More Delta Trouble

[N2264J]

I thought this industry was in a cycle...Denial. I don't see that with our pilots.

I doubt the price of oil will ever come down. We are competing on a global market for the same limited natural resources with other huge countries like China and India that are industrializing like gangbusters.

This ain't no cycle - the earth has shifted beneath our feet.

 

[MedFlyer]

What you're missing General is that the 5 Billion in cuts was based on the price of oil settling down to about $35 a barrel. If oil stays closer to $55 a barrel, DL will need an extra $1+ Billion in cuts, ANNUALLY. Of course, if oil goes higher it gets uglier. One Goldman Sachs analyst is projecting possible super spikes in oil as high as $105 a barrel. Yikes!!!

Keep in mind that the recently announced maintenance cuts are part of the $5 billion cuts, NOT in addition to the $5 Billion. So far, the only announcement DL has made in regard to additional cuts is grounding more mainline planes. Fares are starting to drift upwards which is good, but not nearly fast enough to offset fuel.

Of course, you can sit around and hope other carriers die first...as I'm sure you do. But not only is that pathetic, but it's just a bad business plan.

 

[DaveGriffin]

Give me a break. Drastic times necessitate drastic measures.

General Leo;

Bad enough to give another 10-20% giveback? No? Why not? Everyone else is doing it. Your 'Drastic Times' call to action applies only to groups other than the DALPA seniors.

Did you know DAVE that we are getting more recalls in May than initially advertised? You didn't?

You are too detached from the real world. We had 20 recalls in April and only 16 scheduled for May. In case you can't figure it out General Math Wiz, that's a decline. And it will continue as the less fuel efficeint planes are retired.

Your frenzied support of the staus quo illustrates your total misunderstanding and intentional mischaracterization of the situation. You and your senior buddies are going down, big time.

 

[skykid]

Unfortunatley Medflyers analysis on this thread is in my opinion accurate and scary. As he has shown by bringing in the articles, he is not the only one who is warning Delta may not be positioned well for a Ch 11 survival. It looks like Delta mgt and some analysts are wondering the same thing.

GL - any relief you get from Congress on pension payments only puts off the inevitable. Your LCC competition doesn't make defined pension payments. They are adding seats in doulbe digit percentages/year. I hope I'm wrong.

 

[General Lee]

I doubt the price of oil will ever come down. We are competing on a global market for the same limited natural resources with other huge countries like China and India that are industrializing like gangbusters.

This ain't no cycle - the earth has shifted beneath our feet.

A fuel surcharge that sticks shatters your statement. We have had 3 so far, and more to come.


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[General Lee]

General Leo;

Bad enough to give another 10-20% giveback? No? Why not? Everyone else is doing it. Your 'Drastic Times' call to action applies only to groups other than the DALPA seniors.



You are too detached from the real world. We had 20 recalls in April and only 16 scheduled for May. In case you can't figure it out General Math Wiz, that's a decline. And it will continue as the less fuel efficeint planes are retired.

Your frenzied support of the staus quo illustrates your total misunderstanding and intentional mischaracterization of the situation. You and your senior buddies are going down, big time.

Davie,

May was supposed to have 10. Are you paying attention to the code-a-phones? Also, we were supposed to have NONE for the year, and then ALPA got them to change it to around 125. Did you know that genius? And, to top it off, looks like we might have another large chunk of retirements in May due to the Gatt rate rising. Again, more recalls are probable. Do you have ADD?


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[8vATE]

One Goldman Sachs analyst is projecting possible super spikes in oil as high as $105 a barrel. Yikes!!!

Of course, you can sit around and hope other carriers die first...as I'm sure you do. But not only is that pathetic, but it's just a bad business plan.

I heard about that $105 barrel projection and just about lost my lunch...

FWIW..

I believe Delta IS being proactive .....
Simplifares... the ATL hub reorganization... Song....

Look at what Continental and NWA have done...
not much by comparison..

Its too bad labor couldn't come to the table earlier though..
But that's the nature of the beast...

The trend has been multiple givebacks.... UAL, USAirways....
The target keeps moving lower and lower...

 

[DaveGriffin]

Davie,

May was supposed to have 10. Are you paying attention to the code-a-phones? Also, we were supposed to have NONE for the year, and then ALPA got them to change it to around 125. Did you know that genius? And, to top it off, looks like we might have another large chunk of retirements in May due to the Gatt rate rising. Again, more recalls are probable. Do you have ADD?


Bye Bye--General Lee

The recall update kool aide from Larry is weak and worthless. He's got a paying job, and it is to keep the remaining furloughs happy and smiling while the boots of the seniors are placed firmly up their rear ends.

A decline is a decline, no matter how you spin it General Leo. Let's check the rate of recall at the end of the year and see how great it is.

From your perspective, the more juniors who stay furloughed the better. If the furloughs 0% pay rate funds Delta's survival until oil drops back to $40 or lower, that is far better for the pilots with paychecks than an additional 10-20% giveback.

With that in mind, I'm sure you wouldn't really mind additional furloughs, even with a downgrade, as long as it stops about 100 away from you.

 

[General Lee]

The recall update kool aide from Larry is weak and worthless. He's got a paying job, and it is to keep the remaining furloughs happy and smiling while the boots of the seniors are placed firmly up their rear ends.

A decline is a decline, no matter how you spin it General Leo. Let's check the rate of recall at the end of the year and see how great it is.

From your perspective, the more juniors who stay furloughed the better. If the furloughs 0% pay rate funds Delta's survival until oil drops back to $40 or lower, that is far better for the pilots with paychecks than an additional 10-20% giveback.

With that in mind, I'm sure you wouldn't really mind additional furloughs, even with a downgrade, as long as it stops about 100 away from you.

Now you are attacking the furlough coordinator, who is also furloughed and has a decent pay check. You are a classic Davie.



Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[N2264J]

Originally Posted by N2264J
I doubt the price of oil will ever come down. We are competing on a global market for the same limited natural resources with other huge countries like China and India that are industrializing like gangbusters.

This ain't no cycle - the earth has shifted beneath our feet.

A fuel surcharge that sticks shatters your statement. We have had 3 so far, and more to come.

OK, I'll bite. Walk me through how Delta putting a fuel surcharge on ticket prices somehow debunks the reality that the US is competing for the same oil with other economic powerhouses in the world, thereby making the likelihood of oil prices ever again being what they were in the 90s, remote.