Narrowbody Pilot Pay Comparison:

[767-300ER]

http://www.airlinepilotpay.com/nbcomp_topcapthourly.htm

 

[FL717]

http://www.airlinepilotpay.com/nbcomp_topcapthourly.htm

I appreciate your website and think it has become a very valuable and popular reference point for many people. I must point out however, that your latest "comparison" graph is "apples to oranges" in detail.

For example, you list an American 737NG which in reality is a 737-800 payscale. You then list AirTran 737NG at the 737-700 payscale. An apples to apples comparison for example purposes would be to list the AirTran 737-700 and 737-800 payscale with equal equipment scales from other airlines, and vice versa.

Again... let me emphasise what a GREAT website you have created and I appreciate all your work on it.

 

[Pickle]

Kitty Hawk is 174 per hour, why are they not on the list? Also ATA is 161 for top captain, yet ATA is not on the list. Why not?

 

[hoya saxa]

FedEx Correction

FedEx 3 yr 727 FO is 100/hr versus the 76/hour listed on your site. 76 would be for a 3 year SO.

hoya out

 

[Paul R. Smith]

Out of those is there a way you can do a retirement comparison. I would but I'm too busy picking my nose.


It would be interesting to see how each one's 401k/pension/profit sharing matches up.

I will go out on a limb and say that even if I get hired by a legacy carrier whatever that means I don't think I will recive a pension from em. Those with pensions will hopefully hang on to them but for those who have yet to acquire a seniority # will probably be out of luck..With UPS, and FEDEX being the exception.

 

[Propsfullfwd]

Can you do this for the Regionals? Break it down for the different A/C. Great web site!!!

Props

 

[PHXFLYR]

Great web site. AWA top is 141/hr; not 138.

PHXFLYR

 

[767-300ER]

Thanks for finding all my mistakes, guys.

I will eventually do regionals and widebody...

As for AWA top captain rate, I'm looking at the AWA contract right now, and it says $137.72. Maybe I'm looking at it wrong.

 

[savin47]

*.

A JetBlue Capt. will make 208.00 dollas an hour over 70 hours. The average line is usually over 81 hours. this would make a blended rate of about 148.00 an hour or 12,000.00 a month.

 

[TonyC]

A JetBlue Capt. will make 208.00 dollas an hour over 70 hours. The average line is usually over 81 hours. this would make a blended rate of about 148.00 an hour or 12,000.00 a month.

I just barely noticed a television commercial for Citi ... bank?? corp?? something that started with Citi... I'll be watching for it now so I can correctly atribute and refine the quote... It goes something like this (and oh how true it is):

Overtime pays more because of what you are missing.​

​

​

​

[EDIT: Found it on the web... CITIBank ... and I corrected the last two words of the quote - - HEY, I was close! ]

 

[General Lee]

Well, they also want to do JFK to LGB turns----so even though they will be zombies and have to do autolands back into JFK---they will only have to work 8 days a month.......



Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[flyguppy]

A JetBlue Capt. will make 208.00 dollas an hour over 70 hours. The average line is usually over 81 hours. this would make a blended rate of about 148.00 an hour or 12,000.00 a month.

AND YOU'RE PROUD OF THAT HOURLY RATE?

Makes me sick to my stomach. An Airbus captain making 148/hr, and having to work 80+ hrs/month to make it.

 

[oldxfr8dog]

You injected the politics, he just corrected the info.

I didn't see you jump on the Cactus guy for a correction...

 

[savin47]

I just barely noticed a television commercial for Citi ... bank?? corp?? something that started with Citi... I'll be watching for it now so I can correctly atribute and refine the quote... It goes something like this (and oh how true it is):

Overtime pays more because of what you are missing.​

[EDIT: Found it on the web... CITIBank ... and I corrected the last two words of the quote - - HEY, I was close! ]

Yes, It is true. The intended consequence of this is: the loafers barely subsist, productivity is rewarded and if the sh## ever hits the fan we all go back to 70 hrs and we don't get to screw the jr. pukes.

 

[Dizel8]

General says: "Well, they also want to do JFK to LGB turns----.........

Just couldn't resist, could ya?

You still picking up over time with people on furlough?

 

[oldxfr8dog]

Well, they also want to do JFK to LGB turns----so even though they will be zombies and have to do autolands back into JFK---they will only have to work 8 days a month.......



Bye Bye--General Lee

Not trying to start any fights...

Do you think this is a fatigue/safety issue, that is; is it safer to have 6 or 8 legs over a 16 hour duty day with an 8 hour block or 2 legs on a 11 hour day with a 9.5 hour block?
Or
Do you see this as a degradation of pilot contracts?

 

[oldxfr8dog]

Sorry!!!!
New at this, With enough M&Ms vs. cattle prods, I'll pick it up!

