- Aug 18, 2004
- Total Time
Can my students log PIC during the dual flight involving a complex or high-performance endorsement?
Actually, Mark, that's 61.51(e)(1)(i).....
....and to amplify to Kream, since I have lived most of my adult life misreading this regulation: This regulation does not say, "To act as PIC...", it says "to log PIC"...
I just simply ASSUMED we talking about the PIC, the person ACTING as the PIC, and here is the rule that governs the LOGGING by that PIC....but that ain't the way it is written. It simply says a sport,recreational, private, or commercial pilot may log...when he is manipulating the controls, and the word rated in this reg has been determined to mean the ASEL(or whatever) that is typed on your certificate.
Now, I have only been converted to this new way accepting this regulation for a year or two (since I came on these message boards), and I still think it is an oversight by the regulation writers - that the INTENT of the rule was that the logging also meant acting.
Look at 61.51(2) An airline transport pilot may log PIC all the time he is ACTING as PIC of an operation requiring requiring an ATP.
That is meant to cover the Captain acting PIC on an airliner even when he's in the bathroom, but Look! he can't log PIC any other time! He is not covered in 61.51(e)(1)(i)
If you stick to the letter of this regulation (instead of the spirit - which would mean you are ACTING PIC to LOG PIC), A guy with an ATP cannot log any time except when he is PIC on a flight requiring an ATP....
even when he is solo.
Kream926 said:ok wait im confused. there was a debate about this at my school "to log or not to log" that is the question.
here's a scenario:
im a SEL private pilot flying an RG. no complex endorsment flying with my instructor. time goes in SEL box, dual recieved box, but does it go in the PIC box? cause mine didnt until i got the endorsment.
dang these regs
Dude, the regs. say that in order to ACT AS PIC of a HP aircraft you need to receive and log ground and flight training from an instructor. It's part of the whole package. In order to be granted the ability to ACT AS PIC, you must have met these requirements. Short of this, you can STILL log PIC as sole manipulator.Kream926 said:so whats all the BS about having recieved flight and ground training to log pic all about??????????????????????????
No one, other than the many, many pilots and instructors who don't really understand these rules that well make a connection with the training and =logging=.Kream926 said:so whats all the BS about having received flight and ground training to log pic all about??????????????????????????
If it's that important, remember it's your logbook and you are free to correct incorrect entries. I did after my endorsement when I learned how the rule works. Made the correction, initialed it, revised the totals and wrote a short explanatory not on the page where the revised totals appeared.Kream926 said:dang I got robbed outta 2 PIC hours........ o well
midlifeflyer said:If it's that important, remember it's your logbook and you are free to correct incorrect entries. I did after my endorsement when I learned how the rule works. Made the correction, initialed it, revised the totals and wrote a short explanatory not on the page where the revised totals appeared.
I did log the hours, but the examiner said I wasn't supposed to log PIC since I wasn't endorsed for flying complex airplanes; but that didn't make much sense to me. That's why I'm asking.PropsR4Boats said:Let em log it. Did you? I have never heard the FAA getting a hard on for someone logging a couple of hours when they don't have your name in a logbook.