Need examples of "Pilot Fatigue" type schedules

[Slave2theGrind]

I'm doing a grad paper on "pilot fatigue" and need some examples of typical fatigue inducing schedules. You can delete your companys info, I just need the duty times. Thanks!!!

 

[Flyer1015]

What examples, specifically, do you want?

All you need to know is that there are quite a few airlines (like the one I work at) that REGULARLY schedule 8-hr reduced rest, followed by at least 5 flights the next day.

 

[twinbeech]

http://www.doihaveafuturehere.org/

Many good examples there. One of which was mine.

 

[WSurf]

I'm doing a grad paper on "pilot fatigue" and need some examples of typical fatigue inducing schedules. You can delete your companys info, I just need the duty times. Thanks!!!

Looking at the Aircraft you have flown, seems you would already have some good examples.

 

[WSurf]

What examples, specifically, do you want?

All you need to know is that there are quite a few airlines (like the one I work at) that REGULARLY schedule 8-hr reduced rest, followed by at least 5 flights the next day.

Not just reduced rest. But starting early in the morning on the first day of a 4 day, then finishing on 4th day late.

Even with the required rest it still screws with your body's pattern from adjusting from day flying to night flying.

This sucks just as bad as 8hr rest.

 

[FMEpilot]

I start a 4 day tomorrow morning at 0450and end on sunday at 2125. I should be fairly tired by the time I get to drive an hour and a half home.

 

[B.T.Justice]

Heres an example for you...

You can be scheduled to be on duty for 16 hours on day1. You end day 1 at 10 PM.

8 Hours of rest. (includes waiting for hotel to pick you up, ride to / from the airport, eat, shower, all that)

Day 2 Show at the airport at 6 AM, be on duty for another 16 hours.

Then you get 14 hours of rest to recoupe.

8 Hours is hardly enough rest. What people don't understand is that is isn't 8 hours of sleep. It's 8 hours from stepping off the airplane - to stepping back on again....so when its all said and done, you have 4 or 5 hours of sleep. Thats a problem.

 

[rickair7777]

Here's one of my favorites:

1830 Dep PHX
1900 Arr TUS
2000 Dep TUS
2100 Arr LAS
2330 Dep LAS
0230 Arr SAT
0600 Dep SAT
0730 Arr PHX

Repeat for 5-6 days, then two days off, etc.

 

[yournextFO]

It's more than just duty times. It's how many legs, what time of day. Are you switching from late nights to early or vice versa. (And not just during one trip -- changes from week to week make a difference too.) How short are the overnights. Personally, I've found 11-12 hours are about the minimum to get a decent nights sleep. How many long breaks during the day between flights. These are tiring. What's the operation like? Delays, Performance Issues, Maintenance all add to fatique issues. Did the compamy make you do a nap (COD) before starting your regular trip. Once you get fatigued, it can take days to recover.

 

[BOX OFFICE]

I'm doing a grad paper on "pilot fatigue" and need some examples of typical fatigue inducing schedules. You can delete your companys info, I just need the duty times. Thanks!!!

Or a reporter. Remember, reporters, rarely paint us in a favorable light. I wouldn't give industry inside info to an outsider that easily.

 

[Mookie]

Here's one of my favorites:

1830 Dep PHX
1900 Arr TUS
2000 Dep TUS
2100 Arr LAS
2330 Dep LAS
0230 Arr SAT
0600 Dep SAT
0730 Arr PHX

Repeat for 5-6 days, then two days off, etc.

wow...that is the worst I've ever seen...Rj or Dash? jesus that's awful. Our ANC allnighters are brutal with a 2.5hr sit in the middle, but that takes the cake.

 

[ratherbeflyen]

Dep MLU-SHV 2000
Dep SHV-DAL 2100
Dep DAL-HOU 0100
Dep HOU-DAL 0400
Dep DAL-SHV 0800
Dep SHV-MLU 0900 Arr MLU 1000

14 hours of duty and 10 hours of rest.

Eat, shower, try to sleep, wake up eat again and repeat 4 more times.

Anyone top that?

 

[regionaltard]

Or a reporter. Remember, reporters, rarely paint us in a favorable light. I wouldn't give industry inside info to an outsider that easily.

