JB pilots say no to alpa/Barely

[Lake Alice]

Whether you agree or not this is a direct reflection of what we have to offer. Jetblue is a nice place to work. It's an enjoyable working environment but there are serious deficiencies with our pay, retirement, LTD etc. In today's environment pilots at regionals are deciding to stay at their regional as opposed to applying at Jetblue. As was mentioned in an earlier post most applicants are either woefully inexperienced or furloughed pilots with no where else to go. Should the economy change, majors begin hiring again and regional/mil/corporate pilots have options Jetblue will be at the bottom of their lists.
Those of us on the ALPA front we hoping to fix this and it's a very delicate balance. For FedEx/UPS have the best pay and benefits...period, but many pilots do not apply because of the working environment or schedules. In order to remain competitive Jetblue has to have a better package. The non-alpa supporters, as a whole, believe this can be achieved without a CBA. Legally, it cannot and therefore Jetblue will continue down the path set in motion many years a go.

 

[pilotyip]

Those of us on the ALPA front we hoping to fix this and it's a very delicate balance. For FedEx/UPS have the best pay and benefits...period,

They are very profitable trucking companies, that happen to have side line of flying airplanes. They pay well because their trucking makes them very profitable. Kitty Hawk was a ALPA represented a cargo airline, they made much less than JB pilots, and are now out of business.

 

[Lake Alice]

Kitty Hawk went out of business for several reasons none of which were due to a union particularly ALPA.

Other than FedEx or UPS every cargo carrier is a third party contractor much like a regional airline. Those jobs, since they rely primarily on another carrier, will never enjoy the same career benefits much like regional airlines will never, nor should they, enjoy the same career benefits as a major carrier. Unions are necessary for many of these carriers for basic safety and basic pay.

It's always enjoyable to read your opinions of how ALPA is the root of all evil. No union will save stupidity and bad management.

 

[pilotyip]

It's always enjoyable to read your opinions of how ALPA is the root of all evil. No union will save stupidity and bad management.

Now when have I ever said that? As a former ALPA member, all I have posted is that ALPA can not make a silk purse out of a pig's ear. Not that JB is a pig's ear, but there are limitations to what a union can deliver without destroying the host. But in order to keep the rank and file happy, unions must always ask for more and use their ultimate ability to run the airline from the cockpit to enforce their demands upon the employer.

 

[Lake Alice]

Yet the legacy carriers are profitable, except for AA, most of the regionals are profitable and all the LLC's are profitable. It sure seems as if most carriers have a good enough relationship with management where they aren't ruining or running the airlines, as you said, from the cockpit. All these LLC and legacy carriers, for the record, have better retirement and health benefits than Jetblue. All have legally enforceable contracts unlike Jetblue. And before you bring up bankruptcies and furloughs neither were caused by unions.

 

[pilotyip]

Yet the legacy carriers are profitable, except for AA, most of the regionals are profitable and all the LLC's are profitable.

that is because they are in a contract set up by BK, what will happen when this contract expires?

 

[Lake Alice]

Delta renegotiated their contract. United/Continental are negotiating a contract. Southwest negotiated a contract. Alaska negotiated a contract. Shall I go on?

 

[pilotyip]

Delta renegotiated their contract. United/Continental are negotiating a contract. Southwest negotiated a contract. Alaska negotiated a contract. Shall I go on?

sure go ahead, it great to see this thread continue to live. BTW Are those contract anywhere near the ones they came before BK?

 

[Lake Alice]

I'm not sure what you're getting at. The contracts are trending in the right direction and were not obtained from the cockpit as you suggested.

 

[pilotyip]

I'm not sure what you're getting at. The contracts are trending in the right direction and were not obtained from the cockpit as you suggested.

So the UAL job actions of 2000 had nothing to do with forcing the contract the was going to give give 35% pay raises?