Mesa Pay

[Nancy Pryor]

NJA competitive minimums?

Didn't mean to sound like I was tootin,

You didn't. Congrats on the job.

And they are doing a lot of hiring right now.

What are competitive minimums there? Their hiring page says 2500 total, 500 multi, 250 instrument and an ATP, but doesn't mention competitive minimums. What are typical times etc of those being hired? Are they actually hiring at their minimums, or is that rare? How much do they care about turbine time? Turbine PIC time? How much choice do you have in domiciles and aircraft? Thanks.

 

[Flight Junkie]

Does anyone out there especially Mesa guys relize comair FO's are taking a 20 percent paycut, and will still be paid $4/hr more per hour

Oh yeah the other day I saw one of your sweet 90 seaters. The tail number was XXXXJO. How does that feel when you fill out your logbook.

Im not blaming anyone. Personally I could give a rats arss about any of this crap thats going on, however I have a difficult time understanding how another ALPA carrier can fly the same stuff for a lot less. The truth is you must work for MESA. I do have a second job, I will suck it up. And if comair goes under and The upgrade at mesa is 6 months I will refuse to work there

The f*&k you're not blaming anyone. When you state, "The tail number was XXXXJO. How does that feel when you fill out your logbook.", you're looking for a fight. If you didn't give a "rats arss" then you wouldn't have created the thread. Tell you what. I suggest you quit flying and go back to grammar school. While there, learn how to correctly construct a sentence, (apostrophies, capitalization, why NOT to use 'and' to start a sentence, and when to use a comma), then come back and deal with your divorce. She's just sticking around for that extra $13,000, that's why you feel like you're fighting with the old lady.

You stated, "...however I have a difficult time understanding how another ALPA carrier can fly the same stuff for a lot less." You should've just asked that question to begin with and not bashed the pilots there. You're a f*&king tool.

 

[Popeye0537]

Flight Junkie thanks for the english lesson.....Now shut your friggen pie hole!

I would have a problem takin a 20% pay cut also.

I hate Mesa....it's like a rash that won't go away

 

[RCA]

hey flight junkie i may be a tool in english class but at least i dont work for mesa. Or worse worked for Mesa in 2003 sold yourself and the poor bastards that are still there down the river for a quick upgrade and then moved on. i cant imagine you would have any other reason to defend a POS contract like this

 

[RJ Bum]

RCA - Maybe your lack of understanding is your problem.

ComAir's contract was signed under very different economic, industry and company ownership conditions.

ComAir's contract was signed pre 9/11. The airline industry was at its peak, and regionals airlines were the darlings...ComAir in particular. Delta had just gotten through paying 1 billion for ComAir (isn't that right?). So what was Delta going to do when it came contract time and the pilots went on strike? Was Delta going to shut the place down when they just shelled out a billion dollars? Yes, it was gutsy of the pilot group to strike, but then again they had a lot of bargaining leverage in their favor.

Mesa's contract, however, was signed post 9/11 which means very different economic, and airline industry conditions. Then there is the whole Freedom - alter-ego mess. Also, Mesa is not owned in whole or in part by any airline for which it provides feed. In short, we did not feel like we possessed the bargaining leverage we needed to get a much better contract. Most people say that we were gutless and a host of other things, but then again most did not know, and still don't know the facts. Also, these people were not in our shoes.

I'm just trying to understand your point here. Granted Comair's contract was signed pre 9/11, but you guys don't even come close to anyone signed after 9/11 (ie. Skywest, CHQ, Air Willie ect.)

 

[Comin-In-Hot]

Interesting, considering the "sweet 90 seaters" have either a FJ or LR registration. (N902FJ-N925FJ,N934FJ,N926LR-N956LR).

Sweet Avatar Dude!
:cartman::beer:imp:

 

[ERJFO]

2 Days ago in BUF we were on final and AirShuttle calls up "ready to go" obviously missing the large white lights and either mile from them (our airplane). Anyway we rolled the length and then their CA keys the mike and says "AirShuttle is waiting on someone", so then somone says "They must not get paid overs"... GREAT TIMES!

 

[ERJFO]

RCA - Maybe your lack of understanding is your problem.

ComAir's contract was signed under very different economic, industry and company ownership conditions.

ComAir's contract was signed pre 9/11. The airline industry was at its peak, and regionals airlines were the darlings...ComAir in particular. Delta had just gotten through paying 1 billion for ComAir (isn't that right?). So what was Delta going to do when it came contract time and the pilots went on strike? Was Delta going to shut the place down when they just shelled out a billion dollars? Yes, it was gutsy of the pilot group to strike, but then again they had a lot of bargaining leverage in their favor.

Mesa's contract, however, was signed post 9/11 which means very different economic, and airline industry conditions. Then there is the whole Freedom - alter-ego mess. Also, Mesa is not owned in whole or in part by any airline for which it provides feed. In short, we did not feel like we possessed the bargaining leverage we needed to get a much better contract. Most people say that we were gutless and a host of other things, but then again most did not know, and still don't know the facts. Also, these people were not in our shoes.

