Mesaba

[T-handle]

First off let me clarify some of my statements. I wouldn't discourage anyone from applying and interviewing at Mesaba. I'm not saying it's a horrible place because if it is, I wouldn't be here. However, what I am trying to say is our "CURRENT situation" is not promising.

I may be wrong in that everyone recalled and hired will be furloughed. My guess is as good as any other XJ pilot's guess. That's up to MGT which in turn is up to NWA marketing. (Also bear in mind that 3 Saabs were badly damaged from a recent tornado touching down in MSP. Not sure if any AVROs were hurt. This is also another blow to our flying.) We are all just guessing that everyone recalled and hired will be furloughed (again) in the Fall but maybe there's something we don't know.

I said for anyone that is being recalled or interviewing to hang onto their current job or work something out with their boss knowing you might be back where u work now. For those that have never interviewed with an airline, it could be good practice. For those hired, it's just getting that seniority number so that when we get a new contract (assuming that too) and start growing, you'll have a number here and will be recalled and life will be grand again.

Once again, Mesaba's current situation is not the greatest. But realize that ALL airlines go through these times, in all shapes, sizes and forms. Some minor, others bad. Going on strike sucks and we hope to avoid one. I enjoy working with the people here. It's just MGT and how they're dragging their nutz at the table that is pissing me off. And there's one (hairless) MSP chief pilot in particular that annoys me (and probably many more of us). Every time I pass him in the airport, I take off my hat and look away.

Anyway, good luck to those applying/interviewing. And don't drink too much of the Kool-Aid that MGT will feed you at the interviewing table.

 

[Simon Says]

I second T-Handle,

Mesaba is just too unstable to quit one job to come over here. My guess is that XJ management will furlogh again.

 

[skyvike]

Simon Says,

I think "unstable" is too strong of a word. "Unpredictable", yes but not unstable.

Mesaba is a strong company, virtually never having failed to make a profit and is still more than 25% bigger than Pinnacle. If it weren't for the contract negotiations, Mesaba's growth would have continued along with Pinnacle's. Since the pendulum will undoubtedly swing in the other direction once the pilot contract is signed, this may be a very good time to get on with Mesaba.

Pinnacle's amendable date is now less than two years away so if "The Gang that Couldn't Shoot Straight" dawdles much longer, they'll miss the chance to whipsaw the Pinnacle pilots.

The fact that Mesaba is hiring pilots now that won't be able to fly the line until after the usual "annual furlough" time may just be an indication that NWA couldn't avoid starting the pendulum in Mesaba's direction now. They just have too much flying they want to give to the "discount" regionals. (Cuz the regionals are money makers and mainline is a money loser). Spandex and company will deny it, of course, and nothing is ever certain but I don't think they'd hire right now unless they had good reason to believe they would actually need the pilots through the winter.

It's a pretty expensive means of keeping the pilots scratching their heads, don't you think?

Cheers,

S

 

[flap operator]

My parents taught me when I was a kid that I should make sound decisions based on thorough evaluation and weighing of all consequences (they must have known I was going to be a pilot.) They also taught me that when that is done, sometimes going with your instincts and gut feelings are the way to tip the scale for that ultimate decision. Maybe I've been lucky, but I've followed that advice. It hasn't been a smooth paved road of course, because it never is. No matter how high the city budget is there will always be potholes. But I have been mostly right in all my gut feeling based decisions. Women, friends, purchases and of course, my job.

After 9/11 I was dangerously close to the bottom and angonized everyday on what I should do with myself. Should I quit and jump ship to somewhere else? Should I run away from the "contract blues" and forget aviation so early in my career? I'm not a quitter and not usually overreactionary (well, sometimes) so I decided to see what happens. I survived the first round of furloughs. Then the second. I decided to opt again with the gut feeling and analytical approach to things. I've decided to stick this bumpy road out and stay comitted to XJ. After all, XJ was my number 1 choice to airlines to work at. No matter how bitter things may get here, I'm still comitted to our passengers, fellow employees and my job. I'm young and have MANY years of aviation ahead of me. I will not blame Mesaba for the last 3 years of my life (ok - maybe only the pay and debt the awful pay has caused - but I knew the $$$ wasn't bling bling coming into this job). I don't feel behind any of my peers. Why? Becuase I went with my gut. If I had gone to Coex = furloughed. Eagle = furloughed. YOu just can't predict the furture, but can make sound decisions and go with the outcome. We all made the choice to come to Mesaba, nobody forced us, and to blame XJ for the career progressions, or lack there of, as highlighted by KSU - and we all know who he is - is just immature and irresponsible.

