Jetblue Compensation Improvements

[8vATE]

One story that seems to be missing in action since the Valentine's Day Debacle has been the topic of the day is the fact that the VP of Flight Ops and the President of JetBlue conducted a pilot meeting in FLL the afternoon of Valentine's Day.

They made a committment to meet with the pilots and were under the impression that the situation was under control in JFK when they arrived around 12 pm in FLL from MCO. They had their Blackberrys and cell phones muted so they could devote full attention to the topics at hand.

Items covered in the 3 1/2 hours included :

Unionization
by ALPA or in house.
Southwest's mgt advice about an internal union and the collobarative relationship they have.

Pay

Retirement

Attrition

Trip Productivity

Compensation Analysis Comparison

Sick Time/Vacation Time (PTO/S)

CSSP

Stock Options

Morale

Communication
The Values committee to be the mechanism of communication for work groups and a more direct, structured organization for them.

Short answer.

A320 F/Os and EMB CAs to receive retro pay raise to Jan 1.
Retirement compensation increase to competitive rates.

Other increases coming.

TIMELINE
ASAP .. 6 weeks or so.

The door is closing on them and they know it is.

 

[SNOWBUM]

The email from green ( before feb 14) that came with the power point presentation about compensation said the increases would happen after 2nd quarter earnings, did they change their mind ?

 

[8vATE]

The email from green ( before feb 14) that came with the power point presentation about compensation said the increases would happen after 2nd quarter earnings, did they change their mind ?

Straight from Barger..
End of first quarter..

That was before the big storm ..
But I don't think it will be delayed much..
And I think they will not keep everyone in the dark.

 

[J32driver]

Straight from Barger..
End of first quarter..

That was before the big storm ..
But I don't think it will be delayed much..
And I think they will not keep everyone in the dark.

They can't afford to delay this at all. Whats the old saying.... Hesitate and die????

 

[SonicPig]

What did they have to say about the organization drive? Other than the fact they disapprove.

 

[crosscut]

One story that seems to be missing in action since the Valentine's Day Debacle has been the topic of the day is the fact that the VP of Flight Ops and the President of JetBlue conducted a pilot meeting in FLL the afternoon of Valentine's Day.

They made a committment to meet with the pilots and were under the impression that the situation was under control in JFK when they arrived around 12 pm in FLL from MCO. They had their Blackberrys and cell phones muted so they could devote full attention to the topics at hand.

Items covered in the 3 1/2 hours included :

Unionization
by ALPA or in house.
Southwest's mgt advice about an internal union and the collobarative relationship they have.

Pay

Retirement

Attrition

Trip Productivity

Compensation Analysis Comparison

Sick Time/Vacation Time (PTO/S)

CSSP

Stock Options

Morale

Communication
The Values committee to be the mechanism of communication for work groups and a more direct, structured organization for them.

Short answer.

A320 F/Os and EMB CAs to receive retro pay raise to Jan 1.
Retirement compensation increase to competitive rates.

Other increases coming.

TIMELINE
ASAP .. 6 weeks or so.

The door is closing on them and they know it is.

Probably a dumb question but... were your pilots pay-protected for the 1,000+ cancelled flights over the past week? This would go hand-in-hand with a few of the points in your 3 1/2 hour brief mentioned above. Curious.

 

[Hair-on-Fire]

Probably a dumb question but... were your pilots pay-protected for the 1,000+ cancelled flights over the past week? This would go hand-in-hand with a few of the points in your 3 1/2 hour brief mentioned above. Curious.

We were pay protected and paid double time (holiday pay)for everything. (not kidding). Maybe you guys can get that in your next ALPA contract.

 

[Purpled]

Whats the old saying.... Hesitate and die????

It's "Hesitate and Masterbate."

 

[8vATE]

What did they have to say about the organization drive? Other than the fact they disapprove.

Barger stood there and said if the pilots decide to organize, then management had failed them... case closed.

He would prefer to modify the Values Committee and improve the communication that the pilots have with the Value Comm. and use that as the formal communication mechanism (and still have the face to face that we have now). Believe me, I think they understand the situation now. They know that they are not dealing with the same environment they had five years ago. They know they are not competitive. They know they need to act now. Its up to them.

 

[Tejas-Jet]

Guys...if you decide that it is in your best interests to organize, then go for it. ALPA, another organization or an In-House union...whatever you decide it will be JB pilots voting for what is best for JB pilots.

All the best to you guys

 

[GuppyWN]

You don't need a union............ till you need a union. Do your guys have any recourse or fair representation in dicipline matters?

Gup

 

[SonicPig]

You don't need a union............ till you need a union. Do your guys have any recourse or fair representation in dicipline matters?

Gup

We do not.

 

[radarlove]

Your "Values Committee" IS A UNION, all the guys have to do is petition the NLRB to recognize it. You don't even have to have a card campaign.

 

[Citrusflyer]

We were pay protected and paid double time (holiday pay)for everything. (not kidding). Maybe you guys can get that in your next ALPA contract.

seriously......Valentines Day a holiday......yeah riiiggghttt.

 

[h2oskier]

Hey Citrusflyer,

Management decided after the mess to retroactively designate all flying from the 14th through the 18th of Feb. as holiday pay. So, if you flew or were scheduled to fly you were paid double. You can turn off the sarcasm now.

