Mesa Pilot Development?

[bobbysamd]

Handouts

[Y]ou must be able to think on your own (seriously). Stop looking for handouts and call them for pete's sake...

That what he's been doing for over a week; first, by posting about P-F-T and hoping for positive validation and, now, posting on pay-for-interview and hoping for the same thing.

P-F-T and pay-for-interview are forms of handouts, intended to circumvent the ordinary airline hiring process.

 

[User546]

I went there. Graduated in 2000 and went into the Dash-8 with 273 total time.

Rojo, have you only gained 600 hours since getting hired in 2000?? Your profile says 900 hours, and that'd be only like 150 hours a year?? Are you not flying much, furloughed, or whats the deal??

 

[SkyBoy1981]

Nobody updates those things. Its too much work.

 

[wheelsup]

He stated a few pages back (I believe, maybe another thread, to lazy to look ) that he quit a few months after going to Mesa to persue greener pastures...

~wheelsup

 

[wheelsup]

That what he's been doing for over a week; s.

I guess where I was going with it is that he continuously posts questions on here that are easilyanswered by looking at a website or by calling, his questions seem rather un-informed, and it struck a nerve I guess...

~wheelsup

 

[bobbysamd]

MAPD Pay

I'm *pretty sure* he was talking about flying the line. I sure hope he wasn't complaining about working as a CFI...$26,000 - $32,000/yr ain't bad...

If you don't mind my asking, and, if you do, say so, but is MAPD still paying $15/hour or is it paying more now?

 

[ROJO]

User997,

I left Mesa after about a year of flying the line. I liked the company OK, I really didn't feel abused or treated poorly, but all my classmates who are still there are fairly unhappy. The pay sucked. I made $19 per hour on the Dash-8 as a first year F/O. Of course, all first year F/O pay at the regionals sucks.

In any case, I found airline flying to be boring, and I decided to apply with the foreign service, which I later joined. I really enjoy my new career, but miss flying sometimes. I wouldn't hesitate to recommend Mesa, MAPD or PACE to anyone who truly loves flying and wants to be a professional.

For all the nay-sayers out there.....don't talk down to your Mesa brothers and sisters. Airline pilots are a great group of people, and they are stronger as a whole when they look out for one another.

 

[bobbysamd]

Career Changing

I found airline flying to be boring . . . .

Really. I guess it's different when you're on the outside looking in and is something you had wanted at some point.

I decided to apply with the foreign service, which I later joined. I really enjoy my new career . . . .

Now, I'd bet that's interesting. Again, from the outside looking in.

Good luck with your new career. You have a great new boss in Condoleezza Rice - a major improvement over Larry Risley and/or Frank O (intentional).

 

[islandhopper]

The pilot group at MAG has demonstrated to the industry their ability to Blow the Hebrew at the helm of this POS for many years.

Real nice.

 

[islandhopper]

Having survived both MAPD and Mesa I can say the program works, it is exactly as advertised. I got in, got out, blah blah. Timing was everything. That being said I would not recommend MAPD to anyone now because the catch is you must work for Mesa after you finish. I interviewed right after I was done with the program, others have waited almost two years working at Home Depot to interview after MAPD.

When I signed up for MAPD back in 1997, I wasn't even aware Mesa had any jets. They may have been buying their first few at that time. All I was told was that if sucessful, I would be flying Beech 1900's on the East Coast or in New Mexico. That sounded harmless enough.

Well let me tell you all that changed. By the time I interviewed in 2000 I was ready to tell the interviewee "look pal, I didnt sign up for this $hit" will all the g-damm RJ's they bought. After a while the jets seemed like a good idea, I was gaining seniority faster than I could count, then about a year 1/2 into my employment with Mesa the whole freedom debacle went down and what resemblence of a good place to work mesa ever might have had was gone. Mesa will go out of their way to make you hate your job. They wan't you to quit so they can replace with a lower paid probationary pilot. Larry Risley used to tell new hires to get their time and get out because after a few years they cost to much to pay them. This attitude still prevails even though Risley is gone.

I really just wanted to work for a small airline. Mesa is a monster now. I have other issues with them too, not real practical to get into here. All the jets did speed up things a ton. Their expansion is mostly over now. You'll be stuck on the bottom of a list of pilots 1700-1800 deep with serious issues.

The jet time does look nice on resumes. It helped get me my current job. If you REALLY love to fly, Mesa may be bearable, with a lot of "IFS"... if you finish training, if you dont get fired, if you dont violated (mesa pilot retention program) or killed. If you are just becoming a pilot for the money forget about it. Look for another career.

