MidAtlantic Captain Positions At 01/99 DOH

[Steve 737]

There is a learning curve when transitioning to a jet. We all went thru it at some point in our careers. Almost all of the captains i flew with in the late 80's at U mainline were great to fly with and i learned a great deal from alot of them. Sure, there were a few i did not particularly care for, but i made the best of it. I hope you are not coming over to MAA with that attitude !!!

Should make for a fun cockpit at MDA. I heard PSA has been a real joy since the J4J guys came over..... Man I can't wait to sling a gear at MDA and listen to my Capt. telling me how to operate a Jet. Fun, Fun, where do I sign up!!!! LOL, oh.... usairways-express.com!!! I am so there....

 

[KeroseneSnorter]

Well, if you want a level playing field for the furloughs. Lets do this, I have no problem, and I do believe they should get longevity for pay. But on that same note, I believe that since MDA (soon to be WO:SSO does Paychecks, PDT Employ #'s and Health care provider) shouldn't all people from APL and CEL be combined into one list and us date of hire for the MDA seniority list. I think that would be fair, since the APL guys keep longevity at mainline and the WO's start at year one. I think that is a EVEN PLAYING FIELD!!!!!!!!

Except that MDA is mainline. Only the payscale is different. As far as the FAA is concerned there is no distinction. It is just like MetroJet. All on the same 121 certificate. The FAA has not issued any 121 certificate to an airline named Mid-Atlantic.

Now don't get me wrong, I am not saying make the W/O's give up their senority but to have the W/O guys getting paid 36 bucks an hour more than the mainline furloughees is way out of line, especially the 12 and 13 year Airways pilots.

If you go Surfs way you must also give all the former W/O pilots that went to mainline their original W/O hire date back, or since you are wanting to use hire dates from 3 different airlines, it can also be argued that every mainline furloughee should be given his original Regional hire date back regardless of what airline that was. (Ie. Eagle, Mesaba whatever)

The J4J agreements were pretty screwed up at times, and at PSA furloughees were holding artificial Captain spots in return for the jets to more that double the size of the airline almost overnight, However every one of the PSA guys was senior to the furloughed pilots. And despite the moaning and Biatching from the PSA pilots, they have made out very well in the deal. At last count there were only 80 (not my numbers somebody elses) something furloughees left over there, and PSA is hiring like crazy to try and staff all those new shiney jets. Far better than they would have done if they still only operated 25 Do 328's. I know it is somewhat hypocritical, the way the Capt. seats went in the J4J stuff, but the bottom line is that PSA cannot operate independant of Airways. They do not have their own res centers, ticketing, support, or identity of their own. What they can do is supply their own pilots, fuel, and maint., but they would have no one to haul. To the passengers it is USAirways, I know I flew the W/O's long enough to realize that passengers never knew who we were.

But at any rate Surf, If you want to go with our original W/O hire date thats fine by me because it will add another 7 years to my seniority at MDA, on top of my 2 at Airways. And done that way if your profile is current and 3500 is your total time you would fall waaayyyy down the list by the time it got to you.

 

[KeroseneSnorter]

There is a learning curve when transitioning to a jet. We all went thru it at some point in our careers. Almost all of the captains i flew with in the late 80's at U mainline were great to fly with and i learned a great deal from alot of them. Sure, there were a few i did not particularly care for, but i made the best of it. I hope you are not coming over to MAA with that attitude !!!

Not to mention that 99% of the mainline furloughees has more time in jets than WSurf has total. And that last 1% were the Military fighter jocks with 2000 hours of ultra high performance jet PIC time. Not saying that the regional pilots don't have the skills but there is a learning curve. No offense, but going from a drag a$$ Dash 8 to a jet does take some guidance. Like Steve said I learned a great deal from the guys that had been doing it for a long time. Sim training under 10k and never over 250 knots doesn't help much the first time the airspeed starts shooting through 320 indicated knots at a pace you didn't think was possible, while climbing.

