JO and pilots wages

[acaTerry]

Just a question for boo. You say the contract/TA has increases in every area. But I have heard that the minimum days off actually DROPPED to 8. What is the truth here? I'm not going after you. It's just an honest question.

 

[WileE]

The minimum days off for a reserve line were 8 before the new contract and they are 8 now. The minimum days off for a line was 9 under the old contract and is now 10 under the new contract.

 

[jetdriven]

min days off for a reserve pilot are 8 PER BID. we have a 28-day bid which equals 13 bids per year or 8.66 days off per month.

lineholders get ten days or 11 per month.

 

[kommutrdog]

Wow...8.66 days off per month..what will you do with all that time... probably real easy to keep a healthy relationship together with a significant other, but then again that sort of thing is not important for 75% of the pilots who voted YES.

Hey, but mesa gets to fly jets...whooppeeee.

The spouses of pilots have to be very understanding, but 8.66 days off is a little much to ask. God forbid if you commute.

Good luck to you all. Enjoy your 8.66 days off.

 

[j41driver]

min days off for a reserve pilot are 8 PER BID. we have a 28-day bid which equals 13 bids per year or 8.66 days off per month.

Wow, really??? That's a whole lot better than only having 8 days off. Give me a break.

 

[embdrvr]

For a clue as to why the situation is the way it is you have to look real hard at where Mesa get their pilots from. The better regionals like ACA, AWA, and SkyWest for example do not have too many programs like MAPD, PACE, or other Mesa style deals that put low time inexperienced pilots in the right seat. If these guys had been around the industry for a while they would be less willing to sell their soul. A lot of these guys are saying "whoopee, no more renting the 172 or the Duchess, I actually get paid to fly." The rest of us that flew 135 for a couple of thousand hours before we made it to a regional look at things a bit differently.

Don't be so hard on these guys. Many of them simply don't know any better.

 

[CitationLover]

embdrvr,

please watch out as the pedestal you were on has fallen out from under your feet. did you by chance goto embry riddle?

 

[js31pilot]

I HATE to even mention it but it would not be too hard to concieve that PFT might come back GOD FORBID.

When times are tough it is a TEST for CHARACTER........

 

[jetdriven]

its closer to 9. compare apples to apples. PLus this is only reserve pilots. line holders get 10, which is closer to 11 per month. not far off from AIRWIS who gets 12 days off per month. WOW a whole 12 more days off per year.

you guys are making more of this than it really is. Our 70 seat rates arent far from AIRWIS's newly signed 70 seat rates.

 

[embdrvr]

embdrvr,

please watch out as the pedestal you were on has fallen out from under your feet. did you by chance goto embry riddle?

I don't think you know WTF you're talking about. Embry Riddle? Give me a break a$$hole. I never had that kind of money. It was public college all the way for me. I did my ratings at local FBO's while I worked a real job outside aviation. I instructed, did a bit of corporate flying and a bunch of 135 freight. I've paid my dues so don't give me any crap about a pedestal unless you'd like that pedestal inserted (content deleted to avoid offending younger viewers).

Read my post. All I'm saying is that pilots that come out of those programs without any real world flying, life, or work experience are far more likely to vote in $hit contracts like the one just voted in by Mesa.

 

[mckpickle]

its closer to 9. compare apples to apples. PLus this is only reserve pilots. line holders get 10, which is closer to 11 per month. not far off from AIRWIS who gets 12 days off per month. WOW a whole 12 more days off per year.

you guys are making more of this than it really is. Our 70 seat rates arent far from AIRWIS's newly signed 70 seat rates.

You morron. AirWis rates are close to your rates because they just signed a new TA specifically to compete with your crap contract. If they didn't they would have lost the flying to you. Thanks again MESA.

 

[beechdriver]

You morron. AirWis rates are close to your rates because they just signed a new TA specifically to compete with your crap contract. If they didn't they would have lost the flying to you. Thanks again MESA.

Hey pickle, wasn't it you that said:

"...Face it you voted yes because you were scared. You have no insight and no sense of history. Otherwise you would have understood that you were condemned to repeat it. The excuse that you did this for your family is short sighted and weak... But rest assured you have lost the respect of the entire industry..."

I guess the "history lesson" was lost on your own pilot group as well. The sh!t always looks a bit different when it's falling in your own backyard, doesn't it? Don't worry, though - I still respect you...and you are always welcome in my jumpseat.

 

[nimtz]

Hey pickle, wasn't it you that said:

"...Face it you voted yes because you were scared. You have no insight and no sense of history. Otherwise you would have understood that you were condemned to repeat it. The excuse that you did this for your family is short sighted and weak... But rest assured you have lost the respect of the entire industry..."

I guess the "history lesson" was lost on your own pilot group as well. The sh!t always looks a bit different when it's falling in your own backyard, doesn't it? Don't worry, though - I still respect you...and you are always welcome in my jumpseat.

McPickle's pilot group hasn't taken a single concession yet and furthermore is actively working for better despite the damage the Mesa contract has done to our profession. BTW, the contract mcpickle's pilot group works under is almost as good as Mesa's new TA. Only problem was it was agreed to several years ago. Please be smarter with your insults...

