jetblue reports small profit, loss for year

[Benhuntn]

AA you sound bitter. My guess is you are part of the problem. But then I am just a dumba$$ LCC pilot.

 

[AAflyer]

AA you sound bitter. My guess is you are part of the problem. But then I am just a dumba$$ LCC pilot.

Not bitter at all! Actually I am the dumba$$. You see I am a civilian legacy pilot. No future, no good contract. Just the bottom of the barrel.

Cheers,

AA

In case you couldn't tell that was humor.

 

[BLUE BAYOU]

True UAL and JBLU 5-year pilots both make $121/hr... But JBLU pilots will make $181.5/hr at premium (70+ hours). Furthermore, a recent search on Travelocity shows a round trip fare of $103 between MCO-ORD on Delta, UAL (Ted), and NWA... all airlines in Chapter 11. Now that's cheap, and JBLU doesn't fly that route...

 

[G4G5]

But I can think of one LCC that does fly MDW-MCO.

Premium pay is not contract guranteed. If things get slow they don't have to build 80+ hour lines.

 

[satpak77]

Frontier is down about 25% on the SWA announcement. I just bought a few shares as I don't see SWA tearing up DEN.

Jetblue is down around 4%. With a 3/2 stocksplit coming up in what Dec, that should bring the price in around $10 if the stock trades down to my anticipated $15 range. I will probably wet my beak between $6-8 per share as S&P has forecast a loss for the year of .10 per share($15M). This points to a 4Q loss of .25-.35 per share, or a $39-55M. Those fare give-aways to stimulate the new shuttle are killers.

:beer: Beer Me!

Why in God's name would you BUY a stock that is down. You should be shorting selling this dog

I guess you bought Enron also when it went from $80 to $40 and became a "fifty percent off sale, lets fill the dumptruck with more"

Enron later went from $40 to zero months later

 

[satpak77]

I agree......the pax will get over it. Besides, who cares what they think? The will still fly.

Soon they will all be flying on RJ's flown by the regionals or "majors" like Mesa

I mean, who cares what they think?

They will still fly.

 

[lowecur]

Why in God's name would you BUY a stock that is down. You should be shorting selling this dog

I guess you bought Enron also when it went from $80 to $40 and became a "fifty percent off sale, lets fill the dumptruck with more"

Enron later went from $40 to zero months later

Check with me in a few weeks. It's a short term play based on an over-reaction. My guess is I make 10 to 20% very quickly. If I'm wrong, then I take my medicine.

imp:

 

[satpak77]

Check with me in a few weeks. It's a short term play based on an over-reaction. My guess is I make 10 to 20% very quickly. If I'm wrong, then I take my medicine.

imp:

Fact is, the trend is down. Short-term play, over reaction, etc etc is all fluffy fundamentalist crap

the price is DOWN. Price is the ultimate fundamental.

what is your catalyst for a quick 20%?

 

[koko nw]

AA you sound bitter. My guess is you are part of the problem. But then I am just a dumba$$ LCC pilot.

One out of three ain't bad.

 

[A350]

G4G5:

See, that is where you are wrong.....the company will continue to build lines that are whatever the pilots want....its called a pref bid system. You bid for and fly as little (70 hrs) to the max (generally 95 hours) or as much as you wish. They don't build lines and then have you bid on them.

And further, if they restrict the number of hours the average joe flies, then they be less productive.

Try again.

A350

 

[G4G5]

G4G5:

See, that is where you are wrong.....the company will continue to build lines that are whatever the pilots want....its called a pref bid system. You bid for and fly as little (70 hrs) to the max (generally 95 hours) or as much as you wish. They don't build lines and then have you bid on them.

And further, if they restrict the number of hours the average joe flies, then they be less productive.

Try again.

A350

Real simple question? If you know for a fact that because of pref bidding you can always get the hours you want, then why even have a min gurantee?

Minimum gurantees were put in place to protect the pilot when times got tough. Talk to the TWA pilots about how pref bidding will never equal a slow down or a furlough. Pref bidding maximizes scheduling efficiencies. It does not put people in the back of the aircraft, it does not lower the cost of fuel or lower the cost of maintenance.

Why do airlines furlough pilots? Not enough fleet hours to meet the min gurantee for every pilot. Are you telling everyone here that JB will never ever have to furlough a pilot?