 

[savin47]

AND YOU'RE PROUD OF THAT HOURLY RATE?

Makes me sick to my stomach. An Airbus captain making 148/hr, and having to work 80+ hrs/month to make it.

Try Imodium Advanced with a Zanex chaser works for me when I receive my check and at top of descent.

140K is at least in the top 7% of incomes in this country. Sure I would like to make more and we will. I certainly don't feel that I am getting hosed.

 

[savin47]

Sorry!!!!
New at this, With enough M&Ms vs. cattle prods, I'll pick it up!

Careful! These people will bait you and suck you in to this evil website and you can never leave. Next thing you'll be putting a silly little picture to the left.

 

[General Lee]

oldxfr8dog,


What other rules would you guys like to change next? How about marrying your own sister? Sound good? What is next?


Bye Bye---General Lee

 

[TonyC]

I just barely noticed a television commercial for Citi ... bank?? corp?? something that started with Citi... I'll be watching for it now so I can correctly atribute and refine the quote... It goes something like this (and oh how true it is):

Overtime pays more because of what you are miuarssing.​

[EDIT: Found it on the web... CITIBank ... and I corrected the last two words of the quote - - HEY, I was close! ]

Yes, It is true. The intended consequence of this is: the loafers barely subsist, productivity is rewarded and if the sh## ever hits the fan we all go back to 70 hrs and we don't get to screw the jr. pukes.

What's with the misquoting? The word is MISSING.


Now, if you call doing one's job "loafing," and you are content with people who do their jobs, to use your words, "barely subsis[ing]," then I guess you have got something to brag about.


I didn't intend to hijack this thread, but do you realize what you just said? I understand how picking up extra time allows flexibility in manning and prevents furloughs and such, but what you're saying is that your pilots who just work regular time will barely subsist ! And you sound like you're PROUD of that!

 

[TonyC]

Not trying to start any fights...

Do you think this is a fatigue/safety issue, that is; is it safer to have 6 or 8 legs over a 16 hour duty day with an 8 hour block or 2 legs on a 11 hour day with a 9.5 hour block?
Or
Do you see this as a degradation of pilot contracts?

In your case, it wouldn't be a degradation of a pilot contract, since there IS no pilot contract, per se, that covers scheduling issues of that sort.

Furthermore, it's clear that you're not interested in an objective answer, since you have not posed an objective question. How, pray tell, do you propose to fit 9.5 block hours into 11 hours of duty? 10 minute preflights? Don't count taxi time as block or duty? 5 minute turns in LGB? 12 hours of duty would be more realistic.

Personally, I'd take the 2 leg day with a relief flight officer. If you're really interested in pilot-friendly schedules, you should run that by your friendly management. That'll get your airplanes back and forth in one day, it'll get your pilots all their hours in 7 work days, and it'll get that sweet deal for 50% MORE pilots, to boot. Maybe you could hire guys off the street into that position for 80% of the RJ rate, and they'll be grateful to move "up" to the RJ when it arrives on the property. You'd still wind up paying the Captain, FO, and RFO less than a legacy crew of 2 would get for the day.

 

[savin47]

Tony C,

Sorry, I have cursor jump issues. Must have messed up your quote.

70 hrs here is not "regular time" . The only time you will get 70 hrs is if you drop trips or go on vacation for the month. What it comes down to is, you fly two more days and make 30% more pay. It is a capitalistic plot, but it works.

 

[MoGambo]

Hey Tony Cessna,


How bout those Vols ??

I guess they only put in 70 hours for that SEC title game ??

 

[oldxfr8dog]

In your case, it wouldn't be a degradation of a pilot contract, since there IS no pilot contract, per se, that covers scheduling issues of that sort.

Furthermore, it's clear that you're not interested in an objective answer, since you have not posed an objective question. How, pray tell, do you propose to fit 9.5 block hours into 11 hours of duty? 10 minute preflights? Don't count taxi time as block or duty? 5 minute turns in LGB? 12 hours of duty would be more realistic.

Personally, I'd take the 2 leg day with a relief flight officer. If you're really interested in pilot-friendly schedules, you should run that by your friendly management. That'll get your airplanes back and forth in one day, it'll get your pilots all their hours in 7 work days, and it'll get that sweet deal for 50% MORE pilots, to boot. Maybe you could hire guys off the street into that position for 80% of the RJ rate, and they'll be grateful to move "up" to the RJ when it arrives on the property. You'd still wind up paying the Captain, FO, and RFO less than a legacy crew of 2 would get for the day.

No, believe it or not, I did want an opinion.
Stupid me.
Anyway, I'll extend it to 11.5 hours duty. Can't do a show/turn in less than 60 mins? OK, I guess that answers a lot of questions.
Sure, do I want to work one day a week, (every Tuesday!?) but that isn't the way it works.
You must be really senior, with that view of the world.
Screw those junior pukes...

