jetBlue's RJ's

[Skank]

amfteamster.........
Oh, nevermind.

 

[amfteamster]

dam, nobody bit. Gets boring on Saturdays.

In all seriousness, what will the pay structure be like for the RJ crews? Will it be set up differently than the A320 crews?

Are there going to be differences in the bases? RJ bases and seperate A320 bases?

 

[trainerjet]

I think its the International House of Pancakes and Flapjack Guild.

mmmmmm...flaaaapjaaaacks.

 

[General Lee]

How many times are you allowed to transfer back and forth between the new EMB Jet and the A320? Is it true that you cannot go back to the bus after switching from the A320 to the EMB? Is there only one transfer move allowed?

I think the term "RJ" can stand for a lot of things for different people. Some Comair pilots probably call it the "retirement jet."

Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[Eagleflip]

General-

I've heard (second hand, unfortunately) from Al Spain (VP Ops) that our Captains that go over to the 190 to get it started will be able to return to the 320 after two or three years.

Pay for these first Captains--the "transfer bunch"--is supposed to be grandfathered at 320 Capt pay, so it won't be a tough sell to get folks to move over. Once the 190 fleet has its feet on the ground, the original Capts could move back home to mamma Airbus.

If these statements are true--and I believe them to be--I will consider moving over for a while IF the 190 domicile is right.

Oh, gotta run...the Flapjack Guild is calling!

"Mmmmm.....flllaaapjaackks..." LOL

 

[General Lee]

Eagleflip,

That would make sense. If they did not allow that, I would think a UNION might eventually do it. They probably don't want a union on the property, so I bet it will be allowed, probably with a 3 or 4 year seat lock etc.....to cut down on training.

Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[Intruder One]

The latest rumor out of Phoenix.........Orenstein is getting the ERJ-170 and 190's.Just try and compete with his wages.

 

[dgs]

Why would we want to compete with anybody else's EMB-190 pay at any level? Our management will set a fair wage that is appropriate for the number of people the 190 can fly so the CASM is correct and employees are treated fairly. Just because somebody else may pay dirt wages to fly the same aircraft doesn't mean we will. Very faulty logic.

 

[boeing76]

I apologize if this has been covered. I didn't take the time to read every post on this thread. It seems to me that the key to success in this volitile industry right now is to keep costs down that can be controlled. One of those costs is maintenance. With one type of a/c mtc costs are kept much lower than with a mixed fleet like UAL and DAL among others.

Why, then would Jetblue want to jeopardize their success by operating 2 types of a/c? A differnt size Airbus would be fine, but they are looking at an a/c not even made on the same continent. I have never flown on JetBlue or for that matter even seen one of the planes, but everything I have read about the company shows me that they have made some very smart decisions. I hope that this subject is thought through some more.

Just my $.02

 

[General Lee]

Boeing76,

You are correct about the cost advantages to having the same type aircraft, or "derivative aircraft." Buying parts in bulk can save the company a lot of money and training is less expensive. But, having one supplier can also lead to other problems. For example, Delta is Boeing's best customer. You would think they would try to please us by giving us discounts etc. Well, when we ordered the 737-800s, and then later found out about the advantages of winglets, we asked them about equiping the 738 fleet. They said it would cost about $1 million per kit per plane. Then we found out that Boeing was offering the same kit to European LCCs for $500,000. We weren't very pleased. Then they started to over charge us for certain software. That pi$$ed us off too. When we recently had scheduled a 3 day meeting in Chicago concerning the 100 seater--the 737-600---Boeing was very happy about that. They apparently set up a big party and wanted to "wine and dine" our top executives---to try to sway their sale. When our guys showed up without luggage, the boeing people were miffed and asked why? Apparently Leo said they didn't want a large meeting and just wanted to know the facts about the plane, and that later they all had to catch a flight back to ATL and on to "Europe." (Airbus) Maybe that was an eye opener for Boeing. Maybe not. I bet Jetblue got a very good deal for the EMB-190's---with no maintenence for a certain amount of years--like their "non-existant deal" with Airbus.

Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[Dizel8]

Once more for the choir: jetBlue does not have a "special" maintenance deal with Airbus, what we have is warranties. ie a certain amount of landings per brake, a certain amount of engine time, etc, etc. This is common in most industries and is an advantage of buying new. I am certain Delta has it on their new Boeings, as does UAL, AA, NWA.

I am sure the same kind of deal is extended to U on the E-170 and jetBlue will get it on the E-190

The only difference between jetBlue and a legacy carrier is the age of the fleet, obviously newer a/c's are less mx intensive than older models. There is no doubt, that jetBlue's mx copst will increase, Neeleman has not been shy to say that, I think the number mentioned was 1 cent a mile, however, the co expects these to be offset by economy of scale.

 

[Heavy Set]

A good "finance" package can cover any "operational" savings derived from common fleets. Look at Easyjet in Europe - all 737 fleet until Airbus made them a deal they couldn't refuse on new A319s - the financing savings and special "discounts" fully covered any benefit from a common fleet.