 

[mckpickle]

Hey pickle, wasn't it you that said:

"...Face it you voted yes because you were scared. You have no insight and no sense of history. Otherwise you would have understood that you were condemned to repeat it. The excuse that you did this for your family is short sighted and weak... But rest assured you have lost the respect of the entire industry..."

I guess the "history lesson" was lost on your own pilot group as well. The sh!t always looks a bit different when it's falling in your own backyard, doesn't it? Don't worry, though - I still respect you...and you are always welcome in my jumpseat.

Shut up Jerk OFF.


Thanks Nimitz I know ya got my back.

 

[SanJuanPlebe]

Whose the Jerkoff?

Huh?

He's a jerkoff because he used your own words to question what happened on YOUR property?

Your logic is flawed. Our contract was WORSE before our new TA but yet you guys never bitched about "having to compete" with Mesa before.

So why would you have to "compete with Mesa" now? Seems to me you are just looking for someone to blame for your lot in life. The industry is in shambles yet Mesa pilots were able to secure enhancements while practically everyone else is taking concessions! Ever think maybe we got it right? Our scope provisions, the strongest yet, may save your job one day. Hopefully it will help our friends at Mesaba......

If you start worrying about what every other airline is doing, you'll go mad.

Let's be professionals and worry about our own houses.

Mesa has all the business we can handle (agreed to PRIOR to our new TA). We can't handle anymore and we can't train the pilots fast enough or obtain financing for planes that we've already ordered!

Read what Boo said earlier in a post on this thread. I think he's dead on.

Worry about Air Wisconsin...NOT Mesa. It's already done. You're beating a dead horse. And witholding a jumpseat is not only against ALPA policy, it's juvenile. We're all professionals here...let's act like them.

The Plebe
A loser who "bought his job" and went to MAPD instead of being a "real pilot" who flew freight for "thousands of hours" in order to be "worthy" of a regional airline pilot job.

I hope you detect the saracasm because I'm laying on pretty thick. We're all pilots...we all took the same checkrides and tests. The "I'm a better pilot" thing belongs in another thread......

 

[mckpickle]

Re: Whose the Jerkoff?

And witholding a jumpseat is not only against ALPA policy, it's juvenile. .......................................................................................

We're all professionals here...let's act like them.

All professional, than get paid like one moron.

And just so you know I have taken Mesa guys since that crap TA passed. A mistake I am unlikely to make again.

 

[SanJuanPlebe]

Jumpseat McPickle

OK,

Go ahead, deny us the jumpseat...use what little power you have in the industry to show us what a true idiot you are.

That's OK though...you're still welcome on our jumpseat. We won't revert to juvenile tactics that really don't matter to a hill of beans in the grand scheme of things. We're all about getting people to see their families or god forbid, to work. We don't play games with our jumpseat.

This stuff belongs in high school...

And the last time I checked, you had to be 23 to hold an ATP...someone who was long done with high school...

What a jacka$$! All you are doing is making yourself feel better. Be part of the solution...not part of the problem....Denying a jumpseat makes you part of the problem...it surely doesn't change anything other than to piss people off against you when now is the time we all need to stick together!

The Plebe
Loser Et. al....

 

[mckpickle]

Yup, I'm making myself feel better as Im stuck with sh1tty raises and wondering if I'll have a job because MESA decides to work for free.

Yup I feel better that the whisky guys have to take pay cuts to compete with you.

Yup I feel better that because your are a bunch of week spineless pricks that will work for nothing it will effect my life.

Yup I'm happy I work in an industry thats in a race to the bottom and you morrons are the poster children.

Yup I feel better shooting an aproach down to mins after a 14 hour/ 6 leg day because heck, the MESA guys are willing to do it so to compete everyone else has to.

You people discust me.

 

[SanJuanPlebe]

McPickel

OK,

Now that we've both insulted each other, let's have a reasonable and healthy debate on the finer points. No rhetoric please.

It's easy to toss stones, but look at Stillaboo's earlier post. He paints an acurate picture.

We raced to get "released" by the NMB, but AMW5481 put a halt to all negotiations (appropriatly I might add).

With no end in sight, Airways putting the pressure on, and a bipolar Boss who in my opinion would sell his soul for a buck, what would you do differently?

And let me inform you, NO ONE at Mesa is happy with our contract. So if you want to take your ire out on someone, do it to the Freedom Guys (the original guys before the TA). In my opinion, JO (Lorenzo) and THOSE guys enabled this situation to arise.

What do you do?

The Plebe

 

[Herman Bloom]

Plebe,

Why do we (ACA, Air Wisconsin, Skywest) have to comete with you? Because United just put its Express contracts up for bidding, that's why. And Mesa is the low bidder.

Don't get me wrong...I think our management should do their best to offer United a slightly lower package than the current one. If UAL picks Mesa for their lower cost structure, then so be it. I'd rather be out of this BS business altogether than pimp an otherwise successful regional airline out to a possibly dying partner. What I hope will happen is that United will keep ACA on as an Express carrier, especially considering the large infrastructure we have in place to serve their markets. That would be great, especially if Mesa didn't get a piece. It would suck for you guys, but hey, as so many have argued on this board, "that's business".

The point is we have to compete now because now is when the Express bidding is happening. Now that wasn't so hard, was it?