King air 90 vs 200

[banned username 2]

Avoid the King Air 100 and A100 like the plague... Basically a King Air 200 body on a short wing with little engines (680 SHP)... can you say "DOG"!?!?!?!

 

[DAS at 10/250]

Or you could fly the other step-child King Air with 715/side. We get 250 ktas on 250 gal/side at 210.

 

[JimG]

Ok...so let me ask a dumb question as a new 340 driver.

First off....I've always loved and admired the King Airs and Beech products in general. After all, I flew a Bonanza for 18 years, and grew up in another all through my childhood.

But for all but the 300/350's, the twin Cessnas 340, 414, 421 (with RAMs) will provide the same speeds, fly at the same altitudes, maybe not have the same payloads/range, but do all of the rest at a fraction of the cost, and most usually doesn't require hired guns to fly them to get insured.

I'm still learning (70 hours TT in the 340) and tweaking with performance, but I'm getting 1500+fpm (depending on weight) climb, cruise in the low 20's and getting 215-220 knots, all on 40 gal./hr block (approx).

As a guy who won't own an airplane he can't fly by himself, has a small family, and never fills the seats...is this as good as it gets w/o spending lots more money for not much more, performance wise?

 

[Flyingdutchman]

BE-200

max service ceiling: FL350
280 KTS.


I always file between 220 en 290

 

[dhc8fo]

getting 215-220 knots, all on 40 gal./hr block (approx).

Just curious...anything special about your 340 that gives you speeds like that? I have a '79 and can't get more than about 170 kts and at any level (and all on 40 GPH)! That is one hell of a difference. Please let me know!

 

[JimG]

Just curious...anything special about your 340 that gives you speeds like that? I have a '79 and can't get more than about 170 kts and at any level (and all on 40 GPH)! That is one hell of a difference. Please let me know!

You're kidding?

Mine is a '78 with brand new RAM VI's and I honestly get that 215-220kts at FL200+ (35" MP) according to my G430.

I've wondered if mine is on the fast side (every plane is unique), but that's a huge difference.

I haven't flown it often at a slow speed, but there were flights last winter after the engines were broken in, where I throttled back to save fuel as I was just building time for insurance purposes, but if memory serves me right, I was pulled back to 24"/2200rpm and getting 170+ knots or so....down low (12,000).

 

[minitour]

Jim:
True or Ground?

-mini

 

[JimG]

..

Jim:
True or Ground?

-mini

True.

RAM claims 228 ktas, but that's a # their sales department came up with, I haven't seen that, regardless of weights. Everything else in their #'s are pretty accurate. I've followed their recommendations real close for obvious reasons.

 

[puddlejumper]

Or you could fly the other step-child King Air with 715/side. We get 250 ktas on 250 gal/side at 210.

Doh! That's not gonna work. Too many numbers. SHP, ktas, pounds, feet, who can keep up with them all?

 

[jergar999]

Avoid the King Air 100 and A100 like the plague... Basically a King Air 200 body on a short wing with little engines (680 SHP)... can you say "DOG"!?!?!?!

As a pilot who spends about 350 hours a year in an A100 I can second very strongly Falcon Capts comments. A B200 is more efficient anyway.

 

[dhc8fo]

You're kidding?

Mine is a '78 with brand new RAM VI's and I honestly get that 215-220kts at FL200+ (35" MP) according to my G430.

I've wondered if mine is on the fast side (every plane is unique), but that's a huge difference.

I haven't flown it often at a slow speed, but there were flights last winter after the engines were broken in, where I throttled back to save fuel as I was just building time for insurance purposes, but if memory serves me right, I was pulled back to 24"/2200rpm and getting 170+ knots or so....down low (12,000).

Man, that is nice. I file mine at 185 kts. I have never seen better and I cruise at 31.5" too (this gives about 18-19 per side an hour) ....
I don't think it has the RAM conversion though I will have to check on that (I know, sad that I am not too sure) although it does have the VGs (not too sure that that matters).

Didn't mean to hijack the thread, but I can't believe the difference!!

 

[JimG]

"...although it does have the VGs (not too sure that that matters)."

Don't mean to hijack a King Air thread with 340 talk either, but....

BTW...I typically cruise at 31.5", not the 35" I wrote the other night (it was late and I was tired and not thinking right I guess).

However, if I've got a stiff tailwind, I'll pull it back to 28" or less, depending on the wind and use whatever power settings that give me the best miles per gallon (digital fuel flows), rather than gallons per hour/speed.

The VG's and HP increase on the VI's increase payload #'s by 400 lbs., but they do cost you some speed. Not sure how much on the 340, but I know on my Bonanza, it was a good 5 knots at cruise.

It helped the handling qualities (v-tail waggle) and although they couldn't legally increase my payload #'s, she climbed out faster when at gross....but they cost me some speed.

One other thought...do you have the American Aviation intercoolers?

That's supposed to increase speed as well. AA claims something like 10+ ktas, but I'm not so sure. I have them, but I've never flown her without all the stuff to know for sure.

I file for 205 knots, and it works out about right, but I cruise at 215-220 ktas at altitude.

 

[cezzna]

Don't know much about 340's, but I've always been leary of these twins with hopped up high horsepower engines. What's the TBO on a RAM conversion? The more horsepower you squeeze out of a recip the more likely it is to fail or wear out quickly. Some of these twins have the equivalent of dragster motors, ticking mechanical time bombs. You lose an engine in a 340 and the pucker factor goes way up, will it climb on one? I've flown King Airs and there is great peace of mind having those rock solid Pratts humming out there, much more reliable. A turbine engine isn't being strained producing 800 hp. In the unlikely event that you bag one, the plane will always fly. You might not get more speed, but the safety and reliability is worth the price in my opinion. Anyway most 90's are owner flown. I flew the 90 and it's a perfect family station wagon, you might look into one.

 

[dhc8fo]

will it climb on one?

well, my flight safety instructor swears up and down that it will and i fly the sim as if it would, but in reality (with mine, anyway) I seriously doubt it. Especially since I am always flying it right at max TO weight. (BTW JimG, my VGs only give me a 300 pound weight increase and I am not too sure about the speed sacrifice, I will have to take a look at that one)

You might not get more speed, but the safety and reliability is worth the price in my opinion.

I completely agree.

you might look into one

Boy, I sure wish I could!! Unfortunately, money is always the limiting factor in this situation....especially with gas prices what they are becoming.

 

[JimG]

cezzna

Don't know much about 340's, but I've always been leary of these twins with hopped up high horsepower engines. What's the TBO on a RAM conversion? The more horsepower you squeeze out of a recip the more likely it is to fail or wear out quickly. Some of these twins have the equivalent of dragster motors, ticking mechanical time bombs. You lose an engine in a 340 and the pucker factor goes way up, will it climb on one? I've flown King Airs and there is great peace of mind having those rock solid Pratts humming out there, much more reliable. A turbine engine isn't being strained producing 800 hp. In the unlikely event that you bag one, the plane will always fly. You might not get more speed, but the safety and reliability is worth the price in my opinion. Anyway most 90's are owner flown. I flew the 90 and it's a perfect family station wagon, you might look into one.

A Ram conversion extends TBO from 1400 to 1600 hours. Not exactly making them "dragster motors" They rate the HP increase at 335, but I've read and been told it could be as much as +10 beyond that.

No question though that having a couple of P & W's out there would be nicer, but the 2 Continentals out there are alot nicer than the 1 I used to have.