Mesaba pilot contract summary

[Beerme]

Re: Not entirely surprised, but disappointed

And per diem, that's been the biggest insult because you layover in sometimes the same cities as NWA and their crews are making correct if I'm wrong over $2.00 hour. Good luck!

Domestic: $1.85
Int'l: $2.05

 

[winged princess]

As a Comair pilot, I want the Mesaba pilot group to know that we are behind you in whatever you decide.

Our MEC has requested we have checks ready to send to help you and your families.

Going on strike is no picnic. You will decide if this TA is what you can live with. After 89 days on strike, our TA was not what we wanted, but it passed. We thought we should have gotten everything we wanted, but it doesn't always work like that.

We will back you whatever happens.

wp

 

[Tflyer70]

To my fellow pilots at Comair: Since you have been down this road, I would like to know what the changes were from Managements last offer for a TA, and what you received on the contract signing after the strike. Did any parts of the contract get worse, or better? And what was the difference in section 3 items from what was first proposed and what was finally settled.

Thanks for all of you and the other carrriers support. Mesaba pilots including myself deeply appreciate it.

 

[mesaba13]

I agree with stallion that something big went down that night and the negotiators got to see the man behind the curtain. Came up well below my expectations and I am probably more company than most.

You have close to 400 FO's of which most will be disappointed. There are hundreds of junior captains that will not like it. There will always be some senior guys that will complain about anything.
I dont see it passing without 100 crj's tied to the deal!

 

[Simon Says]

I want to apologize to all who supported us (and still do support us) for putting forward this TA. The only good thing in it is scope. Rest assured this fight is not over. We will overwhelmingly vote it down. We are not going to sell out for scope.

Big Sky, now do you see what kind of damage you have caused by not standing with us. Now you guys are the enemy and we will have to write you off. We were willing to give you one for one senority if only you stood up and fought the power.

 

[T-handle]

Now the question is does our MEC have what it takes to declare a strike when this TA is voted down???? Or are they going to try to go back to the table and waste more time with the company? I lost a little faith after January 9th 11pm CST when they decided to extend the deadline indefinitely. But when they assured us that the contract was in line with our peers (and it wasn't) I lost even more faith.

 

[AWACoff]

Ouch...

Vote the way you need to guys but remember this...Air Wisconsin settled too soon and look where it got us. That TA is poor. You can do better. MUCH better.

 

[de Pez]

Quoted from the TA: "Q Captain pay increases are 5.1% across the board. The Captain payscale tops out at 18 years and pay rates differ by the aircraft type, as delineated by seat ranges."

"Q All pilot payscales will increase by 2% for the first two years after signing, and 4% over the last two years."



Hmmm. Isn't the last contract almost three years out of date already? So no one has received an additional raise in three years?...(Can this be correct?) Prices aren't the same today as they were 3 years ago, but your pay is?! Assuming a standard 3% inflationary cost of living per year (the standard basis for calculating inflation and the cost of living), then the "old contract's" payscales are at least 9% less valuable today than three years ago....

So, a raise of 5.1% + 2% + 2% ("for the first 2 years," am I reading this correctly? Or is it 2% over 2 years?) would work out to be a total raise of 9.1% two years after contract ratification. However, subtracting out the additional 6% cost of living expense associated with inflation two years from now as discussed above, that would leave total inflationary costs at 15% over five years, offset by a raise in the second year of the contract of 9.1%. Unless there are significant retirement perks, or something else I'm missing, then this TA would in fact be 5.9% LESS pay in terms of buying power than the last contract...Please correct me if I'm wrong with my assumptions or numbers, but I think this might in fact be a pay cut!

 

[skybwnd]

simon says....


So what you're saying is all the problems you guys have suffered over the past 3 years with your contract is the fault of the Big Sky pilots?? And as far as standing with you......ALPA turned down Big Sky not once, but twice. We stand behind the Mesaba pilots......don't go blaming us, the Big Sky pilots, for your problems. If we had our way, Mesaba pilots would get everything they asked for.

 

[T-handle]

I'm still in shock

Overall, this TA is "OK to maybe somewhat good" at best. But that was not our goal and apparently our negotiators/MEC strayed way off course on several issues especially pay.