 

[crosscut]

Hey Citrusflyer,

Management decided after the mess to retroactively designate all flying from the 14th through the 18th of Feb. as holiday pay. So, if you flew or were scheduled to fly you were paid double. You can turn off the sarcasm now.

Impressive.

 

[Citrusflyer]

Hey Citrusflyer,

Management decided after the mess to retroactively designate all flying from the 14th through the 18th of Feb. as holiday pay. So, if you flew or were scheduled to fly you were paid double. You can turn off the sarcasm now.

First, good for you guys on the double pay.

Second, Sarcasm off....really....just pm me and let me know how high you want me to jump....I'll do it....really I will!

 

[8vATE]

You don't need a union............ till you need a union. Do your guys have any recourse or fair representation in dicipline matters?

Gup

In discipline matters we have the right to have a "Values Committee" member participate. As far as having contractual, union "protection" ... we don't have any. My personal experience has been if there is a reasonable explanation, there is a reasonable conclusion. Sometimes it seems like the guys that are doing all the screwups are the loudest advocates for a union.
One ex-USAirways guy comes to mind.
I wonder why he wants a union?

 

[8vATE]

Your "Values Committee" IS A UNION, all the guys have to do is petition the NLRB to recognize it. You don't even have to have a card campaign.

Good point.

We can have a "defacto" union if certain triggering events happen.
That's why the "Values" committee can NOT have a negotiating aspect to it but a COMMUNICATION aspect only.

But you make a good point.

 

[Headfake14]

don't do ALPA. go in house...if it comes to that.

 

[radarlove]

Good point.

We can have a "defacto" union if certain triggering events happen.
That's why the "Values" committee can NOT have a negotiating aspect to it but a COMMUNICATION aspect only.

But you make a good point.

I'd have to dig into case law, but I know that one of the very reasons "collaborative committees" were stopped being used by industry is because the courts have said that there is no discernable difference between, in your case, a "Values Committee" and a company-sponsored union.

Companys are not allowed to sponser unions per the law, so when does a company-sponsered "Values Committee" cross the line into being a company union?

I think the answer is pretty clear, it would only take a petition to the Dept. of Labor and Bob's your uncle, the Values Committee becomes a truly independant union with all federal protections afforded.

I am not aware of any difference in "negotiating" versus "communicating" in terms of it being a company-sponsered union. If you're talking working conditions, then you are a union in the eyes of the law.

There's a downside to this, it's one of the reasons so many companies avoid these collaborative committees, but the Japanese, for example, embrace them. Here the law says a company can't sponser it's own union, in Japan the rules are a lot different.

So back to the question--if you do just a little research, I think you'll find that you already have a union on the property and can get it recognized in a jiffy if you want to.

I can't imagine not wanting to--if they're already acting as an agent for you, why not make it official? It's like people that live together for 20 years, buy a house and have kids but don't get married.

 

[dee48eal]

if you go union - go alpa - at fedex we went in house and got hurt until we went alpa and gained knowledge and expertise ( lawyers / negotiators )

 

[HalinTexas]

if you go union - go alpa - at fedex we went in house and got hurt until we went alpa and gained knowledge and expertise ( lawyers / negotiators )

Just wait until things start going south at FEDEX. Then you'll see the truth.

 

[pipe]

if you go union - go alpa - at fedex we went in house and got hurt until we went alpa and gained knowledge and expertise ( lawyers / negotiators )

Don't kid yourself. Our current contract is what it is because Dave Webb is sensible and ex-EAL. He knows the evils of airline management. Had he been the leader of an in-house union, I think he'd have done as well. Like any good manager, he surrounded himself with good people and let them do their jobs. All those people were FX crewmembers, not ALPA national.

ALPA is good insurance, good legal advice, good place to call after accidents/incidents, and a really expensive bad magazine about RJ's. That's it.

In the bad times or the downturns, they are like a lead life jacket.

My hard-earned two cents on ALPA.

PIPE

 

[1st Overnite]

We were pay protected and paid double time (holiday pay)for everything. (not kidding). Maybe you guys can get that in your next ALPA contract.

maybe we don't have exactly that, but overall, I'd say I have better than that in my ALPA contract.

If you don't want ALPA, don't vote for them. But I've worked at a company with and without them. Overall, life has been better with the ALPA contract.

 

[SellingDirt]

Don't kid yourself. Our current contract is what it is because Dave Webb is sensible and ex-EAL. He knows the evils of airline management. Had he been the leader of an in-house union, I think he'd have done as well. Like any good manager, he surrounded himself with good people and let them do their jobs. All those people were FX crewmembers, not ALPA national.

ALPA is good insurance, good legal advice, good place to call after accidents/incidents, and a really expensive bad magazine about RJ's. That's it.

In the bad times or the downturns, they are like a lead life jacket.

My hard-earned two cents on ALPA.



PIPE

Do you happen to know Ed Bradley (sp). Netgotiating committee member for the company (FedEx), I think?

 

[Bob_Sacamano]

OK, I'll bite. How are we going to pay for that?

don't do ALPA. go in house...if it comes to that.