Happens all the time.... It takes savvy negotiating and JetBlue execs appear to be pretty savvy...

 

[LearAv8r]

For example, Delta is Boeing's best customer.

Sorry to burst your bubble General but I kind of doubt that claim......


Regardless, congrats to Delta on recalling some of the furloughees...nice to see that things are not all that bad for everyone.

Lear-

 

[Reebo]

I think UAL is Boeings biggest/best customer. They fly the 73,74,75,76, and the triple seven

 

[General Lee]

I am not trying to brag or anything, but Delta currently has the most Boeing aircraft---especially since they bought McDonell Douglas---It is true from a parts issue and the shear number of Boeing and McDon Dug planes--and we have no Airbuses like United.

Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[Kid Charlemagne]

No grandfathering in A320 pay

Eagleflip,

I can lay this rumor to rest right now. I too had been hearing for some time that the intial cadre of Airbus pilots who bid down to the 190 would be grandfathered in at A320 pay rates, at least for a period of time. The theory being that this might encourage some more experienced JetBlue pilots to help get the EMB190 fleet up and running.

Well, I had Al on the jumpseat a couple of weeks ago and asked him about this and he said he wasn't gonna happen. Since I had heard this rumor so many times I wanted to verify...so I asked him a second time and he made it very clear - any A320 pilot who bids over to the EMB190 WILL take a pay cut...period. So much for the rumor....

One other thing. He also confirmed that there will be a 2 year lock-in for each fleet. But that is the only limitation....there is no lifetime limit. So if you have 20 years to go, you could theoretically switch back and forth between fleets like 10 times.

He didn't mention what pay-rates would be. Perhaps they're still working on it. Since most line pilots seem to be hoping for and expecting a raise for the A320 pay rates....maybe it will all be announced at the same time. We shall have to wait and see... In the meantime, it's all good. Profits are up and CASM is down and life is good!!

Happy Landings!!!

 

[Reebo]

I am not trying to brag or anything, but Delta currently has the most Boeing aircraft---especially since they bought McDonell Douglas---It is true from a parts issue and the shear number of Boeing and McDon Dug planes--and we have no Airbuses like United.





I guess i wasnt thinking of the MD80 as a boeing aircraft. My bad

 

[General Lee]

Reebo,

I know, it is hard to think that way. I personally hope we choose the A318 for our EVENTUAL new 100 seat aircraft. I have flown in the back of a Northwest A319, and thought it was very comfortable, and the cockpit was spacious. I think having so many "Boeing" planes is a disadvantage---but apparently Delta and Boeing are trying to come up with a "single cockpit"---or avionics package for the 737-800, 757/767 (at a $2million per aircraft install), 767-400, and 777---and the 737-600 might fall into that too. Who knows? I hope we first start getting a little bit more profitable first......

Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[jetblue320]

I am not trying to brag or anything, but Delta currently has the most Boeing aircraft---especially since they bought McDonell Douglas---It is true from a parts issue and the shear number of Boeing and McDon Dug planes--and we have no Airbuses like United.





I guess i wasnt thinking of the MD80 as a boeing aircraft. My bad

What has that got to do with jetBlue EMB190's?

You are free to start another thread on this forum anytime you want. Go for it.

 

[jetblue320]

Re: No grandfathering in A320 pay

Eagleflip,

I can lay this rumor to rest right now. I too had been hearing for some time that the intial cadre of Airbus pilots who bid down to the 190 would be grandfathered in at A320 pay rates, at least for a period of time. The theory being that this might encourage some more experienced JetBlue pilots to help get the EMB190 fleet up and running.

Roger that. That rumor got started by someone that was dreaming! It was never even considered to "entice" the A320 Cappies to swap to the E190 and lock their A320 pay. The enticement will be with QOL issues like basing, bidding seniority and whatnot. There will be enough "senior" dudes hopping to the 190 for nothing other than QOL. Money isn't everything, but it helps however.

And no, I'm not one of the "hoppers"!

See ya around campus.

 

[Eagleflip]

Kid C--

Got it. Thanx for the current gouge!

 

[colorado418]

Why, then would Jetblue want to jeopardize their success by operating 2 types of a/c? A differnt size Airbus would be fine, but they are looking at an a/c not even made on the same continent. I have never flown on JetBlue or for that matter even seen one of the planes, but everything I have read about the company shows me that they have made some very smart decisions. I hope that this subject is thought through some more.

Just my $.02

From what I understand, the 318 was indeed looked at with much interest. For obvious reasons, this would seem to be the logical choice.

The 318 would be a "heavy" 100 seat aircraft compared to the 190. You are basically taking fuselage out of the 320 to make it. It was not really designed to be a 100 seat aircraft. Lots of weight left after all the redesign. The 190 was designed more for that market and is better suited for it.

This is how it was explained to me by Lanny and Al.

Clear as mud???