I guess what I'm saying is what all the other XJ pilots have already said on this board. Take all the information available to you. Eat it, digest it and come up with a conscious decision that is best for YOU. Then stick with it and take the punches as they come to you. COntract blues happen at every airline, it's just our turn. Maybe getting in now, really IS the best thing. Who knows... I don't. Only you can.

Good luck on the interview.... be yourself and tell them honest answers, not what you think they want to hear. Mesaba is made up of the best aviation folks out there - as mentioned before. I enjoy myself at work because of the passengers and my coworkers. Share with us if you want how it went. I'm curious to know what they'll tell you and if you'll watch the "SImply the best" video (yes PCL boys and girls, that phrase was coined at XJ long before your company started putting those banners in the DTW hallway).

FO

 

[Anaconda]

forget the "simply the best" video. the big question is if Tyson is going to be there. she is much better to watch than that video.

 

[SeaX]

wtf

any one else ever notice that when xj's in trouble or getting screwed they talk about "brother hood among pinnacle and mesaba" but 2 days later you get bashing 9e or something like that?

 

[CWASaab]

SeaX

I'm not sure who you are, who you work for or how much you know, so I will try to fill you in.

While I don't condone 'bashing' 9E, I will admit that not everyone here at Xj is behaving as they should.

That being said, I doubt any XJer is really targeting the people at 9E, we simply recognize that in the corporate shell game being played over at 5101 Northwest Drive, Eagan, MN Pinnacle has the spotlight, for now. Most all of us are aware that the majority of the pilots at 9E support us and mean us no harm, it is NWA that is using 9E to antagonize the pilots of XJ.

Please notice that I said the majority of the 9E pilots, this was not a mistake. Back in 1997 when XJ was in the spotlight, and 9E was languishing in the corner, NWA consolidated all of the Airlink flying in MSP and gave that flying to XJ. The pilots at Mesaba Airlines agreed to allow pilots from 9E to transfer to XJ with seniority. Not only did the captains from 9E come with either 1-2 or 1-3 seniority, but FOs came over with a specific date, several months before they were actually hired, effectively leap-frogging several new hire classes, including mine.

We did not have to do this, we did it because it was the right thing to do. For me the difference is between holding a line and being on build-up/reserve. And despite the fact that I suffer from the effects of having people who came on property after I did, but have several months of seniority over me, I support this action and I am glad we did it, it is indicative of this pilot group's integrity.

One provision of the letter of agreement was that if the situation were to be reversed, the MECs would need to meet and work out a reciprocal deal with conditions no less favorable for Mesaba pilots.

So with Mesaba shrinking, furloughing pilots (thankfully they have been recalled) and losing airplanes while Pinnacle gets CRJs, hires and migrates North what happens to this agreement?

Nothing. The pinnacle mec does nothing, splits hairs over how the transfer of flying isnt the same as '97 or some cr*p. Pardone my language, but that is a load of b*llsh*t.

See my login name? See my signature? I am no longer a CWASaab driver because of 9E flights into CWA, specifically overnights. Or how about we talk to the folks at stations like ATW, LNK, and ELM? A pay cut to work for 9E and the managers were reportedly not even offered jobs.

Yeah, I know, this is all NWAs doing, fueling the fire of discontent and competiton. But you know what? In 1997 the pilots here did the right thing. The pilots at Pinnacle have allowed their elected leaders to discredit them and do them a great disservice.

So perhaps the pilots at Mesaba have a right to be suspect of Pinnacle as we try to extend our level of brotherhood to our peers in the red tail family.

The only way to defeat managment's whipsaw tactics and achieve good contracts for all is too be for all.

I certainly appreciate all of the Pinnacle folks that have expressed thier support for us now, as I recognize it is vital. As will ours be when the tables turn in the future. I look forward to welcomming 9E pilots into our info picket lines.

So SeaX there is history, and to many of us here at XJ it seems like we have been the 'bigger' group, offering jobs, to our own detrement, when NWA tries to pit us against each other. And in return we recieve the cold shoulder from the the 9E MEC when the situation is reversed.

