Logging Piaggio Time

[BeenThereDoneIt]

What is the correct way to log Piaggio time as an SIC? As SIC time or as PIC time?

 

[brokeflyer]

What is the correct way to log Piaggio time as an SIC? As SIC time or as PIC time?

you answered it within your own question chuck.

if you're an SIC then you log as SIC......only if you are a required crewmember for the flight, e.g. far 135 and 2 pilots needed.

 

[guido411]

Broke is right but I'll add:

You COULD legally log PIC even in the right seat if you're qualified to act as PIC (multi-comm, current and typed if req) and are the sole manipulator of the controls. That's even if the company designates you at the SIC but you would have a hard time explaining that as quality PIC time to a potential employer looking to hire a Captain.

If you're in the right seat and the regs don't require an SIC it's pretty much safety pilot time IMHO.

 

[BoilerUP]

You COULD legally log PIC even in the right seat if you're qualified to act as PIC (multi-comm, current and typed if req) and are the sole manipulator of the controls. That's even if the company designates you at the SIC but you would have a hard time explaining that as quality PIC time to a potential employer looking to hire a Captain.

Part 91 I'd say sure, that's legal but not a very wise career decision...but can one really log it that way legally when in the employ of an air carrier as an SIC?

 

[Flex-ible]

Part 91 I'd say sure, that's legal but not a very wise career decision...but can one really log it that way legally when in the employ of an air carrier as an SIC?

YES. The FAA has issued letters of clarification to several (mostly bottom tier) carriers authorizing this. HOWEVER, when applying for your top tier job, I would certainly point out quickly that my multi PIC time includes X hours as sole manipulator on flights where I was otherwise the SIC.

 

[guido411]

Part 91 I'd say sure, that's legal but not a very wise career decision...but can one really log it that way legally when in the employ of an air carrier as an SIC?

61.51 rule for LOGGING flight time still applies even if flying under 135 or 121. Career decision, I don't think it's unwise to log time you flew an airplane, would just have to be up front with potential employer.

What I'm a little unsure of: Say you're operating the Piaggio (or other single pilot airplane) under Part 135 and have autohorization to use an autopilot in lieu of SIC. The operator decides to throw a warm (but rated) body in the right seat to appease the pax. What can that pilot log if he isn't PF?

 

[brokeflyer]

What I'm a little unsure of: Say you're operating the Piaggio (or other single pilot airplane) under Part 135 and have autohorization to use an autopilot in lieu of SIC. The operator decides to throw a warm (but rated) body in the right seat to appease the pax. What can that pilot log if he isn't PF?

he can't log anything unless he is checked IAW part 135. If he didnt take at least a 135 SIC check then he is just a passenger. The only time the warm body would be able to log is sole manipulator on a empty leg.

 

[rettofly]

YES. The FAA has issued letters of clarification to several (mostly bottom tier) carriers authorizing this. HOWEVER, when applying for your top tier job, I would certainly point out quickly that my multi PIC time includes X hours as sole manipulator on flights where I was otherwise the SIC.

When I was employed as an SIC, I used to log the time as SIC time, but I had a separate column where I kept track of "sole manipulator" time per FAR 61 to help in breaking it out on the resume.

When paired with another PIC, I would log SIC if the other guy was the designated PIC.

 

[guido411]

he can't log anything unless he is checked IAW part 135. If he didnt take at least a 135 SIC check then he is just a passenger. The only time the warm body would be able to log is sole manipulator on a empty leg.

Kinda what I thought. . .might as well stay home and drink beer if that's the case!:beer:

 

[transpac]

I've always wondered why civilian "sole manipulator" logged as PIC was looked at as dishonest and worthless while military "first pilot" time was considered PIC time and was wonderful. Neither person was necessarily the real PIC.