micro-jet impact

[johnpeace]

I'm sort of at the beginning of my pilot career track.

What is your collective professional opinion on the impact these new 'micro jet' aircraft are going to have on the job market?

What kind of requirements will you expect for jobs flying these planes? How do you think PIC time in these jets will look to employers flying heavier aircraft?

I really want to fly fractional and then corporate and am looking at these new jets as an awesome way to get the experience (simply due to the projected numbers of them that will be flying and the relatively simple systems that will probably be crewed by lower time pilots).

Just wonder what kind of job market impact you guys think these planes will have.

 

[bart]

With all the owner operators that will be flying them, I would expect them to have numerous small impacts all over the country. The same kind you see today with Malibus and Barons, only they will be going faster and burning Jet A (or not) when they hit.

 

[Gulfstream 200]

I agree.

I dont see many being sold at all, only to the type of people who buy thier own Barons and Malibus now. These folks are few and far between..

Companys wont buy these like they buy Citations, Falcons, and Gulfstreams...these microjets will just be toys for rich folks - not corporate workhorses.

As far as PIC time, my guess is they will allow you to fill the PIC turbine time....and thats what most places want - at least for an airline job..

You say your goal is corporate aviation? why fractional first?

 

[johnpeace]

I guess I figured small jets in this price range would open business aviation up to a whole new market: smaller businesses.

Seems like these planes would appeal to companies that are spending a lot on flying reps around on the airlines, but who can't afford a full on Citation or Lear or whatever...

 

[johnpeace]

You say your goal is corporate aviation? why fractional first?

Please remember that I'm completely new at this stuff...I haven't steeped myself in aviation business, so I don't really know what to expect from a career path...

From what I can gather reading this board, I have a lot of work ahead.

What I really, really want to do is:
work as a CFI at the school I will be going to in Atlanta starting this summer.

While working as a CFI there, I will try to bogart all the multi students I can to build the multi time.

I will also bring doughnuts to the folks down the hall at the busy charter/aircraft management/maintenance company, in an effort to endear myself to the people who have PC-12s and King Airs and Lear and Citations to fly.

Once they let me fly a King Air, I'll pretty much be in heaven...but in the interest of upward mobility and getting my money's worth out of all of this training and education, I'll probably want a better paying job.

I'd really *like* to fly corporate (nice airplane, small flight department, tight crew, hands on), but it sounds like the GOOD corp jobs are the rare jewel...since I can't count on stumbling across that rare jewel right away, I figure flying the same type missions in the same type aircraft would be either a great career unto itself or a great place to be while I wait to stumble upon the GOOD corp job.

Pardon my naivete if I sound like an idiot...at this stage I should probably not worry about it and just study my Instrument/Commercial and college algebra and cross that career bridge when I get to it.

 

[USMCAirWinger]

just go to TaB Express Airlines...they will hire you with only 300 hrs

 

[johnpeace]

I can't afford to work there!

 

[TOGA]

Actually, it sounds like you have a better attitude, more maturity, greater humility, and a more realistic take on the profession than some people with hundreds of times the amount of flight time you have. Keep that up, and you'll very likely excel at whatever you put your heart and mind toward. Good luck!

 

[USMCAirWinger]

lol

 

[Gulfstream 200]

nope you certainly dont sound like an idiot...dont worry many here will tell you if you do!!

My suggestions would be teach at a school with a charter department - something you can move into. I personally dont see the value of multi-engine training - other than to log some time to move on...and master VMC demos or whatever..(but thats just me)

Dont waste time in a remote flight school in the middle of nowhere. Move and be where the corporate jobs are if thats your goal. You could be the most talented, experienced pilot in Bumscrew, Iowa but guess what? the 1 King Air on the field is hard to get into...you know what I mean. Be where the planes are.

either way just bang out those flight hours as quick as possible - whatever it takes. Make and keep many good connections along the way - be known as a reliable, good guy. Be every careful about burning bridges but ALWAYS look out #1. Its a fine line, but always look forward.

Did I say make connections along the way??

Oh, and there ARE plenty of good corp jobs out there - but they are usually filled by reccomedation. But there are also good fractional jobs out there - and up until recently, all you needed was the hour requirement and you got an interview... The 2 are VERY different....but both can be very rewarding careers.

I happen to like my corp job very much and would be very bored with an airline gig....but I have to ask.....why not shoot for that Major Airline job? Dont discount it just beacuse most of the industry is still in the tank...The golden airline gigs are even fewer and far between than ever, but I still think that being a very senior airline Capt is a GREAT job. The future there is pretty cloudy but keep your options open..

any questions? just ask, you will get good answers from many experienced folks, many with more experience than me, thats for sure...!!

Good Luck

 

[enigma]

What is your collective professional opinion on the impact these new 'micro jet' aircraft are going to have on the job market?

I'm afraid that they will not have a major impact on the professional pilot job market. The will most likely be flown by owner operators, or will replace the old Lear35/Citation/Mitsubishi/'s that are currently in service at midsized corporations. Obviously, those operators already have pilots.