This is how I see it. Before Big Sky was bought, Pay was our top priority along with Scheduling and Retirement. The company new that to reduce labor costs they had to divert our attention to a non economic but important issue. So Foley went out to buy Big Sky to threaten our jobs so Scope then became our top priority. I could see the company at the table just hours before the deadline saying Ok you can get Scope but you're gonna have to give up a little in pay and scheduling to get it. Hell I wouldn't be surprised if Johnny Ornstein was sitting on XJ's side that night. Scope costs the company nothing, it's just a bargaining chip that they played very well.

NWA told us in '96 if we want to fly the Avros you're going to have to sell out the FOs. Then NWA backed then-Express into the corner in '98-'99 to fly the CRJs. At least those two scenarios were pretty much guaranteeed growth. Now Mesaba is faced with NO GUARANTEE of any new airplanes, on top of losing 36 airplanes and 300-350 pilots. So if we agree to this TA, we lower our standards AND still risk losing up to 350 pilots. So as I see it, we all wanted to raise Saab and AVRO pay knowing we have no guaranteed growth. And hell, even if NWA just replaces the Avros with 36 CRJs, that's not growth.

To back up what I said earlier, something sinister went down on Jan. 9th. There is all kinds of talk that management scared the sh!t out of our MEC with bankruptcy and liquidation talk at the last minute and we blinked. There is talk of NWA dangling another big a$$ carrot in front of us and they ONLY way to grow Mesaba was to bite the orange focker. I'm still in shock as to why, after 2.5 years of company stalling, we agreed to go past a deadline? WHY? Did they freakin taint the negotiator's water with some drug?

We may truly never know what happened 1 minute before the deadline, besides what they said in the opening pages of the TA's summary. But what we do know is 98% voted in favor of a strike, a deadline was set, and when the time came, a decision to accept a TA or go on strike at that VERY minute had to be made. The pilots EXPECTED that. We didn't vote nor recommend or suggest to extend a deadline indefinitely. Either a TA that is, at the minimum, 98-99% of our goals or a strike. Period. Neither was met. I didn't care either way, I am just disappointed a decision wasn't made at 11:01pm CST on Jan 9th and to add insult to injury we just get a sugarcoated Mesa Contract after they assured us that it was in line with our peers at Comair, AirWis, and ACA.

Hell if we took ACA's current contract, tore off the cover and put Mesaba on it, I'd probably "reconsider" that. But our TA.... uh no. Like a fellow XJer said, we just got PUNK'D! Back to the table.

 

[Metropilot]

Does anybody know how to apply for a Mesaba pilot job? Soon to be jobless Big Sky pilot. I'm sure we will be greeted warmly.

 

[av8or98]

Anything less than 3% per year is no increase. Cost of living is 3%. 26.7% increase for new hire FO's??? Over what period of time? Is it an immediate 26.7% plus 2%, 2%, 4%, 4% or is it 26.7% over the life of the contract (26.7-4, -4, -2, -2, or 14.7%) Retro pay from the day the contract was ammendable? You should accept nothing less.

 

[FatesPawn]

I think I'm going to be sick. That's the best you get? Forget it. Strike. That's insulting. Back in 1997, I stood there while the former MEC chair told LEC106 that, "the best thing we can do for a first officer is give him a quick upgrade..."

What a bunch of crap. quick upgrade. Great. Give me some more Enron stock while you're at it.

This TA sounds like the same thing. Here's your GOOD scope language. Salivate over it. Wait for those CRJ's that are sure to come.... and heck, even if they don't this is just a stepping stone job after all, right? I get a nice phat $3000 retro check that's burnin a hole in my pocket for a new keg-o-rator. Yippee.

The bottom line is that you got a cost of living increase, a crummy 4hr minimum day and an 'unknown' retirement. Plan on that retirement. You aren't going to the show ladies gentlemen. You're AT the show. Now, go forth and act like professional pilots and tell management where to stick their insulting TA.

Q Mesaba Pilots will be the only pilots used to do flying for Mesaba Aviation, Inc. (Mesaba), MAIR Holdings, Inc. (MAIR) or any future subsidiary of MAIR. (MAIR is the parent company for Mesaba.)

This is the only good part about the contract I see

Q Captain pay increases are 5.1% across the board. The Captain payscale tops out at 18 years and pay rates differ by the aircraft type, as delineated by seat ranges.

Q All pilot payscales will increase by 2% for the first two years after signing, and 4% over the last two years.

