Jumpseat and Politics

[Ty Webb]

If that is truly how it went down, then please accept an apology from all of us. I don't know of anyone who would find that acceptable behavior. I imagine there is a very long line to stand in, if you want to "have a word with him" about it.

However, if you are going to name someone on this forum. at least have the stones to sign your own name when you do so. Anything else seems pretty cowardly.

50Pesos, it's not too hard to figure out who people are on here, for example, figuring out what Floptions guy was in a certain 6/08 class.

 

[Fubijaakr]

While I understand what you are saying, I have refined my position on this to.... Non Reving and jumpseating are an earned right.

I disagree. They are a negotiated benefit. Ask DAL pilots who didn't even have access to their OWN cockpit jumpseat until they gave up something in negotiations.

Because of that, I have a hard time granting access to the jumpseat to non-Union pilots, especially those that are actively undercutting my contract.

You don't see non-Union electricians going down to the IBEW hall and asking for a ride to the jobsite, do you?

 

[maru657]

Complaining about one incident after one of the most contentious mergers in modern history? I think your lucky there were no fist fights. This was a professionally sold deal leaving one side holding the short end of the stick. Just read the continuing posts by the handful of SW pilots, they certainly look like professional jobs. Someone imposing the view that "well, yes we stuck you with a bad deal but it could have been worse, so let's all be pals now".

 

[SWA Bubba]

... after one of the most contentious mergers in modern history?

Methinks this dumbazz should actually READ some history before he actually opens his yap. Oh, wait,... I forgot who I was talking about.

Bubba

 

[slaquer5]

Complaining about one incident after one of the most contentious mergers in modern history? I think your lucky there were no fist fights. This was a professionally sold deal leaving one side holding the short end of the stick. Just read the continuing posts by the handful of SW pilots, they certainly look like professional jobs. Someone imposing the view that "well, yes we stuck you with a bad deal but it could have been worse, so let's all be pals now".

You are a very angry idiot. Funny how the biggest sissy on FI talks about fists fights. You are more of a hair pulling, and scratching type I bet.

 

[IBNAV8R]

I disagree. They are a negotiated benefit. Ask DAL pilots who didn't even have access to their OWN cockpit jumpseat until they gave up something in negotiations.

Because of that, I have a hard time granting access to the jumpseat to non-Union pilots, especially those that are actively undercutting my contract.

You don't see non-Union electricians going down to the IBEW hall and asking for a ride to the jobsite, do you?

Isn't the mixing of politics and rides the topic?

I'm sure a person of such high principles and moral superiority would be on the phone to Enterprise Rent-a Car before he/she would stoop so low as to bum a ride from a non-union neighbor.

Once had a guy give me serious crap about my union status. His jumpseat, his choice. Then, the very same guy shows up a week or so later wanting, no, expecting a ride.

 

[Fubijaakr]

Once had a guy give me serious crap about my union status. His jumpseat, his choice. Then, the very same guy shows up a week or so later wanting, no, expecting a ride.

Well, its wrong to deny a jumpseat then go to their airline and bum a ride. Don't ask if you refuse to reciprocate.

 

[LeeRoyJenkins]

Complaining about one incident after one of the most contentious mergers in modern history? I think your lucky there were no fist fights. This was a professionally sold deal leaving one side holding the short end of the stick. Just read the continuing posts by the handful of SW pilots, they certainly look like professional jobs. Someone imposing the view that "well, yes we stuck you with a bad deal but it could have been worse, so let's all be pals now".

First Officer Newman? Is that you? :laugh:

 

[maru657]

Obviously struck a nerve there. I wouldn't be surprised to see a lawsuit or two regarding the results of this merger, possibly even a failure to represent against SWAPA sometime in the future.

 

[SWA Bubba]

Obviously struck a nerve there. I wouldn't be surprised to see a lawsuit or two regarding the results of this merger, possibly even a failure to represent against SWAPA sometime in the future.

You can't possibly be this ignorant in real life... Can you? How could SWAPA be named in a "failure to represent" lawsuit by Airtran pilots? By the way, this is actually a serious question for you Maru. How 'bout taking a stab at it for us curious folk on the forum. SWAPA didn't represent Airtran's pilots. ALPA did. In fact, SWAPA represented the group (SWA pilots) on the other side of the table. It was their JOB to get as much as they could for their party, just as it was ALPA's job to get what it could for Airtran pilots. If Airtran pilots have a "failure to represent" case, it would be against the union that actually was charged with representing them. Uh,... if you're not paying attention Maru, that would be ALPA, not SWAPA.