What kind of requirements will you expect for jobs flying these planes? How do you think PIC time in these jets will look to employers flying heavier aircraft?

I expect that the insurance companies will demand the same qualifications for a micro-jet that they do for the existing bottom of the rung corporate turbine aircraft. Remember, most of the insurance is there to pay off families after the funeral, and the size of airplane that killed you doesn't really matter if you're dead. Once the airplanes have a proven track record, the rates/qualifications will be adjusted, but I doubt that we will ever see 300 hour microjet Captains.

If these jets fly at the same speeds and altitudes as other jets, I would imagine that other employers will look at them as any other jet.

I really want to fly fractional and then corporate and am looking at these new jets as an awesome way to get the experience (simply due to the projected numbers of them that will be flying and the relatively simple systems that will probably be crewed by lower time pilots).

Just wonder what kind of job market impact you guys think these planes will have.

See paragraph one.

You certainly seem to have a great grasp on the reality of the business. I wish you success. Keep us up with your progress.

regards,
enigma

 

[AeroDMB]

HUGE IMPACT...you just wait.

From personal aircraft to corporations to the air taxi market, the market is huge and you will be wowed at the revolutionary aspect of these jets. Remember, only a few will make it.

Take a look...

 

[JimNtexas]

I can't see these small jets replacing very many existing business jets.

They are airplanes with useful loads comparable to a Bonaza and not much more cabin space. They'd be a big step down for someone used to existing business jets. I don't think they could operate at a profit with two pilots, even if the copilot worked for free. There wouldn't be enough load left for the paying passengers. That's why they all want single pilot certification.

There is a chance that they will create a new market for people moving from first class airline travel who have never chartered before. If so, then there will be that many more pilot jobs.

The safety issue is huge of course. They all say they'll have super training and star wars level automation. It will be interesting to see how they work out.

 

[ClassdAviator]

suck a**

 

[GogglesPisano]

And the skies are not crowded enough already?

 

[Dubya]

Funny

Quote by johnpeace:
"While working as a CFI there, I will try to bogart all the multi students I can to build the multi time."


Holy smokes! I haven't heard the word "bogart in eon's!! I love it!

I can't wait to bogart some multi time too! LMAO

"I will also bring doughnuts to the folks down the hall at the busy charter/aircraft management/maintenance company, in an effort to endear myself to the people who have PC-12s and King Airs and Lear and Citations to fly."


If regular methods don't work....clog their arteries and send them to the med examiner!!

Does Krispy Kreme have a credit line?

W

 

[johnpeace]

I happen to like my corp job very much and would be very bored with an airline gig....but I have to ask.....why not shoot for that Major Airline job? Dont discount it just beacuse most of the industry is still in the tank...The golden airline gigs are even fewer and far between than ever, but I still think that being a very senior airline Capt is a GREAT job. The future there is pretty cloudy but keep your options open..

Great reply...thanks.

We're moving from Hawaii to the Atlanta area this summer. Since making the decision to pursue this career I have just about completed my PPL, but want to finish my training in a more...um, professional environment.

Note: our move is the best family move we can make right now...no lectures about the stupidity of leaving Hawaii, please.

So, why don't I want to work as an airline pilot?

I'd prefer working for smaller companies.

Also, I'm 30 years old and just don't want to spend my whole career scratching and clawing for that ultimate golden ring of the major airline left seat.

I think I could be really happy flying more days, for less money at a company that will allow me to rise through the ranks a little faster.

I'd rather get settled into a career position (at Netjets or Flexjets) and just start building my seniority.

If I do that, in 10 years I'm looking good. During the next downturn, I'm that much farther away from furlough. If I go the charter->regional->major route, in 10 years I'm starting over at the bottom (due to jumping around from employer to employer so much). During the next downturn I'm wherever my seniority number places me at that point in my career...that's a little too vulnerable a position.

At my age, I don't have the time to start over at the bottom again.

It also looks like 91/135 pilots get to have a more hands on role in their missions than the 121 pilots...I enjoy the responsibility of attending to all of the details and seeing it come off smoothly.

Maybe I have it all wrong...but it seems like a pretty solid plan to me.

Like I said, having received the opportunity to do this, I'm totally happy just to be able to fly for a job at all...if I'm able to meet my long term career goals, that's just gravy.

Thanks for all the help, you guys are an invaluable source of information...even if you are sort of volatile.

 

[enigma]

I'd rather get settled into a career position (at Netjets or Flexjets) and just start building my seniority.

There are NO career positions in aviation!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Let me hear an amen, Brothers, let me hear an amen.

enigma

 

[Jump Pilot]

I haven't heard "bogart" since about 1986-87. Excellent. Keep up the old school and you will go far.

For you younger/older types, here is the definition:

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=bogart

 

[Jump Pilot]

Fine.

Try this: Urban Dictionary