 

[TonyC]

How bout those Vols ??

I guess they only put in 70 hours for that SEC title game ??

If you're suggesting that they gave less than 100%, I suggest you're misguided.

I'd say they gave a great effort, and considering they were led by the third-string quarterback (1st and 2nd are out injured) they gave a very respectable performance. They actually improved over the score of the first meeting with Auburn earlier in the season with a healthy team. This time, they came from a 2 touchdown deficit to tie the game at 21, and held Auburn's lead to just 10 points. I think the oddsmakers had Auburn with 2 TDs, so we beat their predictions.

But I digress.


Oh, the topic of the forum... I believe it is valid to compare pay rates throughout the industry based on standard pay rates and monthly guarantees. If you want to make comparisons to what is actually flown on average, I think JetBlue will come up even shorter.

 

[oldxfr8dog]

oldxfr8dog,


What other rules would you guys like to change next? How about marrying your own sister? Sound good? What is next?


Bye Bye---General Lee

Naw, I'd choose YOUR sisiter.

Everybody knows she has no gag reflex.

 

[oldxfr8dog]

Not that there is anything wrong with that...

 

[TonyC]

No, believe it or not, I did want an opinion.
Stupid me.
Anyway, I'll extend it to 11.5 hours duty. Can't do a show/turn in less than 60 mins? OK, I guess that answers a lot of questions.
Sure, do I want to work one day a week, (every Tuesday!?) but that isn't the way it works.
You must be really senior, with that view of the world.
Screw those junior pukes...

I'll still take the 9.5 Block Hours and an RFO - - all 3 scheduled for < 8 hours block. Just because you're at cruise in a glass cockpit, it doesn't mean you're not working and must not be alert. Throw in winds, weather, ATC delays, mechanicals, and a myriad of other problems along the way, and your scheduled 9.5 block quickly turns into 10.5 block. Cap it off with a CatIII with gusty crosswinds and a cluttered runway, and all of a sudden you have a challenge. If my Mom's aboard, I want the Captain to be rested.

As a matter of fact, I'm not really senior. I'm a lot closer to the bottom of the list than the top. Frankly, though, I don't understand where you're getting that, anyway. If the 9.5 Out-and-backs are gonna be so great, they'll surely go senior. How can that be good for junuior guys? In any event, as long as there is a seniority system, the senior pilots will get the better schedules, and the junior guys will get the leftovers. So, what's new?


If the marathon days are good, then 7 of them in a row will be even better, so commuters can minimize their days away from home. Better start working on THAT waiver, too.

 

[oldxfr8dog]

I'll still take the 9.5 Block Hours and an RFO - - all 3 scheduled for < 8 hours block. Just because you're at cruise in a glass cockpit, it doesn't mean you're not working and must not be alert. Throw in winds, weather, ATC delays, mechanicals, and a myriad of other problems along the way, and your scheduled 9.5 block quickly turns into 10.5 block. Cap it off with a CatIII with gusty crosswinds and a cluttered runway, and all of a sudden you have a challenge. If my Mom's aboard, I want the Captain to be rested.

As a matter of fact, I'm not really senior. I'm a lot closer to the bottom of the list than the top. Frankly, though, I don't understand where you're getting that, anyway. If the 9.5 Out-and-backs are gonna be so great, they'll surely go senior. How can that be good for junuior guys? In any event, as long as there is a seniority system, the senior pilots will get the better schedules, and the junior guys will get the leftovers. So, what's new?


If the marathon days are good, then 7 of them in a row will be even better, so commuters can minimize their days away from home. Better start working on THAT waiver, too.

No, I'm not saying > 8 is good or < 8 is good or bad. I'm saying there is NASA research and evidence for fatigue studies.
Last time I discussed this was in Artesia, NM. A beer-drinking buddy in the Coyote, stated he was "zoned-out" driving home after a 6-hour flight, KSFO- PHNL-10 hours-hotel-and 5 hours back. Said he didn't remember the drive home, sun-in-his-eyes, etc... He was worse-off than just coming back home after a 45 min turn?
Sh*T, if we can show a benefit for flying 30 minutes a week, sign me up!
This is worse than just coming home to the same time-zone/bed? In a glass cockpit?
I just want my company to be safe and profitable. Not some "You OWE us this!!", cry from a junior lineholder at some Legacy because someone else negociated it. I paid my dues. I'm second generation, my Dad, paid his/my dues in this business.
Yeah, he warned me to do something else. I just loved these **CENSORED****CENSORED****CENSORED****CENSORED** airplanes too much to do anything else.
OK, insult me as you will...