Nice, this is, what cost of living plus 3 or 4%?

Q Pilots will still be guaranteed 75 hours of pay, regardless of the amount of flying a pilot does. If a pilot flies more than 75 hours, they will be paid for the total amount. (e.g. a pilot actually flies 55 hours in a month, they are paid for 75; a pilot actually flies 85 hours in a month, they are paid for 85)

Careful here... are you guys giving up your "trip" block or better language for a "monthly " block or better language? You already have a monthly block or better deal. It looks like with the new language if you fly 3 hrs extra in the first 2 trips of the month and the last 2 trips are under that 3 hrs, you'll end up with your line guarentee of 85:15 or whatever the original month paid you.

Q For every duty day, a pilot will be guaranteed 4 hours of pay. For example, if a pilot operates two MSP-STC round trip flights over one day, the actual flight credit for the entire day (four flights) is only worth 2:40. If the first round trip operates between 9 am and noon, and the second operates from 5pm to 8pm, the pilot is on-duty for 11 hours. Mesaba will pay 4 hours as a minimum day guarantee.

This is the sort of trickery Spanjers tried to use with us for years. This won't get your more $$ per month. It just makes them schedule you for 4hrs per day. It's a QOL advance for sure, but see my comments above for how your paycheck will be altered with the new guarentee... if that's truly how it is.

Q Retroactive Pay: All pilots will receive a retroactive paycheck within 30 days of the date of signing of the new contract. The amount of the paychecks will vary from $450 to $6300 depending on the amount of flight pay earnings for 2003. First Officers will receive a retro payment of 10% of their pay from 2003, and Captains will receive a retro payment of 5% of their pay from 2003.

Enough to pay for new tires for your airporter.

Retirement

The improvements in retirement greatly increase the amounts of matched contributions made by the Company. Under the new matching and vesting schedule agreed to, a pilot with a 30 year career at Mesaba, deferring 15% of income in addition to the full employer match will retire with 55% of his final average earnings, using common actuarial assumptions.

How much match? Why don't they make it simple? How bout a straight 50% match? Not 6.874982378$ on the first 9.4723672% until you have 3.14159 years with the company and then ...... Sounds like they are just polishing the turd a bit here gentlemen. And the MEC thinks 55% of your FAE is enough to live on??? I should put them in touch with my retired mother. She would go in there with a flamethrower if someone told her that you can live comfortably on 55% of your FAE.

Q Per-Diem: 10 cent increase to $1.45/hr of duty, $.05 increase per year

Do you have direct deposit of your per diem now? Per Diem was forgotten in 1997 when they renegotiated the duration of the contract to bend over for the Avros. I know, I was there. That's why you never had an increase and partly why you never had direct deposit on your per diem... BTW... do you have it yet?

Good luck XJ'ers. I wish you the best, but don't be afraid to turn this crap down, send them back to the table, and risk shutting down the company. It ain't that much to walk away from.

Fate's Pawn

 

[T-Gates]

Mesa showed each and every one of us that a good contract should not be sacrificed for job-protecting scope. You can get scope and more of what you want if you keep trying!

 

[avrodriver]

I'm with everyone else...be careful guys. This contract isn't about getting what you are owed just for today. This is your new contract for the next 4-6 years. Here at AWAC I'm locked into a fricken 8 year deal, if I get stuck in the F/O seat like I did at Mesaba life is going to su.ck (flamers I was on probation when we voted our concessions in so save it). If I was allowed to vote when we were faced with the deal there's no way I would have bit down on the lets vote this in so we can get growth carrot, I had learned already. Look at whats in store for Mesaba even if you do get a decent sized RJ order out of it. They will replace Saabs for the most part......even worse case senario the Avros too ( personally I don't think they are going anywhere though). It's payday guys......for F/O's it's a no brainer He.lllllllllllls No. They fukd us for years and now they want to play catch up and then do it for 6 more. Why the heck would they choose to out of all the payscales to bump the first year pay even above Comair & Whisky........I'd say because for a decent length of this contract they don't plan on having to pay it out. Good luck guys. AD

p.s. TW (MEC) makes me sick for not taking this all the way. How long was everyone waiting to go on strike??? What were the strike vote results??? I guarantee you get told this is the best your going to get, but the next day.....after you are stuck with it, you'll be told "You voted it in, don't look at me" C-YA!