 

[WSurf]

Okay, I have some jet time, and believe me.... Auto Throttles and fly by wire is not hard. Once you learn the right buttons to push and have a good concept of pitch and power its easy. So dont give me the learning curve deal, its all the same. The Dash 8 is a beast in itself to fly, and in some respects harder then a jet.
I am 5 year pilot a PDT, and it wouldn't bother me going straight date of hire. I have no problem with it. Seems only fair...
As for learning from your captains at mainline. Remember these won't be the same captains at MDA that you flew with at Mainline...And I doubt there are only a few if any that where ex mainline captains that will be at MDA. I know a hand full of people that got hired a US Airways from the regionals with little or no PIC Regional time! Now there left seat drivers and teaching me... wowoow.
I am not trying to create waves, its just I hear it from the PSA guys, and I know its gonna be that way at MDA...... Hope not however... G-Day

 

[WSurf]

And watch, MDA will soon not be a part of US Airways... CEO has mentioned it several times as a WO... It will be one soon...

 

[KeroseneSnorter]

Okay, I have some jet time, and believe me.... Auto Throttles and fly by wire is not hard. Once you learn the right buttons to push and have a good concept of pitch and power its easy. So dont give me the learning curve deal, its all the same. The Dash 8 is a beast in itself to fly, and in some respects harder then a jet. Don't tell me you are one of those automation slaves?!
Remember these won't be the same captains at MDA that you flew with at Mainline...And I doubt there are only a few if any that where ex mainline captains that will be at MDA. I know a hand full of people that got hired a US Airways from the regionals with little or no PIC Regional time! Now there left seat drivers and teaching me... wowoow. 800 of the furloughees are 12 and 13 year guys, All were mainline Captians. And unless you were a minority, 100% of the new Hires were Captians prior to ML. My class of 50 had 1 pilot that had 0 Jet PIC (Dash F/O, Minority) The PIC ranged from 747's ,DC-10's, on down to RJ's and Biz jets. About the only ones with 0 jet were the W/O's that didn't fly them prior to hiring with the W/O's (I don't know any, Regional mins were about 2500 TT when most of us came through. 3000 was competetive to fly a Dash. Lots of Lear freighter time required to be a shoe in, the early 90's were tough.
I am not trying to create waves, its just I hear it from the PSA guys, and I know its gonna be that way at MDA...... Hope not however... G-Day

You might want to listen to someone that has been there and done it, I know it helped me a great deal and I had lots of Freight,Corporate, as well as Regional PIC. But what the heck do I know I have only been getting paid to fly for 15 or so years.

 

[KeroseneSnorter]

And watch, MDA will soon not be a part of US Airways... CEO has mentioned it several times as a WO... It will be one soon...

Good possibility, but not right now. The FEDS wouldn't give them another cert. Possibly dissolve ALG or PDT and use their 121. Then again, its up and running like it is and would involve huge expenditures to change now just so it can have its own 121. After all, ALPA already signed off on it like it is. A transfer to W/O status would mean more contract changes and FAA headaches.

More than likely a sell to somebody like MESA. That is the worry I keep hearing from the current MAA'ers. Far more likely than going W/O. (IMHO anyway)

Then again if Airways doesn't make it all this arguing is moot. But it sure is entertaining though!!

 

[USAirways1149]

F/Os can have THEIR names on the bathroom walls too.

WSurf,

I think you need to update the total time in your profile. If you've been at Piedagheny for 5 years, and you have 3500 hours now, assuming you somehow beat the odds and got hired with 500 hrs TT, even THEN you only flew 600 hours a year.

And somehow in there you managed to find enough "jet" time that you dont feel you need any guidance from those who came before you.

On top of that you now somehow you feel that those 10-13 year furloughees who may not have jet-PIC dont have anything to teach you?

There's only one thing more frustrating than a CFI-Captain. It's an FO who believes he's got nothing left to learn.

I would say that nomatter WHERE you go whether it be MDA, PSA, FedEx, Southwest, or Chalks, you're going to have Captains watching over your shoulder because, if your attitude on here is indicative of your attitude on line, you're FAR too cocky.

At 3500 hours you just dont know what you just dont know.
(I found THAT out the hard way. You will too.)

