Let the rumours FLY ....

[CRJFlyer]

I know a guy who just got furloughed that cleared over $100k in 2009 as a 3rd year NJA FO.

I was at 2 years 3 months...If I didn't bring home $5200 take home per month I was dissapointed... That was with out OT, contributing 19%, and working approx. 3 six day trips......Typically the only time I made less was during recurrent or sim.

I could definitely see a guy already in his 3rd year working alot bringing home over 6 figures. It may take some after midnights or luckily scheduling but definitely doable. Could also be on a larger fleet.

I'm just dumbfounded anyone would support the idea that it's ok to accept low wages because they feel their peers will just upgrade in 4 years!! That's great Mesa thinking there.

 

[BeenThereDoneIt]

MESA thinking....LOLOL. By the way.....Avantair's version of "after midnight pay" is "after 4 00 AM pay."

 

[Grizz]

At six years at Avantair you are a Captain. 6 years at NetJets you are an FO.

Incorrect. The most junior Captain at NetJets has been here 4 years and 4 months.

 

[jonjuan]

Incorrect. The most junior Captain at NetJets has been here 4 years and 4 months.

This difference will only change and dramatically. NJA is LUCKY they didn't downgrade as they could have, otherwise the numbers would change once again.

 

[Grizz]

Really jonjuan? Since you profess to be an expert on our CBA, please enlighten me as to how they could have downgraded. I'll be here waiting...

 

[Jack Campbell]

Good to hear some of us were making OT money there. I chose the 7/7 due to family needs and the IBB contract was a great raise. But for me, 2009 saw almost no overtime and only one after midnight. OT increased later in the year and it seemed like the guys who were not furloughed were going to do very well with OT in 2010.

 

[glasspilot]

Good to hear some of us were making OT money there. I chose the 7/7 due to family needs and the IBB contract was a great raise. But for me, 2009 saw almost no overtime and only one after midnight. OT increased later in the year and it seemed like the guys who were not furloughed were going to do very well with OT in 2010.

Really!?? You just said that out loud on a public forum?

 

[fischman]

Really jonjuan? Since you profess to be an expert on our CBA, please enlighten me as to how they could have downgraded. I'll be here waiting...

Me too. I love how arrogant blowholes spew out misinformation like they are experts.

All we need is General Lee and B19, then we'll have a trifecta of know-it-all's. :nuts:

 

[RJ Bum]

Good to hear some of us were making OT money there. I chose the 7/7 due to family needs and the IBB contract was a great raise. But for me, 2009 saw almost no overtime and only one after midnight. OT increased later in the year and it seemed like the guys who were not furloughed were going to do very well with OT in 2010.

Well I want to thank you and everyone else working OT for your support knowing that you are doing everything possible to cover the trips with min. crews while I'm on the street.

 

[RP170]

Well I want to thank you and everyone else working OT for your support knowing that you are doing everything possible to cover the trips with min. crews while I'm on the street.

Be nice if the "F" word was used every time guys were going to go over 12 hours of duty wouldn't it?

Check out the letter IPA wrote to the UPS pilots in the Cargo section of the boards here. That's how it should be done.

NJASAP won't risk the chance of the company claiming that they are proposing an "illegal job action" by telling people not to pick up OT, extended days, etc. Have unions really been stripped of all their power in this country?

 

[Pervis]

Well I want to thank you and everyone else working OT for your support knowing that you are doing everything possible to cover the trips with min. crews while I'm on the street.

If you are truely a furloughed NJA pilot, I wish you quick recall. As such, you would know there is no choice or "volunteering" when OT is assigned. The only way to NOT do OT is to fatigue or DNIF. If I or my crewmate is tired, WE fatigue. If I'm sick, I DNIF. If not, I will not jeapordize my position and family livelyhood engaging in unethical behavior in a foolish attempt to force recalls. If that's selfish in the minds of some, so be it.

There is little a line pilot can do under the current CBA. If company were to request volunteers for extending, then I would have issue and hope our union would agree that was unacceptable and lobby for recalls. As it is, there are protections in place limiting selloffs, and until company approaches that limit, and crews find themselves overextended and fatigue more, and after midnights drive costs above the cost of increasing the current workforce, and sales increase, and........., there will unfortunately be no recalls.

Please don't play into management's hand and grow resentful to your collegues because we who are still employed had ZERO to do with the furlough. In fact, I've never seen a group step up in an effort to prevent the inevitable like they did. All we can do is our best to keep and attract new customers. That will help get you back faster than any other "action".

 

[RJ Bum]

Have unions really been stripped of all their power in this country?

In a word…yes.