And despite this treatment, we continue to strive for brotherhood, to be the 'bigger' group.

I am not trying to 'bash' 9E pilots, I count good friends amongst their ranks. I am trying to highlight that we must work together, that as individuals we must be vocal in telling our MECs that this is what we expect.

And no, I do not begin to think that Mesaba pilots are somehow better than 9E pilots simply due to the past. I do think that our union leaders are blessed with fantasitc vision for the future, and an unwavering sense of duty to the line pilots they represent, a connection that they work hard to maintain.

 

[flap operator]

SEAx - not trying to pick any fights here. But if your last post was a remark in reference to my comment about "Simply the Best" - it was not PCL bashing. I was stating the fact. That video I would imagine was spwned from the fact that XJ was THE BEST PLACE to work for a long time. The ATW award I think is what gave them the idea for this video. I realize it wasn't a patented slogan by Mesaba - but it's really sort of funny that now PCL is using the same slogan. Whatever - it's trivial crap and I'm sorry you took offense to the comment.


See you in the hubs...

FO

 

[alrightythen23]

I was a little skeptical on the hiring but I just saw it for myself. I guess it's official because it is on www.mesaba.com under the employment section. Unbelievable!!

 

[DoinTime]

One provision of the letter of agreement was that if the situation were to be reversed, the MECs would need to meet and work out a reciprocal deal with conditions no less favorable for Mesaba pilots.

So with Mesaba shrinking, furloughing pilots (thankfully they have been recalled) and losing airplanes while Pinnacle gets CRJs, hires and migrates North what happens to this agreement?

Nothing. The pinnacle mec does nothing, splits hairs over how the transfer of flying isnt the same as '97 or some cr*p. Pardone my language, but that is a load of b*llsh*t.

LOA 21.g reads:

In the event that a transaction such as the one which gave rise to this Letter of Agreement occurs in the future, where such transaction involves in a net loss of pilot positions at Mesaba and a net gain of pilot positions at Express, it is hereby agreed that the parties shall enter into a Letter of Agreement to provide for the transfer of Mesaba pilots to Express, under terms and conditions no less favorable than the terms and conditions of this Letter of Agreement.

First off there has been no transactions between XJ and 9E since this LOA except for the 11 B model Saabs that 9E signed the leases over to XJ last year. Retirements and changes in company staffing models are not transactions. 9E has also retired nearly 20 aircraft in addition to the 11 B models lost to XJ last year since the first CRJ hit the property. When XJ absorbed 9E's MSP flying we lost almost 40% of our flying overnight. Yet when XJ posted their capacity statistics for May they had a 3.1% INCREASE in ASM's year over year. Where is this shrinking you are talking about???? 9E has also closed domiciles, displaced senior captains out of their chosen domicile, and displaced captains to fo's all in the same timeframe that XJ pilots have had to endure.

If you think brotherhood means rolling over and offering a seniority grab or captains seats over your unfortunate situation that nowhere near resembles what went down in '97 you are crazy. Your MEC has let this issue idle because it is a dead end road. Our MEC chairman arranged a preferential hiring agreement for any of your pilots that wanted to come over but was humiliated when NOT A SINGLE pilot (furloughed or active) showed any interest after the ground work was laid.

See my login name? See my signature? I am no longer a CWASaab driver because of 9E flights into CWA, specifically overnights. Or how about we talk to the folks at stations like ATW, LNK, and ELM? A pay cut to work for 9E and the managers were reportedly not even offered jobs.

I guess you prefer that your mother company continue to loose market share to other carriers serving CWA with RJ's. When you lost stations at ATW, LNK, and ELM it was an even swap for three of our southern stations. Your people did not take a pay cut. Their pay was frozen until their longevity at 9E exceeded their frozen rate. This is the same pay treatment that LOA 21 offered for transferring pilots. I don't know if managers were offered a management position within 9E. It would be pretty stupid for 9E to hire outside managers and I'm sure the management at our former stations got the exact same treatment.


I will support XJ pilots to the bitter end. I will continue to walk your picket lines and, if it comes to it, pay strike assessments and contribute to any funds for the continuation of your benefits. You guys deserve everything you are asking for and I sincerely hope you get it but get your facts straight and freed from emotion when degrading our pilots or our MEC.