Again, I'll post my opinion that in a few years, this will be thought of as one of the smoothest pilot SLIs in history, as much as that idea burns you up personally. So I imagine you'll just keep showing up and throwing out random accusations, stupid predictions, and other crap with absolutely no basis in reality.

Bubba

 

[shon7]

maybe the policy should be modified so management has the final say and makes the calls about jumpseats and that way there will be no such issues

 

[BILL LUMBERG]

Again, I'll post my opinion that in a few years, this will be thought of as one of the smoothest pilot SLIs in history, as much as that idea burns you up personally. So I imagine you'll just keep showing up and throwing out random accusations, stupid predictions, and other crap with absolutely no basis in reality.

Bubba

That's a large claim Bubba.....smoothest? really? get over yourself!

 

[Fubijaakr]

Well, I agree with Bubba on one point...any DFR suit would be against ALPA, not SWAPA.

As far as smooth SLI's go, this one is very smooth in comparison with LCC/AWA...not so much when compared to NWA/DAL. Smooth is most likely in the eye of the beholder. I think your average AAI Joe would disagree.

 

[flyboyike]

It seems like some of you assume you have the RIGHT to jumpseat. Its not a right, its a PRIVILEGE. And if an individual Capt doesn't want you on the jumpseat for whatever reason, you're out of luck.

Amen. I thought the Captain was the final authority.

 

[SWA Bubba]

That's a large claim Bubba.....smoothest? really? get over yourself!

You think that's a large claim? Hardly, in context of some of the outrageous claims made by others on this forum that you have no problem with. Careful.... your lack of neutrality is starting to show. I don't think it's me that needs to get over anything.

And to quote Fubijaakr (Jezus, who'd have thought I'd ever do THAT?), smooth is largely in the eye of the beholder. How do you objectively rate "smooth," Bill? Is it like porn, in that you can't define it, but you know it when you see it? Are you the judge? How 'bout this: we judge "smooth" by noting adverse legal action undertaken, successful or not. At least that's an objective measure, right? Make you a deal, Bill--in three years (when the integration is scheduled to be complete) we'll see how many lawsuits were brought for action concerning something "unfair" about this SLI. Then we'll compare it to AWA/USAir, United/Continental, Delta/Northwest, etc, and rate "smoothness" then.

Sound fair to you? Don't worry, if I'm wrong, I have no doubt that Ty Webb (or someone else) can look up a three-year old post of mine and shove it up my azz. He's pretty good at that. Or...... we can rub YOUR nose in it. I'm hoping you'll even give me bonus points if our integration is completed before some of those others who started before us. Until then, maybe you can keep your pompous attitude to yourself, and stop substituting your SWA-hating opinion as the benchmark for any level of "fair," "smooth," or "good."

Bubba

 

[Fubijaakr]

Amen. I thought the Captain was the final authority.

He is and should be. I'm amazed that a pilot would even suggest the Company should have that role. If they did NONE of us would ride the jumpseat again.

 

[Bwipilot]

Man--over the PA--must have a screw loose.

 

[waveflyer]

I'd think you'd have to have a pretty tiny sarcasm detector to think the above poster was suggesting mgmt control the jump.

But we do have mgmt as a controlling middle man- if we act like children and take our passengers hostage while we regale them with our internal politics over PAs- we might just get more control from mgmt. It is a privilege - not a right-
This post is good old fashioned PEER PRESSURE to not be an a$$ and be political with jumpseats. Many have gone down that road and it is a lose-lose

 

[Lear70]

There IS no moderation of this board anymore. All the mods quit and the Webmaster hasn't responded to anyone in months. He just lets it sit on autopilot and pays attention only to the ad revenue from the banners you see all the time. Just noticed, for the first time ever, he's allowing non-aviation advertising.

It's all about the dollars... welcome to the new-and-improved mud-slinging spectacle that is FlightInfo! That's it for my weekly post, back to lurking.

 

[slaquer5]

There IS no moderation of this board anymore. All the mods quit and the Webmaster hasn't responded to anyone in months. He just lets it sit on autopilot and pays attention only to the ad revenue from the banners you see all the time. Just noticed, for the first time ever, he's allowing non-aviation advertising.

It's all about the dollars... welcome to the new-and-improved mud-slinging spectacle that is FlightInfo! That's it for my weekly post, back to lurking.

Well good for him. He deserves a lot of dollars for having this forum .

 

[Grizz]

Well good for him. He deserves a lot of dollars for having this forum .

The guy that started this died. Ever since then, this place hadn't ben the same. (No offense to the ex-Mods)

Sent from my DROIDX using Tapatalk

 

[Lear70]

Well good for him. He deserves a lot of dollars for having this forum .