If you are truely a furloughed NJA pilot, I wish you quick recall. As such, you would know there is no choice or "volunteering" when OT is assigned. The only way to NOT do OT is to fatigue or DNIF. If I or my crewmate is tired, WE fatigue. If I'm sick, I DNIF. If not, I will not jeapordize my position and family livelyhood engaging in unethical behavior in a foolish attempt to force recalls. If that's selfish in the minds of some, so be it.

There is little a line pilot can do under the current CBA. If company were to request volunteers for extending, then I would have issue and hope our union would agree that was unacceptable and lobby for recalls. As it is, there are protections in place limiting selloffs, and until company approaches that limit, and crews find themselves overextended and fatigue more, and after midnights drive costs above the cost of increasing the current workforce, and sales increase, and........., there will unfortunately be no recalls.

Please don't play into management's hand and grow resentful to your collegues because we who are still employed had ZERO to do with the furlough. In fact, I've never seen a group step up in an effort to prevent the inevitable like they did. All we can do is our best to keep and attract new customers. That will help get you back faster than any other "action".

Unfortunately I am one of the 495, feel free to pm me if you wish to have this conversation further and I will give you my info on njpilots.org as I don’t want to go too far in depth on a public forum. And thank you for your wishes.

I completely agree with you that with our working conditions and CBA that there are very few “options” as far as refusing a trip. I am in no way suggesting any kind of unethical behavior to jeopardize the long term future of NJA. I want to be called back soon but to a HEALTHIER company. To my surprise, after working for NJA it turned into my “dream job” and I want it to stay that way when I return.

Now having said that when I hear guys are doing “well” with OT and extended days, it does bring my blood to a boil. In my opinion, guys should not be working any “harder” than they were before the furlough. Getting the job done should not include flying over 12, working through vacation time and readily “accepting” trips knowingly they will not come close to coming home without and extended day. Make no mistake; the company will use this time to “adjust” the minimum crews needed if guys are consistently going above and beyond what was known as the norm before. (Of course not below the 5.5 min per a/c required in the CBA, but you get my drift)

Don’t get me wrong, I am by no means getting resentful towards my colleagues as I am eternally grateful to those that sacrificed during the preventive measures program. Circumstances of the economy and past management practices have made this inevitable and I’m not blind to that. But also let’s not forget that the hard work and dedication of the guys that are on the street is part of the reason you enjoy the “job security” you have today. (if there is such a thing)

 

[gutshotdraw]

RJ,

I can't speak for others, but until the 495 are recalled I will politely refuse Crew Resources requests to go out early or stay out late on planned extended tours (as many crews are this week due to the holiday weekend and Olympics). That is my choice to make but I won't denigrate crewmembers that choose to work extended days. In fact, there will be times when scheduling asks me to stay out an extra day in order to complete a trip that would otherwise incur a large airline expense and it will be my obligation to the financial health of the company to do so. Each person must make their own decision on both scores. As for hourly overtime beyond 12, we still don't receive it so it is a moot point for NJI.

Bottom line: Planned OT? Not for me. Unplanned OT? Gonna happen and I don't have a problem with it.

 

[Helmsalee]

Also, a 2004 (6 year) hire at NJ is a captain unless he choose to pass it up. Admittedly, the CA/FO ratio at NJ is skewed toward the CA side now.

This was posted before I realized that there was another page in the thread. Doesn't change the fact though.

 

[Jack Campbell]

Well I want to thank you and everyone else working OT for your support knowing that you are doing everything possible to cover the trips with min. crews while I'm on the street.

No need to thank me. I was hired in 2007...
Wasn't talking about extended days, either. Just the company-issued daily overtime that no one has a choice about. Non-discretionary OT.

 

[RJ Bum]

No need to thank me. I was hired in 2007...
Wasn't talking about extended days, either. Just the company-issued daily overtime that no one has a choice about. Non-discretionary OT.

That's cool, I guess I took your post out of context. My bad

 

[RJ Bum]

RJ,

Bottom line: Planned OT? Not for me. Unplanned OT? Gonna happen and I don't have a problem with it.

Thanks gunshot

 

[BeenThereDoneIt]

RJ: Of course not below the 5.5 min per a/c required in the CBA, but you get my drift.

ME: Be thankful your company isn't eyeing a 3.8 pilot/aircraft ratio.

 

[RJ Bum]

RJ: Of course not below the 5.5 min per a/c required in the CBA, but you get my drift.

ME: Be thankful your company isn't eyeing a 3.8 pilot/aircraft ratio.

ah... what?

 

[gunfyter]

ah... what?

All the other fracs are staffed 3.8 to 4.0