That could be good advice in some instances, but anything that has even the potential to shed some more light on pilot fatigue issues is a good thing IMO. There's good science on the effects of fatigue on pilot performance, and it's hard to imagine a downside to giving one of the industry's dirty little secrets some exposure.

 

[Smacktard]

I'm doing a grad paper on "pilot fatigue" and need some examples of typical fatigue inducing schedules. You can delete your companys info, I just need the duty times. Thanks!!!

This one really sucked...
Day 1
1. ATL MDW 15:18
2. MDW ATL 16:58
3. ATL BJX 20:50
Hotel: Fiesta Americana Layover: 55:30
Day 2
Drink...eat at some street stand, buy some cheap viagra..nevermind, F/A is gay
Day 3
Stayed in room all day, should have bought prescription diarrhea meds at RX...
Day 4
4. BJX ATL 07:18

 

[DrewBlows]

Heres an example for you...

You can be scheduled to be on duty for 16 hours on day1. You end day 1 at 10 PM.

8 Hours of rest. (includes waiting for hotel to pick you up, ride to / from the airport, eat, shower, all that)

Day 2 Show at the airport at 6 AM, be on duty for another 16 hours.

Then you get 14 hours of rest to recoupe.

8 Hours is hardly enough rest. What people don't understand is that is isn't 8 hours of sleep. It's 8 hours from stepping off the airplane - to stepping back on again....so when its all said and done, you have 4 or 5 hours of sleep. Thats a problem.

This example is illegal. If you worked 16 hours on day one you are already on "reduced rest" and must get "compensatory rest" of at least 10 hours. To understand this look back 24 hours from the end of your 16 hour duty day. If you can't find at least 9 hours rest you were on reduced rest. Any time you are on duty for more than 15 hours you are automatically on "reduced rest", even if it was day one of a trip.

 

[mike235646]

http://www.doihaveafuturehere.org/

Many good examples there. One of which was mine.

Oh, cry me a river. I can't believe there is actually a web site for the poorly treated crews at AWAC. Every regional has unproductive schedules and alot of them don't have trip/duty rigs. If you think you have it bad at AWAC, try working at another regional airline.

 

[Soverytired]

Here's one of my favorites:

1830 Dep PHX
1900 Arr TUS
2000 Dep TUS
2100 Arr LAS
2330 Dep LAS
0230 Arr SAT
0600 Dep SAT
0730 Arr PHX

Repeat for 5-6 days, then two days off, etc.

Boy, does THAT ever look familiar. Looks like a typical Mesa stand up routed through LAS (EUG, MFR, or sleeping next to the Frontier plane in SLC, anyone?). There were four shifts pretty much exactly like this that I remember.

After you add the DAILY hour drive to work, plus the hour drive from work, and you're looking at 8 hours "rest". If you don't sleep, shower, eat or exercise at home, that is.

And people wonder why Mesa pilots and FA's sleep on the airplane for their 2.5 hour layovers.

 

[siucavflight]

Here's one of my favorites:

1830 Dep PHX
1900 Arr TUS
2000 Dep TUS
2100 Arr LAS
2330 Dep LAS
0230 Arr SAT
0600 Dep SAT
0730 Arr PHX

Repeat for 5-6 days, then two days off, etc.

Um, where do you work, and why do you work there?

 

[Slave2theGrind]

These are exactly the types of schedules I was looking for. I have been out of airline flying for 5+ years and only have the time "logged" not copies of my duty times. I am looking more at the regionals "out and back" insted of the majors "transmeridian" long hauls.

 

[pilotyip]

The crew rest will not prevent crews from operating outside of a schedule that allows them to properly rest. The rules have nothing to do with being rested. I flew scheduled 121 cargo, I knew my schedule a month in advance. Nightly run BLD-PIT-DAY-MEM-IAH in an L-188. I still flew exhausted. Start 0200 at DAY ended IAH 0900, out of IAH at 1900, into BLD 0600, out of BLD 2300. Then into IAH 0900 again, 6.5 hours of flight time, standup over day, not legal rest, but a duty break, out of IAH 1900. Drop add all night into BLD 0600, out of BLD 2300 repeat again into DAY 0200, release to go home and assume a sleep at night schedule for four days before going back to being up all night. I was always tried with a messed up sleep pattern, but I was 100% legal as approved by the FAR’s and my ALPA contract.

