Major job w/o PIC time?

[CKJET]

Just a quick note about the PIC requirement. I was hired at a major without PIC turbine and when I was furloughed I was nervous about being competitive but so far it hasn't effected my career at all.

How many F/O's have you known that actually busted out of Captain school? I can probably think of 5 in the past 10 years. When they hire an F/O they are hiring Captain qualified individuals who will most likely make great Captains. I'm not saying that PIC isn't important because it is, but "most" airlines factor in your previous experience. There is no question that the odds are in your favor if you have PIC time but it doesn't mean you won't get hired if you don't.

If you have an opportunity to fly bigger equipment or sit around on a 30 passenger airplane and wait for the PIC time then I would choose the bigger equipment. I have flown at 4 different majors with very little PIC time.

Good Luck!

I agree, I had very little PIC time and was able to get on with Tower Air back in the 90's as a 747 F/O. The experince was pricless and I was able to upgrade to Capt. before they went under. If you have the oppertunity to fly bigger equipment do it. However with the current state of our industry you are probally screwed no matter what you do. Good Luck

 

[FN FAL]

How about this one. The almighty PIC who ignored 3 "hold short" statements by me and was flustered when I took the brakes away from him to stop a runway incursion with a FAA POI (not ours) in the jumpseat. Yeah, they should just get rid of all the FO seats in the cockpit. Maybe then the EMB wouldn't be weight restricted all the time.

Why would they let that crappy SIC upgrade to PIC, that's what I want to know?

And If you were trained and evaluated by the same corporate culture that allowed that alleged turd become captain, who the hell are you?

 

[Andy]

Would any major be interested in a pilot with 3/4000 hrs of time in type with only F/O time? I am considering a job in Turkey with a 737 or A320 operator but the upgrades here are brutal (7-10 years). I find useless of working in there for 3/4 years with no shot at operators like Southwest, JetBlue, Sprit or whoever is hiring at the time if lack of 1000 PIC hrs will be an issue.

Thanks...

I got hired by UAL in early 2000 w/a lot of PIC. However, the bar was getting very low as far as PIC and total time prior to everyone stopping hiring. There were a lot of low time pilots in my class. What's a rule today (need lotsa PIC) could easily be a nicety tomorrow. It's all about supply & demand. Speaking of which, if mandatory retirement age jumps to 65 in the US, you can bet that hiring will slow significantly in the US for quite some time.
Do what makes you happy; life's short. If taking a job overseas is something that you want to do, go for it. If you're flying in Turkey, you'll have other challenges that could be valuable in an interview.
I assume that you're a low time pilot. If that's the case, getting 737/A320 experience will be very valuable in an interview. Besides, if you timed it right, you may be able to do a short stint with a second tier airline that has rapid turnover to get your PIC. Ever consider Atlas? I don't know what kind of requirements they have today, but back in 2000, all that was required was a pulse and a tolerance for being home only ~4 days a month. Upgrade time there was less than 2 yrs.
Good luck in your career.

 

[FlyingToIST]

I got hired by UAL in early 2000 w/a lot of PIC. However, the bar was getting very low as far as PIC and total time prior to everyone stopping hiring. There were a lot of low time pilots in my class. What's a rule today (need lotsa PIC) could easily be a nicety tomorrow.
Do what makes you happy; life's short. If taking a job overseas is something that you want to do, go for it. If you're flying in Turkey, you'll have other challenges that could be valuable in an interview.

The flying is a bit different than US but it has challanges that can make the experience a valuable one. Lack of English skills it 's something that was admited by the chief pilots of the airline. He basically said a person with two foreign languages can add to the airline.

I assume that you're a low time pilot. If that's the case, getting 737/A320 experience will be very valuable in an interview. Besides, if you timed it right, you may be able to do a short stint with a second tier airline that has rapid turnover to get your PIC.
Good luck in your career.

You are correct in your assumption. I am just shy of 1200 hrs. But close enough to a 135 job that I could consider that.. On the other hand, having dual citizenship opens the door for a company paid 737 or 320 type that I can bring to a US airline that will be hiring in 3-4 years time.

We'll see , it's a tough decision to make.. At least I have a supporting wife.. for now.

 

[pilotyip]

Did not intent any overlook in my orgininal post, but Turbo prop PIC is good time, maybe not as good as TJ PIC and some airlines only have requirement of 1000 hr Turbine PIC. If you flew heavy turbo props like P-3's, L-188's, C-130's I believe they look at the turbo prop time the same as TJ PIC.

 

[CapnVegetto]

Everyone is right.....it just depends on how bad they need people and who's available. Hell, in the early and mid 90's, Delta, United, all of 'em were hiring guys off the street with nothing but Kingair time. I personally know a guy that got on like that, with no internal recs or anything. Right now, though, there's a million furloughed guys with 5 types and 3000 PIC in a 737 looking for a job, so things are different. In a few years, it may go back. It's basically just a crap shoot.

 

[AA717driver]

It's all supply and demand. You've got a bunch of RJ captains out there so eventually, some company will say 1000 hours turbine PIC OVER 50k lbs.

It's just one more thing to weed out people. It says nothing about the quality of those being weeded. TC

 

[pilotyip]

They were even hiring pilots without college degrees back in the late 90's.

 

[Caveman]

In this day and age 1000 turbine PIC is the magic number. There are jobs that don't require it to apply but almost any decent job will require that and more to be competative. I was one of those that upgraded at the very first opportunity because I felt it was important to get that PIC block checked. I had no intention of leaving the company I work for but I wanted the PIC time 'just in case'. Well, guess what? 'Just in case' just showed up. Man, am I glad I made that decision. It cost me though. I've spent the last 2 1/2 years as an extremely junior captain on reserve at an airline that is notorious for being very reserve unfriendly. Almost everybody anywhere near my seniority elected to keep their QOL and wait for upgrade. Can't say as I blame them, but now they are f*cked because they don't have any PIC time. I've been blessed with a couple of decent opportunities in the near future because I was willing to suck it up and get the PIC time. I'm not bragging though. If I've learned nothing else in my short 5 years in this business it's that good timing and dumb luck count more than planning. I would recommend that anybody that has the opportunity to get PIC time take it if at all possible given your current circumstances.