Okay, how about Horizon's contract and ExpressJets contract. They blow Mesa's away and both were signed in 2004.

 

[miles otoole]

Okay, how about Horizon's contract and ExpressJets contract. They blow Mesa's away and both were signed in 2004.

Yeah, but I wonder what the QOL for a 6 year FO at Horizon is like or how 2 year FO's at XJT feel about being furloughed because CHQ or MESA will under bid them? XJT couldn't afford it. They squeezed it out of management and will now pay dearly for it. Similar to NJAs contract which management clearly cannot afford. The junior folks will end up paying.

 

[ERJFO]

Yeah, but I wonder what the QOL for a 6 year FO at Horizon is like or how 2 year FO's at XJT feel about being furloughed because CHQ or MESA will under bid them? XJT couldn't afford it. They squeezed it out of management and will now pay dearly for it. Similar to NJAs contract which management clearly cannot afford. The junior folks will end up paying.

The QOL for a 6 year FO at Horizon is very good, quite a few days off and decent pay.

XJT could afford it, CAL couldn't afford XJT's cost +10%. Also, the contract wasn't squeezed out of management at all - infact there was very little difficulty in getting that contract from management (NONE!) Also, no one has said XJT will furlough or will have to. Those airplanes are XJT's to give back to CAL, not CALs to take away from XJT.

 

[DHPFLYN]

Good try. I don't work for Mesa, never have, never would...nor any regional for that matter. I did my 3-1/2 years at one, got out, went back to my previous career, and never looked back. I got sick of a lot of the BS you're sick of during my tenure in aviation, and decided it wasn't worth it anymore. By far the best decision I've made thus far in my life.

Fortunately, we live in America, and not some Communist regime. We are afforded choices. If we make a poor choice, or are unhappy with the choices we made, we can choose to do something to better ourselves, and our lives. If you're unhappy with putting up with all the crap in the aviation industry, perhaps look into doing something else? Trust me, it may not be easy at first, but you may end up looking back (like me) and seeing that it was the best thing that could have happened to you.

Just a thought.

I am glad you got in and go out and never looked back. Then why in the hell are you even in this forum?? Just do what you say never look back and just leave

 

[taloft]

Does anyone out there especially Mesa guys relize comair FO's are taking a 20 percent paycut, and will still be paid $4/hr more per hour

Nope, didn't realize it. Perhaps you should ask yourself why you accepted the paycut. I thought Comair pilots were the ones who fought for good contracts. Guess I was wrong?

 

[SpacemanSpiff]

Not every company is alike...

Okay, how about Horizon's contract and ExpressJets contract. They blow Mesa's away and both were signed in 2004.

Horizon is wholly owned by Alaska Air Group. Their management has demonstrated that they like to have control over their "product". Not much chance of those guys losing their flying anytime soon. Hopefully, for them, their flying is fully protected by scope. Those kinds of conditions add up to bargaining leverage...wouldn't you agree?

I am going to have to plead ignorance when it comes to ExpressJet. I know they were wholly owned at one time, however I cannot (not a high priority in my life) remember if they were wholly owned by Continental when they negotiated their contract. BTW, I am sure you realize that Continental is now looking to outsource at least a portion of ExpressJet's flying.

IMHO it boils down to differences in management. Can you see either Horizon's or ExpressJet's management operating the same way that JO does? Can you see Horizon's management starting a new certificate, even for a legitimate reason, and then saying that this new airline is going to use a new, non-union pilot group with a separate seniority list? And, BTW, they will be getting most all new a/c deliveries from now on. Can you see ExpressJet's management operate on a regular basis with the attitude of "if you don't like it then grieve it"?

By the way, you or RCA never commented directly about the differences in conditions, which I pointed out, between ComAir and Mesa. Those are some big differences. A lot of guys like to believe that every company is the same, but that's usually not how it is.

Hey, I am not whining about my company or my circumstances. I understand the difficulties of working here at Mesa. My personal situation is that I have good seniority, and it definitely helps in dealing with the pay and QOL issues. For new guys, particularly guys on reserve, it can be hell. Hopefully, we will be able to improve our pay and working conditions with our next contract.

The generalizations that some of you guys make are a bit rediculous, not to mention childish. Thanks for all of your enlightening comments.

Spiff

 

[Flight Junkie]

i cant imagine you would have any other reason to defend a POS contract like this

RCA, I didn't defend the contract, I defended the pilots there. Show me where in my post I defended the contract and not the pilots.

Flight Junkie thanks for the english lesson.....Now shut your friggen pie hole!

OK, I'll give you a shot at shutting it. Send an email to [email protected] and let me know where you want to meet.

....it's like a rash that won't go away

I'm sure you know all about rashes. This thread is like your love life...you've put your johnson in something where it doesn't belong.

 

[Cloudroller]

RCA is a Looser