What happens when JetBlue takes delivery of all of their aircraft and their expansion comes to a slow down or grinding hault? They are already losing money, and having to cancel flights because of circumstaces beyond their control. Then everyone is still looking to fly 95 hours a month and their are not enough hours to go around.

You just keep telling yourself that it will always be like it is today. I am sure that every pilot ever furloughed felt the same way at one time. Their are plenty of pilots on this board who have seen lines built to 80 hours in good times and 70 in bad. Right now you have the flexibility, some day you won't, it's a simple fact that effects all airlines at one time or another. Still think I am wrong?

Those who don't learn from history are bound to repeat it.

 

[Dizel8]

"They are already losing money".

Technically, jetblue just posted a profit

I know, I know............

 

[A350]

G4G5:

Min guarantees are just that.....if you want to fly the minimum go ahead. It keeps the productivity up because the benefits that come with the job are spread out over a fixed number of hours at a minumum....

Of course, if JB has to slow down growth then they will just hire fewer pilots. If they have to stop growth, then they won't hire pilots. If they have to furlough, that is where the 5 year contract comes in. Of course, they say they will pay the pilots for the duration of their contract as furlough pay....but that can go away if there is no money.....

Point is, there are no guarantees, except death and taxes. Your cushy job in the left seat of the G5 is only as secure as the idiot writing the checks.

Facts are facts. JB has a great product, a fuel efficient fleet, and great employees. Our costs are low. If we are paying 2+/gal for fuel, so is everyone else sans hedges. So if we lose a few bucks in the 4Q, I can't imagine what other companies will lose.

A350

 

[BlueBusDriver]

AAFlyer.....not AAflower.

AA...
The Flower thing wasn't name calling. My apologies if you took it that way.
I was also hoping that you had indeed made a typo on those dates that you had posted. Looks like the Blue Marketers made a mistake. I'll shoot them an email and hopefully they will get that changed before the sale is over.
No need for you, myself or anyone else to be calling names or looking for an easy way to make each other look bad. My "typo" was just an honest mistake. Please don't look too deep into it.

Safe, Blue Skies Brother.....

BBD

Blue BusDriver,

I think your company has made a mistake. Glad you caught it, I didn't. If you go to the JetBlue.com website then click. Latest Deals and News you will notice the marketing error.
Hopefully you will call and get this changed.

Regards,

AAflyer

 

[G4G5]

G4G5:

Min guarantees are just that.....if you want to fly the minimum go ahead. It keeps the productivity up because the benefits that come with the job are spread out over a fixed number of hours at a minumum....

Of course, if JB has to slow down growth then they will just hire fewer pilots. If they have to stop growth, then they won't hire pilots. If they have to furlough, that is where the 5 year contract comes in. Of course, they say they will pay the pilots for the duration of their contract as furlough pay....but that can go away if there is no money.....

Point is, there are no guarantees, except death and taxes. Your cushy job in the left seat of the G5 is only as secure as the idiot writing the checks.

Facts are facts. JB has a great product, a fuel efficient fleet, and great employees. Our costs are low. If we are paying 2+/gal for fuel, so is everyone else sans hedges. So if we lose a few bucks in the 4Q, I can't imagine what other companies will lose.

A350

You never answered my question? Why even have a line holder min guarantee at all?

You came on here and told me that I was wrong. It's pretty clear that you don't understand how the system works.

Jetblue didn't have to put it in the contract, so why did they?

They did it to attract and retain pilots. What the company is saying is; this is the minimum that we will guaarantee you every month. If you choose to base your lifestyle on a 95 hour month so be it but it is NOT guranteed. Benefits have nothing to do with the with the number of hours you fly.

The insurance company could care les if you fly 70 or 95 hours. Does Jetblue get a rebate if you fly more? Does the insurance company send them a bill if you fly less? No, human resources goes to an insurance company and say's "we have x number of employees, " Benefit prices are derived upon then total number of employees. They are not"spread out over a fixed number of hours at a minumum...."

Where do you think they came up with 70 hours from? They didn't have to offer a guarantee at all especially one that high. Not when others like American (64), Delta (65), NWA (can go as low as 63), UAL (65) are offering much lower gurantees.

How many UAL pilots do you think are seeing 65 hour lines? Not many, most lines are built well north of that.