 

[WSurf]

Your right, 5 years at PDT=Over 900 hrs a year at this company. It's over 5000hrs, but I am gonna leave it. Doesn't make me feel anymore Chuck Yeager having to update it all the time.
Anyway I do believe that you are suppose to learn from the left seat guy. Thats why your in right seat, I just know from friends at PSA that its been a nightmare with the J4J guys.....
Maybe it will all work out..... Hope sooooo....
Anyway... EMB-170 question.. I see the EMB145 guys with David Clarks.. Over 200kts gets loud up there... 170 the same????

 

[KeroseneSnorter]

WSurf,


I don't doubt that there are some a$$hole out there making life hard for the PSA guys. But, you do have to look at the experience that most of the mainliners are bringing to the cockpit.

Cross sampling, no names, none are me.

1. 1989 hire date with Airways, Will be taking the MDA job(may already be there), currently at MESA. 10000 hours jet time, Flew F/O DC-9 as newbie, Made Captain on the F-28, flew it about a year, downgraded, to F/O 737, furloughed briefly (About 3 months I think) Made Captain on the 737 again in 99, flew as Captain until 01, downgraded again to Airbus F/O, furloughed mid 02. Also did a stint on the 76 somewhere in there (F/O)

2. Late 99 hire date with Airways, Prior to that was Captain on a 727 flying freight all over the world. About 2000 hours PIC 727, was regional Capt prior to that.

3. Early 00 hire date, Prior to Airways, was DC-10 Captain for World Airlines.

4. Early 00 hire date, Military, B-52 Commander, Flying C-5's as a reservist

5. Late 99 hire date, was Capt 747 (Evergreen I think, might have been Atlas, can't remember)

6 More KC-135 Commanders than you can shake a stick at in the "New 1149"

These are some that I can remember specifics on, Friends, classmates etc. But it is a representation of the average pilot hired by Airways. Not withstanding the knobs that always slip through, these will be the guys that will be your left seaters.

I don't know you, only have a profile to go by and what you have said, but it does appear that these folks may be able to give you a hint or two about converting kerosene into noise.

However I do realize that there is always a jag-off that feels that he must "Teach" commuter guys how to fly, and for that I and the rest of the Airways guy apologize. The sad thing is, I am not at PSA and I can probably tell you the name of one of the boneheads that is giving them a problem, Don't take it personal, he did the same crap to his fellow mainliners, many of whom had more experience than he did. I heard that he used to try to tell the 20 year Captains how to fly, until he was taught why it is called Captains authority!!

 

[FR8mastr]

What happened to the huge number of Mesa and the like pilots that were hired in the last hiring frenzy?

 

[stb]

Little advise...

Well, if you want a level playing field for the furloughs. Lets do this, I have no problem, and I do believe they should get longevity for pay. But on that same note, I believe that since MDA (soon to be WO:SSO does Paychecks, PDT Employ #'s and Health care provider) shouldn't all people from APL and CEL be combined into one list and us date of hire for the MDA seniority list. I think that would be fair, since the APL guys keep longevity at mainline and the WO's start at year one. I think that is a EVEN PLAYING FIELD!!!!!!!!

***********************************************************

Pass the ride first then you can worry about the other stuff.

Enjoy training, it was a cakewalk.

I think it is bull that the W/O pilots have to resign their number to come to MDA.
One bust and out of MDA and ALG/PDT.
Not one has failed yet but it would suck if it was a W/O pilot.

At MDA, your ALPA reps are mainline, so there are 200 votes vs. 3500 mainline pilot votes. Think you can figure that one out.
Typical ALPA, "eat their young" mentality.

 

[FurloughedAgain]

Just wondering how the 1999 hires are liking life at MidAtlantic?

(still wondering if I made the right decision).

 

[surplus1]

Somehow I was under the impression that you had already changed the decision you wrote about (earlier in this old thread) and made a different intermediate/permanent decision. Am I wrong?

 

[FurloughedAgain]

I did. I made a (hopefully) permanent decision that I am very happy with.

But I made quite a few career decisions over the last ten years that I thought/hoped were permanent. So sometimes I cant help but to second-guess myself, look back, and think "what if?".

I know that thinking that way is a foolish waste of time but (shrug) just cant help it sometimes.