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logging multi PIC

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Weasil,

You are correct on both counts. The examiner and FSDO were not. (which is largely irrelevant, as it was accepted anyway).

The FAA altered the regulation several years ago to enable a student in a multi engine airplane to fulfill the requirement either in solo flight, or by "...performing the duties of pilot in command in a multiengine airplane...". This was a concession to allow a student to meet the regulation while acting within the constraints of insurance requirements and those of various operators or schools.

The FAA never altered the requirements for logging pilot in command time.

A very important distinction is that acting as pilot in command, and logging pilot in command, are not the same thing.

In this case, the student is performing the duties of pilot in command, but is NOT acting as pilot in command. Acting as pilot in command requires being rated in the aircraft (cateogry and class, and type if appropriate); the student is not rated in the airplane, and cannot act as pilot in command. Instead, the student may perform the duties of PIC, but may not hold the responsibility.

Under 61.51(e), logging of pilot in command, no provision exists for the logging of this flight time as pilot in command time. A student must log it as instruction received, with the notation that the flight time has been performed in accordance with 61.129(b)(4), and that the student has performed the duties of pilot in command.

The student cannot act as pilot in command, nor can the student log the flight time as such.
 
While we all know that acting as pilot in command, and logging pilot in command, are not the same thing. I would suggest that even if the intent was to allow a student working on his multi-engine to perform the duties of PIC while NOT acting PIC, 61.51 would still allow you to log those 10 hours under 61.129 PIC requirements as you would still fall under sole manipulator of the controls provision, and since 61.129 allows supervised solo's, I would infer you could log it as SOLO, and PIC, since the instructor is not their for the purpose of instruction. Am I reading to much into this?

Ryan
 
Sierra Pilot,
I had this conversation with Rich Batchelder and the Oakland FSDO once years ago. Does rich still do checkrides at Sierra?

He said that you could count those 10 hours towards the 15 PIC for the MEI. In fact he did so on several occasions and issued MEI certificates.
So did the Oakland FSDO. Everything I've read since then indicates this is incorrect. You can count those hours as PIC to meet the requirements of 61.129 but that's as far as it goes.

They are not solo hours (because someone else is onboard). Read what avbug wrote, he is correct.
 
Yeah rich still does checkrides for Sierra.. although I havent flown with him yet.. I've used RJ for my checkrides although I am planning on going with Rich for the Comm-multi checkride.

Ryan
 

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