In a nutshell, mesa REALLY sucks, my stepdaughter is thinking about a flight school now, I will not let her anywhere near MAPD. The Chief flight instructor over there is still a good friend of mine, the program works, just working for Mesa is out of the question. Even with how much I know the program works and the quality of training and being personal friends with the Chief flight instructor (RC) I wouldn't even consider MAPD.

I guess you might think thats kind of hipocritical of me since it all worked out for me, but I have too many friends that got big time f-ed over by mesa, they tried to fire me for some stupid BS, I have friends that are even dead now too because of Mesa. Thats a little bit too much of a price to pay for a little multi engine turbine time.

Just like you are now, I was very naive about airlines getting into this. If you really love to fly, try and find another way. mesa will make you HATE aviation in no time quick. That I promise!!

 

[bobbysamd]

Hating Mesa

Mesa will go out of their way to make you hate your job . . . .

So true. I worked at the flight school in 1993, when Risley was still there. I stayed for only a few months because I disliked my job intensely.

I had lost a flying job a few months before my MAPD interview. I disclosed my job loss fully and completely to John Green and Gary Risley, Larry's brother and corporate counsel, at my interview. They stated it would be no problem. Of course, the real deal for MAPD instructors was upgrading to the line, so when I was hired I was really excited about the opportunity to fly the line eventually, after trying for five years, unsuccessfully. But, when I reported to Corporate, I was told that because I lost a job I might not be hired altogether - after I had just moved one-thousand miles from California to take the MAPD job. They said later that I could work at the school but, because I had been terminated, I could never fly for Mesa Airlines.

John Green insisted he did not know that policy. I say, bull$hit. How could he not know that policy, especially with Gary Risley sitting at his side?? How could Gary Risley, corporate counsel, not know that policy??

They wan't you to quit so they can replace with a lower paid probationary pilot. Larry Risley used to tell new hires to get their time and get out because after a few years they cost to much to pay them. This attitude still prevails even though Risley is gone . . . .

I was older (42) when I applied to MAPD. I had interviewed with airline previously when I was 40. Perhaps it was afraid that I would stay, top out at scale, and vest in its 401-K. G-d forbid that someone would exhibit loyalty to a company for being given a chance. I would say that Risley's, and Frank O.'s, attitude about not wanting its pilots to stay prevails at the regionals - though I know of at least one regional pilot who was hired relatively young and will stay til retirement.

Having said all this, Mesa is a means to an end. Follow the late Mr. Risley's advice. Train at MAPD, be hired at 300 hours, get your time, get your ATP on Mesa's nickel, and move on.

 

[mcjohn]

Where to go? Oh, Where to go.
I think wannabe professional pilots suffer from Perfect Ideal High Paying Job Syndrome. If you hate your job, you might suffer from entitlement issues.

 

[bobbysamd]

Where to go? Oh, Where to go.
I think wannabe professional pilots suffer from Perfect Ideal High Paying Job Syndrome. If you hate your job, you might suffer from entitlement issues.

I don't know how old you are, but wait until you've been working for most of your life, especially if much of it has been underappreciated. You'll then be whistling a different tune.

Besides, money isn't everything, but it's way ahead of whatever is in second place.

 

[BSAV8R]

Mapd

What San Juan College does along with Mesa is take a "0" time pilot and turn them into a Commercial Pilot. It does have its drawbacks however. My son-in-law just graduated in December and he will get his interview in May. The reduction of 1900 flying is pushing all those pilots into the CRJ and that creates very little upward movement necessary for the new hire. I like the school alot and I talked to the airline operations class several times.

The quality of instruction, the airplanes, the "airline envirnment". Somebody asked me how much it costs to become a professional pilot....whatever the costs are; it is worth it. Yes there are a lot of people out on the streets, yes major airlines are laying off. But this is a cyclic business. In three to five years we will be growing again. I recommended San Juan Mapd to my son-in-law and I'm an Embry-Riddle graduate. Which is also a wonderful school but has gotten very pricy.

 

[SkyBoy1981]

....whatever the costs are; it is worth it.

Unfortunately if people have this attitude it will allow overpriced and overrated schools like Riddle to continue ripping people off. Nothing personal against you, I just hate to see so many of my friends so far in debt to these places. I went to a "Ma and Pa" FBO flight school and turned out just fine. I'm not saying I'm an aviation textbook genious like some ERAU kid, but I get the job done safely and efficiently. The nice thing is that all of the loans for my training have long been paid off.