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KAL non type rated 777 Captains

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BayBum37ft

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 3, 2004
Posts
81
Is it a risky proposition to get a 777 type rating if one is hired by KAL? I have 17 years on the 757, 12 years as a captain, and putting up 15-20 grand for a type rating seems very risky. I have read the horror stories of KAL training, does anyone have any recent factual stories, both good and bad? Right now I am flying a Lear and I need a change.
Thanks

BayBum
 
With your times and interest in Asia I would suggest Viva Macau. They are looking for Captains with your kind of times. I think they work 6 weeks on and 2 off The guys I have met are a great bunch. If interested PM me and I'll get you a contact email.

Cheers- Rum
 
What horror stories have you heard? I just started looking at KAL on the Guppy. I heard their training is great and they treat you extremely well. Can anyone else chime in on this? How do the schedules work out on the Guppy? It look's like roughly 10 on 10 off if you live in the US. Any other info on life at KAL would be greatly appreciated.
 
There is a long post on Pprune by a former DAL Captain/instructor pilot on virtually everything including the 777 who went to KAL and flunked training. It was written about a year ago, but almost everything he said is still valid. The guy was actually very straightforward in describing what happened and what.

It is just a different environment over there, and they have a chip on their shoulder to "prove" themselves and get westerners. As much as ALPA gets ripped on in the US, at least they offer us some protection. In the Far East, you're on your own, with no recourse, and the guy got royally screwed.

FCN
 
There is a long post on Pprune by a former DAL Captain/instructor pilot on virtually everything including the 777 who went to KAL and flunked training. It was written about a year ago, but almost everything he said is still valid. The guy was actually very straightforward in describing what happened and what.

It is just a different environment over there, and they have a chip on their shoulder to "prove" themselves and get westerners. As much as ALPA gets ripped on in the US, at least they offer us some protection. In the Far East, you're on your own, with no recourse, and the guy got royally screwed.

FCN


I've read his letter and talked to people at KAL about the training. The training issues are not about "proving" themselves or getting westerners per say. It's more about a disagreement between the KAL pilots and KAL management on staffing. The KAL pilots would rather see their own guys get upgraded then to have foreigners hired. The foreign pilots are caught in the middle. This issue appears to be worse on the B777 than other fleets.

That said, it has changed somewhat in the last year. The title Line Check Pilot has been changed to Line Instructor Pilot to reflect a bigger emphasis on training versus checking. Whether that's worked or not, I don't know.

Anyway, back to the DAL pilot. After reading his letter I'm fairly certain I would have failed him as well. He clearly didn't understand the effort and or attitude differences expected of a pilot at KAL versus DAL. That point is key. Foreign airlines do not spoon feed pilots to the extent that U.S. carriers do. If one wants to be a successful contract or foreign pilot then they need to make a serious effort to learn the procedures and culture of the airline they go to work for. They need to learn how to fit in and not question why things are done the way they are while in training. Cooperate and graduate.


Typhoonpilot
 
I have to agree with Typhoonpilot. I too have read that letter and what leapt out at me was the attitude; "That's not how we did it at Delta." There are lots of ways to do things in aviation and no one has a monopoly on the correct way. Unfortunately, many (not all) pilots from the U.S. seem to have a hard time with this concept.
 
Typhoonpilot ...

I'm sure you're right. I've changed carriers several times ... there's more than one way to skin a cat, but the cat still gets skinned!

TransMach
 
Below is a response I gave to another post on KAL interview that was subsequently removed from the 'Majors' forum:



"I have a number of former colleagues over there on the 744 (one as an FO).

The sim and situational questions is the order of the day. Technically if you have flown intl widebody its nothing too tricky.

My FO buddy was struggling however...long hours of no social interaction whatsoever from the other cockpit crew.

During recruitment and training they were all very courteous and professional which he thought would bode well for the line ops...not so. Outside of SOPs a lot of korean chatting amongst the other crew with little or no attempt at establishing rapport with him.

That said he is over it and flys SOP's, gets paid good money and goes home. He parties on the rd on his own unless with expat skippers and is starting to get used to it without the early sensitivities.

To be fair to the Koreans ...how would you like to be an eight year FO and have a DEC come in and take a seat that could have been yours..hence the negativity towards expats which trickle down to the expat FO's.

On the Capts side..its easier...i.e. its good to be the king.

Word of caution with Asian carriers...they are absolutely by the book and take standardization to the 'nth degree. If the FCOM says the response is 'CHECK' and you respond 'CHECKS' or 'CHECKED' it is grounds to stop the sim...and they do. A number of early retiree US major heavy skippers went over there to ride out their final years...a lot of them have made it however five in one class busted. i ahve a buddy who was in training at the time and although the five guys side of the story would scare you away...the other view was that they were not willing to fully play the Asian airline training game...i.e. agreeing with some dope with far less experience that doing it their way was the only way.

good luck and enjoy Asia...its a fun ride.

fv"
 
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Anyway, back to the DAL pilot. After reading his letter I'm fairly certain I would have failed him as well.

Do you have a link to that letter? I'm just curious to see what the guy actually said.
 

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