kissing a... derriers

[hammer2]

I 've talked to a lot of frac guys in the past year at various FBOs from NetJets, CShares, Flex, and Avantair and most were exceptionally nice guys, even if a couple of the NJ guys were a bit 'vocal' back during the labor issues there. A few, after suffering my newbie questions, even went so far as to invite me out to look in their aircraft, where I've gotten a grand tour of ... Falcon 2000, C750, C560XL, C550, G200, and Lear 31 and 45. Very, very nice guys ... every single one. And in talking to them I found that these folks came from airlines - retired and furloughed - from piston cargo, small corporate, charter, and just about every other career track there is. I dont think their background had anything at all to do with the 'tool factor'. Of course, my experience might not translate to the cockpit, but I thought it was a valid observation.

Oh ... had only one 'bad/odd' experience with a Frac crew ... I'll get flamed but this is too good to not relate it here. As a disclaimer, I realize this kid could have been flying for any fractional and it was only incidental that it was Flex Jet:

I flew in a Baron to HTO on Long Island recently, and as I was unloading our pax and their bags a Flex Lear (45?) came in with an older, short, bald Captain and a very young-looking FO. As the guy I flew up with and I were admiring the aircraft, the crew disembarks and it looked like the Captain was trying to get away from the FO. The FO comes out and I swear ... he looks over at us and you could literally see his chest swell up as he gave us the biggest "I'm on a Lear and you're on a Baron" look I've ever seen. It was so blatantly obvious that the guy I was flying with, furloughed Aloha and one of the absolute nicest guys I've ever met, says "Oh ... he's one of those." and rolled his eyes. The FO kept going back in the aircraft and fiddling with something inside and then running out to where the Captain was trying to make his way to the FBO (Myers). This happened three times and finally the FO comes out and resumes his chest-swell while tossing a water bottle up in the air and swaggering to the FBO. He's literally staring at us and grinning (weird) and he drops the water bottle mid-swagger and kicked it while trying to pick it up (Mr. Smooth ) and when we laughed and looked over at the Captiain who's finally near the FBO door, and the poor fellow is shaking his head back and forth in an "Oh God ... why me" manner before turning and going inside. Kinda' funny. Maybe a bit sad, too. I guess every company has "one of those", and where he came from is probably irrelevant.

Like you said he was a kid. Give him a break. I fly the 45 and I love it too. I see your a missionary, if thats what you do for a living then just chuckle and move on.
As for Delta pilots. My problem with them is this. Its a military flying club. I'm not saying that military pilots can't fly, they can. I can't stand their arrogance. I remember a Delta ca explaining how being trained to pull 7 Gs in IMC conditions was able to make him a better pilot than a civilian. He went to school at the USAFA so that would explain a lot.

 

[Snakum]

LOL. I did chuckle and move on ... but I certainly ain't no missionary. Unless flying for the Holy Marmott named 'Steve' is considered Missionary Work. OK ... then ... maybe.

Praise Steve!

 

[Archie Bunker]

As for Delta pilots. My problem with them is this. Its a military flying club.

Absolutely not true anymore, especially for the 2000s. Delta hired a preponderance of military pilots back in the 80s because of their qualifications/training. Just look at the difference in the training received and the equipment flown by civilian pilots now, compared to 20 years ago. Civilian pilots now are commanding 70 seat RJs with glass cockpits, and bringing PIC Jet time to the table when they apply to the majors. Huge difference from 20 years ago. Bottom line is that civilian pilots are much more competitive now than they were in the past, and it is showing in the new-hire classes. In my new hire class at Delta in 2000, the class consisted of 50% civilian pilots with no military experience. Most of these guys were very experienced ASA RJ Captains.

I'm not saying that military pilots can't fly, they can. I can't stand their arrogance. I remember a Delta ca explaining how being trained to pull 7 Gs in IMC conditions was able to make him a better pilot than a civilian. He went to school at the USAFA so that would explain a lot.

I don't know who these guys are that you're flying with, but I never ran into any of them in 6 years at Delta. In fact, I couldn't tell the difference between a former military pilot and a civilian pilot unless I asked about their background. I certainly never heard any stories about pulling 7 Gs, and how that would make them a better pilot. At the Delta I knew, these kinds of pilots would be laughed out of the cockpit.

 

[squonk]

If it wasn't for ex-airline/retired airline bubba's coming over to Nutjets, we probably wouldn't have the contract we have now. Half my class was former AL, and they are very welcome here.

 

[TurboJetCpt]

Archie, made the callouts and expressed my concern, and stopped short of taking control as I knew we would be able to stop. My point is; is that a stabilized approach, is that a preferrable way to arrive at the runway? The Delta furlough I was flying with was the chief pilot btw. I guess the real point I'm making is that corporate/fractional flying has different demands on your skills than most 121 flying, and not all Delta line pilots are cut out for it.

and not all CJ pilots are cut out, OR welcome, in a Delta cockpit.

You are one funny boy...

 

[TurboJetCpt]

I can't stand their arrogance. I remember a Delta ca explaining how being trained to pull 7 Gs in IMC conditions was able to make him a better pilot than a civilian. He went to school at the USAFA so that would explain a lot.

Hey Ace. Next time, overlook his/her "quirk" and maybe just say, "thanks for your service."

Maybe he/she is the very reason you have any freedoms at all.

PS: I have NEVER flown with a military pilot that even comes close to your description; I believe you are making it up. But then again, I can believe whatever I want because of the freedoms we all enjoy.

 

[§kyye Candy]

fluffed appch

Whatever makes you feel better about yourself.

Do they sometimes turn it around and ask you if you know what a stabilized approach is?

I used to be an "FBO chick"... I can say from experience that they don't seem to listen to the radio after they call "in range" - too busy flaring... or maybe fluffing pillows if they have auto-land... (?)

 

[hammer2]

......