problem with a Beechjet or Ultra Captain moving out of the plane. But when a bid comes out for 30 captain positions, and 20 of those seats are taken to current captains, it delays the rest of us. If the company refilled those seats that were vacated by a captain movement, I wouldnt have a problem at all. But I dont think they replace them. I think the company is fat on captains, and is happy to grow the FO list without replacing empty captains seats.

When, during the interview, the company tells us of upgrading within 2-3 yrs, and then I only see 5-10 upgrades per months, it gets frustrating to see these guys jumping from plane to plane.

You guys come on here and rant about how good this job is and how the other jobs suck, but you dont talk about the 2 incidents this week.

Now get back to more important gripes, like crewfood and First Aviation.

 

[gunfyter]

You should hane listed to me when I posted this on 3-29-2006

http://forums.flightinfo.com/showthread.php?t=75873&highlight=5+years

Yes but ... you can estimate the BEST case based on good economic conditions....

Thats why 2 yrs is BS. 4yrs IF all goes well.
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[RideandDrive]

I don't understand the logic that because the pay really sucked pre contract the current pay of $39k for fo isn't that bad? Most places are at least 60% of captain pay and the fo pay is not. The reality is the pay in the right seat sucks and is inadequate for the job demanded.