 

[BOX OFFICE]

The crew rest will not prevent crews from operating outside of a schedule that allows them to properly rest. The rules have nothing to do with being rested. I flew scheduled 121 cargo, I knew my schedule a month in advance. Nightly run BLD-PIT-DAY-MEM-IAH in an L-188. I still flew exhausted. Start 0200 at DAY ended IAH 0900, out of IAH at 1900, into BLD 0600, out of BLD 2300. Then into IAH 0900 again, 6.5 hours of flight time, standup over day, not legal rest, but a duty break, out of IAH 1900. Drop add all night into BLD 0600, out of BLD 2300 repeat again into DAY 0200, release to go home and assume a sleep at night schedule for four days before going back to being up all night. I was always tried with a messed up sleep pattern, but I was 100% legal as approved by the FAR’s and my ALPA contract.

BLD? Did you mean Hartford (BDL)? Where is BLD?

 

[pilotyip]

Good ole Hartford and the Ramada Inn

BLD? Did you mean Hartford (BDL)? Where is BLD?

yea it was Hartford Bardley, typo or it might be in my logbook misspelled?

 

[BOX OFFICE]

yea it was Hartford Bardley, typo or it might be in my logbook misspelled?

Bradley.

 

[rickair7777]

Um, where do you work, and why do you work there?

Now who do you think it was? It WAS Mesa (CRJ) of course, but I sure as hell don't work there anymore.

 

[acaTerry]

Oh, cry me a river. I can't believe there is actually a web site for the poorly treated crews at AWAC. Every regional has unproductive schedules and alot of them don't have trip/duty rigs. If you think you have it bad at AWAC, try working at another regional airline.

Just what the world needs, another f.l.a.p. who doesn't know what the heck he's talking about. OK professor, tell me a regional that does not do this. Now go burn your 8 gph in VFR conditions some more.

 

[knewhigher]

Just what the world needs, another f.l.a.p. who doesn't know what the heck he's talking about. OK professor, tell me a regional that does not do this. Now go burn your 8 gph in VFR conditions some more.

what does f.l.a.p. mean?

 

[pilotyip]

Fatique

Bradley.

Another example of how fatique effects speeling

 

[J and E's Daddy]

Here's an example for a nine hour rest. Get in at 2100 and duty off at 2115. The morning has a 0610 show. So, let's see, call for the hotel van, and finally shows around 2125, it's a 20 minute drive to the hotel. 2145, check in and proceed to the room. Now to unwind, iron a shirt call the wife or girlfriend and now it's 2230.
With your 0610 show, it's a 20 minute ride, and the van times are on the half hours with NO flexibility. So, you are forced to take a 0530 van so, you ask for a 0450 wake up. If you finally crawl into bed at 2245 that's 6:05 of sleep and let's say it's the last day of a four day, so it's a 12 hour duty day with, let's say, 7:00 of block. the most would be :35 in between flights, no time to eat, and aircraft swaps all day. Delaying flights are not an answer, since you want to catch your commute home and now you have a plane load of pax pissed off that they're going to be late. Nine hours of rest maybe legal but is it safe?

Read this, part to blame, pilto fatigue
http://www.ntsb.gov/publictn/2001/AAR0102.htm

 

[twinbeech]

Oh, cry me a river. I can't believe there is actually a web site for the poorly treated crews at AWAC. Every regional has unproductive schedules and alot of them don't have trip/duty rigs. If you think you have it bad at AWAC, try working at another regional airline.

I would NOT work at another regional airline. I hated it enough at AWAC that I left after more than four years. If it sucks worse at your airline and you tell me to quit whining, then you are part of the problem. Why you put up with sh_t like that is beyond me. Now that AWAC opened up LGA and RDU it is even worse. I took a BIG paycut to go back to charter and couldn't be happier!

 

[BOYCAPTAIN]

This is one of our harder trips....84hrs in spokane! who the heck can sleep in that crappy doubltree???






SA 2452 A30 MEM 0818(0318) GEG 1224(0524)

GEG 84:16

WE 1252 A30 GEG 0210(1910) MEM 0558(0058)

CREDIT HRS: 25:23T BLK HRS: 7:54
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------