Minimaniac
Benevolent Dictator
- Joined
- Dec 12, 2005
- Posts
- 455
Ok, people. Stop for a minute and look at how the combination of RAH and Midwest is any different than mergers past.
In any merger, pilots stay on their own equipment until a seniority integration happens. Once integrated, pilots are permitted to fly aircraft from the
"other" carrier as seniority allows, and as any fence restrictions dictate.
In this merger, pilots are still assigned to their own equipment until the seniority integration takes place. Once it does, Midwest pilots will be able to fly RAH (pre-merger) aircraft, just like any other integration. Midwest pilots may even be able to fly the Airbus... it all depends on how the integration goes and what kind of fences F9 and RAH and Lynx establish.
The ONLY reason Midwest pilots and Flight attendants are currently on the street is that their own aircraft were returned to Boeing, and until a seniority list merger is complete, they cannot train on and of the Embraers. The process IS NO DIFFERENT than any other merger. What is different is that the 717 fleet went away before an integration was complete.
The 717 began disappearing before RAH bought Midwest. The planes left on a schedule that did not allow the seniority list integration process to happen between deal closing and fleet termination. Legal hurdles are just that- they slow down the process that allows Midwest pilots to be integrated.
Midwest contracted with RAH for those initial 170's AFTER Midwest lost its leases with Boeing for 16 of the 717's. We pilots will never know exactly what happened, but the most informed and level headed people I have talked to (actual YX pilots) acknowledge that Midwest management tried to play hardball with Boeing and lost. Midwest has not made lease payments for eight months, and had some success negotiating new, reduced payments, but then tried to push the line even further with Boeing and Boeing walked away. Why did MIdwest do that? Was it just a bad decision? Did TGP have a hand in it? Was there some backroom deal that aimed at sabotaging the lease negotiations? Who knows. But RAH pilots and Midwest pilots did not contribute in any way.
When the 16 inital leases were lost, Midwest went looking for some type of fleet replacement to keep the schedule and system flying. It is no secret that RAH has recently lost work for 12 170's that were flying for Frontier. And no doubt, Bedford had approached Midwest about any oppotunity to employ those 12 aircraft. But, Bedford tried to drum up any business he could. Every carrier was approached with an offer to put those 12 E170's to work. Bedford didn't care who those planes flew for, as long as they were employed and the terms of service and payment were not completely unreasonable. It just so happened that the only airline who was honestly in need of lift at that time was Midwest. The deal was struck, and in terms that were considerably worse (in the eyes of Bedford) than any previosuly signed capacity agreement. And, the deal was signed with a company that had begun to show serious financial strain (regardless of whether is was management incompetence or TGP interference, or whether someone was cooking the books to hide money). It was a very risky deal for RAH.
RAH would much rahter have kept those 12 planes with Frontier and never had to deal with Midwest. The terms that RAH flew for MIdwest were risky enough that RAH would never have gone and purchased new aircraft to meet the needs of Midwest. RAH flew those 12 E170's for Midwest because they were fairly desperate for employment. Midwest contracted with RAH because they were, through no fault of RAH or Midwest pilots, desperate for airframes on short notice. The deal was signed, and it was really an open ended deal, with rather unprecendented terms that conveyed the uncertainty of both airlines in the future of the deal and the desired outcome. RAH would fly for Midwest. But Midwest could buy the planes off of RAH and use their own pilots. Or RAH could lease the planes to Midwest and Midwest pilots could fly them. Time tables were set, benchmarks had to be met, and in the end Midwest did not follow though on the requirements that would allow Midwest pilots to fly the RAH 170's WITHOUT any sort of merger or acquisition taking place. So, RAH flew those planes under a CPA.
The original RAH 170 deal for Midwest was no different that any other CPA that RAH flew under at the time. RAH pilot flew RAH planes on routes dictated by Midwest management. Yes, this replaced SOME flights that were done by Midwest pilots on Midwest flights. BUT!!!!!!!!! Much of the new RAH flying was to replace the flying being done by Skywest with CRJ's. MIDWEST HAD ALREADY GIVEN UP 12 AIRCRAFTS' WORTH OF FLYING TO SKYWEST. Yes, RAH planes did replace 717's, but as previous discussed, those 717's were going away for reasons beyond the control or influence of RAH pilots and Midwest pilots. RAH was brought in to cover the loss of those planes. Those planes did NOT go away because RAH was contracted to fly. The timetable was close, but the actual chronology shows that Midwest managers balked on the 717's first, and contracted with RAH as a result.
RAH flies small jets on behalf of many companies. Yes, the flying we do was once done by the majors themselves. The midwest CPA was no different that any other CPA that RAH signed with other airlines. RAH planes replaced mainline aircraft at Delta, at Continental, at US Airways, at United, at Frontier, and American before they replaced flying at MIdwest. Now this was not always a direct mainline replacement...sometimes replaced another regional that replaced mainline. Sometimes we offered inexpensive access to cities and routes that had been abandoned years before. But in the end, flying for Midwest was no different than flying for anyone else. The effects were more obvious on a fleet of 25 aircraft compared to an airline with 400 or more mainline aircraft and a further fleet of 300 regional jets, but the effect was the same.
What happened at Midwest is not unique. It is not special. RAH replaces mainline flying. So does Pinnacle. So does Skywest. So does ExpressJet. So does Colgan. So does TSA. So does ASA. So does Mesa. So does Comair. So does PSA. So does Eagle. So does Mesaba. So does Air Wisconsin. So did ACA. We at RAH have probablt replaced 25 aircraft's worth of flying at 5 other major airlines. The only difference is that Midwest only had 25 planes. Don't forget, job replacement can go far beyond pilots and F/A's. Many regionals do ground handling, and have replaced mainline rampers at many outstations, and even to a significant degree in hub airports.
