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Legacy mid air

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hawkerjock

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 16, 2002
Posts
110
I heard this aircraft (Legacy) was being delivered to the USA for an american operator. Anyone know who it was being delivered for?

Brazilian jet missing after collision
Brazilian jet missing after collision
By MICHAEL ASTOR, Associated Press Writer 1 minute ago


A Brazilian jetliner with about 150 people aboard was reported missing Friday over the Amazon jungle after colliding with a smaller executive jet, aviation authorities said.
Wladamir Caze, spokesman for the Brazilian aviation authority, told The Associated Press that Gol airlines flight 1907 left the jungle city of Manaus and disappeared after a collision.
The Brazilian Aviation agency said the accident occurred in midair about 470 miles south of Manaus in the remote south western region of Para state.
News reports said the plane reportedly struck a Brazilian-made Legacy aircraft. The Legacy managed to land at the Caximbo base in southern Para, some 1,250 miles northwest of Rio, despite suffering damage.
Brazil's Defense Minister Waldir Pires told radio Bandnews there were "more than 150" people on the plane.
The jetliner had been scheduled to make a stop in Brasilia before heading to Rio's Antonio Tom Jobim International Airport. Manaus is a major river city in the heart of the Amazon rainforest some 1,700 miles northwest of Rio.
Brazilian airport authority President Jose Carlos Pereira said the air force was searching for the jet in a densely forested region. The Brazilian airforce said in a joint statement with the federal aviation and airport authorities that five planes had been sent to search for the missing aircraft. But it was not immediately clear whether searches had begun or would start at daylight.
Pereira said in an interview with CBN radio that a local farmer reported seeing a large plane flying low.
According to the Globo news agency, some 70 family members and friends of the victims had been moved to a warehouse owned by Gol at the Brasilia airport to await news.
The Embraer Legacy 600 is a Brazilian-made executive jet that carries up to 16 passengers.
The accident occurred in the same region where a Varig 737-200 crashed in 1989 with 54 people aboard with 46 survivors.
It was the first major incident for Gol Linhas Aereas Intelligentes SA, an upstart Brazilian airline that took to the skies in 2001 with just six Boeing 737s in 2001, serving seven Brazilian cities.
Gol has grown exponentially since then, dramatically boosting its fleet using the same model of plane to keep costs down while giving passengers cold box lunches and soft drinks instead of alcohol. The company is now Brazil's second largest airline after Tam Linhas Aereas SA, with more than 500 daily flights within Brazil, and to Argentina, Bolivia, Paraguay and Uruguay.
It rapidly gained market share by offering low-cost tickets, modeling its service after low-cost carriers in the United States and Europe. Gol, started by the heirs of a successful bus company, also benefited from the demise of Brazil's flagship airline Varig, which virtually disintegrated earlier this year under a mountain of debt.
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Last edited:
hawkerjock said:
I heard this aircraft (Legacy) was being delivered to the USA for an american operator. Anyone know who it was being delivered for?

Brazilian jet missing after collision
Brazilian jet missing after collision
By MICHAEL ASTOR, Associated Press Writer 1 minute ago