When the contract was written they were competing with every legacy for talent, they had to offer something descent. They knew based upon other LCC's with similar costs that they should be able to meet that guarantee with no problem Airtran (70), SWA (78)

Min guarantee has nothing to do with pref bidding or scheduling efficiencies. An airline could care less if they are pay you 40 hours a month. Whats the difference to them? They still have to pay your bennefits weather you fly 40 or 80. The only difference is your salery, they are saving 40 hours of salery a month.

In fact, during slow times they would rather pay you 40 hours, as long as reserve pilots aren't timiming out. During slow times that is actually the most efficient thing to do. Maximize reserve flying, because you are paying them already. Then offer the remaining block hours to line holders. If their is not enough left so be it. It's still cheaper then having to furlough and recall. What stops them from doing this is the line holder min guarantee. Which in your case is 70 hours.

That's why when you do salery comaprisons you do it based upon hourly wage and min guarantee. Sure plenty of Jetblue pilots are working beyond 70 hours and plenty of United pilots are flying beyond 65 hours. Thats not the point, contracts are written to allow all airline pilots to fly above min guarantee. To put it simply, it's how much money can you guarantee mama will be in the checking account at the end of the month.

 

[Maj]

I wish I could only fly the min. guarantee (70 hours) during most months. However, the normal target is around 84 (avg) and the 'min' target is around 77-79 hours. So, the only way I can fly 'min' is to PTO a trip assuming there are enough reserves.

 

[8vATE]

You never answered my question? Why even have a line holder min guarantee at all?

Wow G4..

You indeed have a real hard one for JetBlue...


The reason they have a min guarantee is to ensure some minimum productivity from each pilot and to have some sort of guideline on staffing per block hour.

A jetBlue pilot can drop with or without pay down to his/her minimum guarantee. As a manager you want some base line productivity from an employee that you're supporting with medical and tax payments.

You're really grasping at the jetblue cancellation pipedream (a lie) and the losing money bs.

Why don't you call the FBO and make sure that catering is ready?

I think everyone is tired of your incessant JetBlue whining.
Even General Lee is moving on to more important topics.

 

[G4G5]

Wow G4..

You indeed have a real hard one for JetBlue...


The reason they have a min guarantee is to ensure some minimum productivity from each pilot and to have some sort of guideline on staffing per block hour.

A jetBlue pilot can drop with or without pay down to his/her minimum guarantee. As a manager you want some base line productivity from an employee that you're supporting with medical and tax payments.

You're really grasping at the jetblue cancellation pipedream (a lie) and the losing money bs.

Why don't you call the FBO and make sure that catering is ready?

I think everyone is tired of your incessant JetBlue whining.
Even General Lee is moving on to more important topics.

Min guarantee has nothing to do with productivity. Jetblue mgt could care less if you fly 40 hours or 70 hours. Until all of the reserves have maxed their times out, mgt would prefer to pay line holders less because reserves are guranteed to get paid 75 hours no matter what.

Why is that so hard to understand?

If you fly a line of 95 hours and the reserve pilot only does 40 hours for the month it costs the company more money then if the reserve pilot maxes out and they pay you less.

Min gurantee is there for your protection to stop the company from flying reserves to max and then only building 40 hour lines.

"You're really grasping at the jetblue cancellation pipedream (a lie) and the losing money bs."
Did you read yesterdays papers or listen to the conference call?

 

[lowecur]

Rank investing amateur

Why in God's name would you BUY a stock that is down. You should be shorting selling this dog

I guess you bought Enron also when it went from $80 to $40 and became a "fifty percent off sale, lets fill the dumptruck with more"

Enron later went from $40 to zero months later

Keep buying those stocks on the way up there Charles Schwab.

Now let me hear you loud and clear...........How much is FRNT up today?

 

[bluejuice787]

To all those who reply to G4G5:

Poison Ivy goes away much quicker if you don't scratch it.

He clearly does not think through both the ideaology from others and his own. He wants JB to be perceived as BS so he can feel better about his demise.

If nothing else, remember that this is the man that blames his grammar on a "foreign keyboard", however, for the life of me I do not understand how that yeilds: "their" instead of "there" or "salery" instead of "salary" or "guranteed" instead of "guaranteed" or "effects" instead of "affects" or perhaps " ; " instead of " : "....and on and on.

We all make tie-pos from time to time but he simply does not even understand basic English. Tell me again why I should listen to his posts?