In any merger, pilots stay on their own equipment until a seniority integration happens. Once integrated, pilots are permitted to fly aircraft from the
"other" carrier as seniority allows, and as any fence restrictions dictate.
In this merger, pilots are still assigned to their own equipment until the seniority integration takes place. Once it does, Midwest pilots will be able to fly RAH (pre-merger) aircraft, just like any other integration. Midwest pilots may even be able to fly the Airbus... it all depends on how the integration goes and what kind of fences F9 and RAH and Lynx establish.
The ONLY reason Midwest pilots and Flight attendants are currently on the street is that their own aircraft were returned to Boeing, and until a seniority list merger is complete, they cannot train on and of the Embraers. The process IS NO DIFFERENT than any other merger. What is different is that the 717 fleet went away before an integration was complete.
The 717 began disappearing before RAH bought Midwest. The planes left on a schedule that did not allow the seniority list integration process to happen between deal closing and fleet termination. Legal hurdles are just that- they slow down the process that allows Midwest pilots to be integrated.
Midwest contracted with RAH for those initial 170's AFTER Midwest lost its leases with Boeing for 16 of the 717's. We pilots will never know exactly what happened, but the most informed and level headed people I have talked to (actual YX pilots) acknowledge that Midwest management tried to play hardball with Boeing and lost. Midwest has not made lease payments for eight months, and had some success negotiating new, reduced payments, but then tried to push the line even further with Boeing and Boeing walked away. Why did MIdwest do that? Was it just a bad decision? Did TGP have a hand in it? Was there some backroom deal that aimed at sabotaging the lease negotiations? Who knows. But RAH pilots and Midwest pilots did not contribute in any way.
When the 16 inital leases were lost, Midwest went looking for some type of fleet replacement to keep the schedule and system flying. It is no secret that RAH has recently lost work for 12 170's that were flying for Frontier. And no doubt, Bedford had approached Midwest about any oppotunity to employ those 12 aircraft. But, Bedford tried to drum up any business he could. Every carrier was approached with an offer to put those 12 E170's to work. Bedford didn't care who those planes flew for, as long as they were employed and the terms of service and payment were not completely unreasonable. It just so happened that the only airline who was honestly in need of lift at that time was Midwest. The deal was struck, and in terms that were considerably worse (in the eyes of Bedford) than any previosuly signed capacity agreement. And, the deal was signed with a company that had begun to show serious financial strain (regardless of whether is was management incompetence or TGP interference, or whether someone was cooking the books to hide money). It was a very risky deal for RAH.
RAH would much rahter have kept those 12 planes with Frontier and never had to deal with Midwest. The terms that RAH flew for MIdwest were risky enough that RAH would never have gone and purchased new aircraft to meet the needs of Midwest. RAH flew those 12 E170's for Midwest because they were fairly desperate for employment. Midwest contracted with RAH because they were, through no fault of RAH or Midwest pilots, desperate for airframes on short notice. The deal was signed, and it was really an open ended deal, with rather unprecendented terms that conveyed the uncertainty of both airlines in the future of the deal and the desired outcome. RAH would fly for Midwest. But Midwest could buy the planes off of RAH and use their own pilots. Or RAH could lease the planes to Midwest and Midwest pilots could fly them. Time tables were set, benchmarks had to be met, and in the end Midwest did not follow though on the requirements that would allow Midwest pilots to fly the RAH 170's WITHOUT any sort of merger or acquisition taking place. So, RAH flew those planes under a CPA.
The original RAH 170 deal for Midwest was no different that any other CPA that RAH flew under at the time. RAH pilot flew RAH planes on routes dictated by Midwest management. Yes, this replaced SOME flights that were done by Midwest pilots on Midwest flights. BUT!!!!!!!!! Much of the new RAH flying was to replace the flying being done by Skywest with CRJ's. MIDWEST HAD ALREADY GIVEN UP 12 AIRCRAFTS' WORTH OF FLYING TO SKYWEST. Yes, RAH planes did replace 717's, but as previous discussed, those 717's were going away for reasons beyond the control or influence of RAH pilots and Midwest pilots. RAH was brought in to cover the loss of those planes. Those planes did NOT go away because RAH was contracted to fly. The timetable was close, but the actual chronology shows that Midwest managers balked on the 717's first, and contracted with RAH as a result.
RAH flies small jets on behalf of many companies. Yes, the flying we do was once done by the majors themselves. The midwest CPA was no different that any other CPA that RAH signed with other airlines. RAH planes replaced mainline aircraft at Delta, at Continental, at US Airways, at United, at Frontier, and American before they replaced flying at MIdwest. Now this was not always a direct mainline replacement...sometimes replaced another regional that replaced mainline. Sometimes we offered inexpensive access to cities and routes that had been abandoned years before. But in the end, flying for Midwest was no different than flying for anyone else. The effects were more obvious on a fleet of 25 aircraft compared to an airline with 400 or more mainline aircraft and a further fleet of 300 regional jets, but the effect was the same.
What happened at Midwest is not unique. It is not special. RAH replaces mainline flying. So does Pinnacle. So does Skywest. So does ExpressJet. So does Colgan. So does TSA. So does ASA. So does Mesa. So does Comair. So does PSA. So does Eagle. So does Mesaba. So does Air Wisconsin. So did ACA. We at RAH have probablt replaced 25 aircraft's worth of flying at 5 other major airlines. The only difference is that Midwest only had 25 planes. Don't forget, job replacement can go far beyond pilots and F/A's. Many regionals do ground handling, and have replaced mainline rampers at many outstations, and even to a significant degree in hub airports.