A Brazilian jetliner with about 150 people aboard was reported missing Friday over the Amazon jungle after colliding with a smaller executive jet, aviation authorities said.
Wladamir Caze, spokesman for the Brazilian aviation authority, told The Associated Press that Gol airlines flight 1907 left the jungle city of Manaus and disappeared after a collision.
The Brazilian Aviation agency said the accident occurred in midair about 470 miles south of Manaus in the remote south western region of Para state.
News reports said the plane reportedly struck a Brazilian-made Legacy aircraft. The Legacy managed to land at the Caximbo base in southern Para, some 1,250 miles northwest of Rio, despite suffering damage.
Brazil's Defense Minister Waldir Pires told radio Bandnews there were "more than 150" people on the plane.
The jetliner had been scheduled to make a stop in Brasilia before heading to Rio's Antonio Tom Jobim International Airport. Manaus is a major river city in the heart of the Amazon rainforest some 1,700 miles northwest of Rio.
Brazilian airport authority President Jose Carlos Pereira said the air force was searching for the jet in a densely forested region. The Brazilian airforce said in a joint statement with the federal aviation and airport authorities that five planes had been sent to search for the missing aircraft. But it was not immediately clear whether searches had begun or would start at daylight.
Pereira said in an interview with CBN radio that a local farmer reported seeing a large plane flying low.
According to the Globo news agency, some 70 family members and friends of the victims had been moved to a warehouse owned by Gol at the Brasilia airport to await news.
The Embraer Legacy 600 is a Brazilian-made executive jet that carries up to 16 passengers.
The accident occurred in the same region where a Varig 737-200 crashed in 1989 with 54 people aboard with 46 survivors.
It was the first major incident for Gol Linhas Aereas Intelligentes SA, an upstart Brazilian airline that took to the skies in 2001 with just six Boeing 737s in 2001, serving seven Brazilian cities.
Gol has grown exponentially since then, dramatically boosting its fleet using the same model of plane to keep costs down while giving passengers cold box lunches and soft drinks instead of alcohol. The company is now Brazil's second largest airline after Tam Linhas Aereas SA, with more than 500 daily flights within Brazil, and to Argentina, Bolivia, Paraguay and Uruguay.
It rapidly gained market share by offering low-cost tickets, modeling its service after low-cost carriers in the United States and Europe. Gol, started by the heirs of a successful bus company, also benefited from the demise of Brazil's flagship airline Varig, which virtually disintegrated earlier this year under a mountain of debt.
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Click to expand...


They said it was going to Excelaire based in KISP....NY
 
Recent reports say the crew had their passports confiscated and were being investigated for criminal negligence and manslaughter. Brazilian Air Force is suggesting that an initial investigation shows the transponder on the Legacy was either purposely shut off or failed. Hope those guys get out.
 
mid air

Apparently there is no radar coverage where the accident took place, and I believe the Legacy crew was given a clearence that required them to descend from FL370 to FL360 before the accident. I do not believe they were in a descent to FL360 or were maintaining that altitude . I am flying with a Ecuadorian pilot who is getting the information from the region and giving it to me in interpretation.
 
You to have wonder if the TCAS was turned on, working, and offered a resolution advisory??? Let's see what the CVRs say.
 
The entire Brasilian territory is radar coverage and VHF com.
Long time ago as 10 or more years ago were not. But that is past today is tottaly covered.
and better radars than US. As the radars there are new models and all computorized no round green scopes. They are computer terminals with keyboard. The airplanes don't flash, neither has any scan bar like you see on your WX radar.
The center Brasilia called the legacy crew for 3 times than was shift change for the controllers the new controler said the legacy was w/o the mode C on transponder and he tried to call them to confirm altitude witn no answer and asked him to keep trying. The new controller tried twice till he saw the image of the 737 freezes in his screen they never told anything to the 737 crew as per flight plan filled personally (in Brasil you cannot file a flight plan by phone)
they stated that after Brasilia due the Airway become 2 way they would change to FL360. From Sao Jose dos Campos to Brasilia the Airway was one way so they could pretty much get any FL but after that they should have changed and they didn't.
 
bombinha--Thank you for the explanation. Most of us haven't flown down there. TC
 
Pols push for pilots

Three congressmen seek diplomats' help in release of LI men whose passports were seized by Brazilians

BY BILL BLEYER AND ZACHARY R. DOWDY
STAFF WRITERS; Sylvia Adcock contributed to this story, which was supplemented with a report from The Associated Press.

October 6, 2006


Three area congressmen reached out to diplomats yesterday seeking the release of two Long Island pilots whose passports were confiscated by Brazilian officials after their jet was involved in a midair collision over the Amazon jungle.

And the Ronkonkoma firm that employs the pilots urged against a rush to judgment by officials in Brazil, where emotions are running high over the crash that killed 155.

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"I urge you to do all that you can to see that these Americans are allowed to return home immediately," Rep. Peter King (R-Seaford) wrote Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice after being contacted by ExcelAire of Long Island MacArthur Airport. King said he was concerned for the safety of Joseph Lepore, 42, of Bay Shore and Jan Paladino, 34, of Westhampton Beach.

Rep. Steve Israel (D-Huntington) contacted the U.S. consul general in Brazil about the matter, too. "We just wanted to make sure they were paying attention to it and that things were being handled appropriately," said Jack Pratt, Israel's chief of staff.

A spokesman said Rep. Gary Ackerman (D-Jamaica Estates) contacted the Brazilian ambassador to the United States to push for the pilots' release.