No doubt... I just disagree about the lack of moderation.

Eventually someone is going to sue the tar out of him for failing to maintain his own forum rules and for his lack of oversight allowing people to libel other persons' names and reputations. Not necessarily in this case, but eventually someone will get some story wrong, it'll get blown out of proportion, and by the time the truth comes out he'll be lucky not to owe more in court damages than this site ever made him.

THAT'S why it should have moderation. Just good common sense to CYA. Time for sushi on Manhattan Beach. Really enjoying the west coast and Caribbean long layovers, as I know their days are numbered...

 

[LeeRoyJenkins]

I am hearing that Mr. Newman just got canned. Can anyone from AAI confirm?

 

[Fubijaakr]

Let the bloodbath begin...

 

[GuppyWN]

I am hearing that Mr. Newman just got canned. Can anyone from AAI confirm?

I'd sure hope not. Have no idea who the dude is but I'd bet a buck he wanted those words back as soon as he said them. Getting fired for it is a gross over-reaction if you ask me.

I say he apologizes and we call it even.

Gup

 

[terrehautesux]

How's it going Brother???

As a WN captain I'll say this to the AirTran crewmembers - "my" airplane is your airplane. We're all family now and I will treat you as such.

Gup

Until a few days ago I was not sure how to feel about this whole thing. However, in BWI the other day a SW pilot called me "brother". I have to admit that small exchange gave me a nice feeling of welcome. It doesn't take much but I have changed my opinion. I am moving on and looking forward to my future with my "brothers".
--side note--
Tim is a good guy and he screwed up. I'm sure he is realizing that.

 

[Steeler Fan]

I am hearing that Mr. XXXXXXX just got canned. Can anyone from AAI confirm?

I have a lot of respect for my fellow pilots, once again, I respectfully ask you to stop posting this individual's name on here.

BTW, I also think it would be highly inappropriate to post the names of the WN pilots who were on the plane as well. That whole "chain of command" thing works great if we would use it (as opposed to circumventing the process by airing out that which could have been handled in a much more discreet and tasteful manner).

There are internal methods for handling this, and I am very confident that our jumpseat committee chairman and professional standards are very involved in direct action with the Captain, so can we please moderate ourselves on here.

Lear 70 is absolutely correct. One of the days, someone will accuse someone by name on here, only to later learn that pilot was not culpable at all...too late...damage done and innocent pilot's name dragged thru the mud and reputation tarnished.

(Once again, I don't have all the facts, but I trust that the jumpseat and pro-stan reps are very sensitive to mutual professional conduct, and they will handle this this right way.)

 

[Ty Webb]

I'd sure hope not. Have no idea who the dude is but I'd bet a buck he wanted those words back as soon as he said them. Getting fired for it is a gross over-reaction if you ask me.

I say he apologizes and we call it even.

Gup

Well put, Gup. Thanks for seeing it for what it likely is . . . . temporary insanity. I don't know the pilot in question, but from what I hear, this seems to be an example of a pilot with no prior problems who let the stress of the merger affect his conduct in a very unprofessional way. I am sure that by now, reality has "smacked him upside the head" and he is probably much chagrined.


Over the past 14 months, there are plenty of examples of "good people behaving badly" under the stresses of the SLI process. I think we many of us would like to take back a few things we've said, written, or thought :0.


I am very certain that this could be handled very effectively by the two unions' Professional Standards committees, and would hope that all of us, as pilots, would support an issue "between pilots" be resolved by Pro Standards, rather than by a Termination or Suspension. I would think that this could be an opportunity to acknowledge the problem, and to show a little mercy towards those who are still struggling to deal with the changes in their lives. From what I have heard, SWAPA would support a Pro Standards resolution, and I think this would be a goodwill gesture that would be welcomed and appreciated.

 

[waveflyer]

+1 Gup
+1 Ty
+1 brother terrehautesux

 

[slaquer5]

I am very certain that this could be handled very effectively by the two unions' Professional Standards committees, and would hope that all of us, as pilots, would support an issue "between pilots" be resolved by Pro Standards, rather than by a Termination or Suspension. I would think that this could be an opportunity to acknowledge the problem, and to show a little mercy towards those who are still struggling to deal with the changes in their lives. From what I have heard, SWAPA would support a Pro Standards resolution, and I think this would be a goodwill gesture that would be welcomed and appreciated.

Our Pro standards is a waste of time and a paper tiger. 100% worthless, with a bunch a little girls in the positions. If I was the said pilot, I would go down to DAL(solo) and talk to SWA mgt. .Tell your side,dont lye and man up. SWAPA Pro, Standards would hurt this guy more than help.