"The investigation is in its earliest stages," ExcelAire said in a statement. The firm said it was looking forward to establishing the falsity "of the rumors and speculation asserted against its pilots."

ExcelAire has retained Burson-Marsteller, an international public relations firm that specializes in crisis management, to make its case in Brazil.

"I'm sure it's a very feverish climate in Brazil, but I am trying to make sure these two men are treated properly," King said in an interview.

Rice is in the Middle East and there was no immediate response to the letter. The State Department said if the pilots were allowed to leave and were later charged, there is an extradition treaty between the two countries. Spokesman Tom Casey said confiscating passports is standard procedure in Brazil.

Following the crash last Friday, a judge ordered that the ExcelAire pilots turn over their passports while authorities investigate whether they flew at the wrong altitude, causing the collision with Gol Airlines Flight 1907.

Authorities are investigating why the Embraer Legacy executive jet was flying at 37,000 feet instead of its authorized altitude of 36,000 feet.

On Wednesday, some Brazilian authorities suggested the pilots may have turned off their anti-collision system, possibly so they could do maneuvers on the jet's maiden flight that they did not want air traffic controllers to know about.

Prosecutors said they could charge the pilots with involuntary manslaughter if they turned off the system. Lepore and Paladino told investigators they never turned off the device - which not only transmits a plane's location but also alerts the pilots if another plane is approaching - and believed it was working, according to the Mato Grosso do Sul Public Safety Department.

Paladino was an American Airlines pilot furloughed after Sept. 11, but remains on the active pilots list and could be recalled.

Capt. Sam Mayer, chairman of The Allied Pilots Association, which represents American's pilots, said some members are refusing flights to Brazil because of the statements made by officials there.

The union dispatched pilots to help Paladino's wife and put her in touch with its attorney.

Sylvia Adcock contributed to this story, which was supplemented with a report from The Associated Press.
 
bombinha,

just to paraphrase.......... you are saying the 737 was on the airway at 37k and they were suppose to decend to fl360 after Brasilia as noted on the airway and they did not ? thanks for the info by the way...... i along with many others are very concerned with the developments because there but the grace of god go I .............. etc.
 
TCAS Reality Check

starcheck208 said:
It's difficult to think something like this would happen with two newer airplanes that both should have tcas
Click to expand...


Starcheck, there is a certain complacency that sets in when you know you have TCAS looking over your shoulder for you. That equipment can fail too, and nothing is as notorious as equipment failures on a factory delivery flight.

I still have to credit my old mentor (god rest his soul) who said, "There's no substitute for the Mark I eyeball."
 
peter185 said:
Anyone else wondering where LegacyDriver is? Or does he not post here anymore.
Click to expand...


I'm over on the "other" forum. We've been discussing this in detail there.


I urge everyone to hammer Bill O'Reilly ([email protected]) and some other prominent media watchdog types about this situation. We need to up the pressure to get our pilots home.

Cheers.
 
If this is the thanks Brazil has for us buying their Crap, then I will never buy a Jungle jet!
 
Tell me this isn't a witch hunt!

As reported today in Newsday (NY):



a Brazilian newspaper reported that the air traffic controller who was monitoring the Embraer Legacy executive jet flown by Joseph Lepore of Bay Shore and Jan Paladino of Westhampton Beach was new in his position and was considered unqualified by his instructor.

Brazilian newspaper O Folha de San Paulo reported that the controller monitoring the Legacy on Sept. 29 was rushed into the position at the insistence of military officials, who run the control system, over the objection of his instructor. Other controllers told the paper that the controller had little hands-on experience after receiving his certification earlier this year because of a lack of controllers.

These men need to come home...NOW!
 
This may be the politically correct way for the Brazillians to let the Legacy crew go. Start with stories like this, it's not the controller's fault--he was rushed into the position.

The military won't take a hit, his instructor won't take a hit and the Legacy crew wasn't at fault.

Let's hope this runs its course and they get back home soon.TC
 
Joe and Jan have GOT to get out of that hole.
I wouldn't even classify Brazil as a 'Third World' country. Way further down the list.
 
ATR-DRIVR said:
Joe and Jan have GOT to get out of that hole.
I wouldn't even classify Brazil as a 'Third World' country. Way further down the list.
Click to expand...

Ehem...I disagree on your "less than 3rd world statement", that titles belongs solely to the city of Miami. :erm:
 

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