I've been hearing rumors...

[Flex-ible]

Looks like we're all working hard. Raises all around.

Sounds like that will happen shortly at Flex. Annual pay is close to Net's, but for 208 days instead of Net's 182. CP wants to see daily rate alot closer.

Lots of "suggestions" about reducing days instead, but company doesn't seem interested.

 

[gunfyter]

You guys have a much lower Pilot per plane ratio so I am not surprised they are not interested in fewer work days.

 

[993_Pilot]

Who knows what will actually happen, but management has approached the union about 40-50 more furloughs already. Any P2P should be able to confirm this for you. I suspect that is at least part of the reason the schedule bid is being delayed.

 

[Myster79]

Who knows what will actually happen, but management has approached the union about 40-50 more furloughs already. Any P2P should be able to confirm this for you. I suspect that is at least part of the reason the schedule bid is being delayed.

I have heard rumors but nothing official from the union regarding additional furloughs.

 

[993_Pilot]

I have heard rumors but nothing official from the union regarding additional furloughs.

Like I said before, call your P2P rep, and he/she will be able to verify what I said earlier. There is nothing really concrete to announce yet, but management has approached the union with the possibility if they didn't get additional flying. If you read BT's email on Jan 2nd, he said that they haven't been very successful adding more flying. Then they delay the schedule bid, so you do the math.

 

[HSDriver]

No p2p or any other union rep will confirm anything. In fact they will deny it until the day it happens, just like the last time. I agree the delay in the bid is probably due to finalizing how many pilots will actually be in the bid. They are probably trying to figure it all out as the next cut will really be getting into be400 pic's and hawker SICs pretty deeply.

 

[Myster79]

Like I said before, call your P2P rep, and he/she will be able to verify what I said earlier. There is nothing really concrete to announce yet, but management has approached the union with the possibility if they didn't get additional flying. If you read BT's email on Jan 2nd, he said that they haven't been very successful adding more flying. Then they delay the schedule bid, so you do the math.

I know what you said, but their is no need for me to call anyone. Again nothing has been said to the P2P's!

 

[Myster79]

No p2p or any other union rep will confirm anything. In fact they will deny it until the day it happens, just like the last time. I agree the delay in the bid is probably due to finalizing how many pilots will actually be in the bid. They are probably trying to figure it all out as the next cut will really be getting into be400 pic's and hawker SICs pretty deeply.

Not sure about some people but I know the majority of the P2P's would say something. You all need to remember something, we had a meeting the day before the furloughs and their was discussion about possible furloughs, everything was denied. We all know what happened the next day. Believe me the P2P's were in the dark as much as everyone else.

 

[skyismyoffice]

That's what the company told the Union but... lets not forget that we are in the final stages (the money stuff) of negotiations. I wouldn't put it passed management to furlough more but this could also be a power play to try to 'ease' us through the money talks. Remember we still have Fud and Harrison at the table.

 

[PigPile]

Again nothing has been said to the P2P's!

Really? I beg to differ. Something was said back in Dec. just as someone else has said here.

 

[993_Pilot]

I know what you said, but their is no need for me to call anyone. Again nothing has been said to the P2P's!

Sorry, but that is wrong.

Really? I beg to differ. Something was said back in Dec. just as someone else has said here.

Something was said. It wasn't anything concrete, just about the possibility of more furloughs.

Not sure about some people but I know the majority of the P2P's would say something. You all need to remember something, we had a meeting the day before the furloughs and their was discussion about possible furloughs, everything was denied. We all know what happened the next day. Believe me the P2P's were in the dark as much as everyone else.

True, but Mat apologized for having to do that to us. If the union didn't respect the confidentiality agreement, that would be the last time the company shared any info. Again, no concrete info was given at the 12/18 P2P call-in, just that management has approached the union with the possibility of more furloughs. The union may not get any definite info until just before it happens. Even if they have, they probably signed another confidentiality agreement. I wouldn't expect to hear that a furlough is definitely happening, or get numbers, dates, etc. until the company makes the announcement.

 

[993_Pilot]

That's what the company told the Union but... lets not forget that we are in the final stages (the money stuff) of negotiations. I wouldn't put it passed management to furlough more but this could also be a power play to try to 'ease' us through the money talks. Remember we still have Fud and Harrison at the table.

Good point. It is difficult to know the real motivation behind anything management does during negotiations. If a furlough is managements idea of "posturing" for negotiations, It is a crappy thoughtless thing to do, but the good news is that those that get furloughed would probably be brought back sooner.

 

[Myster79]

Sorry, but that is wrong.



Something was said. It wasn't anything concrete, just about the possibility of more furloughs.



True, but Mat apologized for having to do that to us. If the union didn't respect the confidentiality agreement, that would be the last time the company shared any info. Again, no concrete info was given at the 12/18 P2P call-in, just that management has approached the union with the possibility of more furloughs. The union may not get any definite info until just before it happens. Even if they have, they probably signed another confidentiality agreement. I wouldn't expect to hear that a furlough is definitely happening, or get numbers, dates, etc. until the company makes the announcement.

Sorry, I guess I was vague. IF the company is planning more furloughs and the union leadership is aware of definite upcoming furloughs, then the P2P's were not told.

My point was there has been nothing official on the subject. We can sit here and speculate, but the truth is, we just don't know. I hope it doesn't happen.

 

[Dingo221]

If another furlough of 30 or 50 might happen, Some of our union leadership will be cut, so what are the consequences?

 

[CALRepublic]

If another furlough of 30 or 50 might happen, Some of our union leadership will be cut, so what are the consequences?

Question, when FLOPS furloughed, did they go by seniority or did they target some of the senior union-rep dudes??

 

[993_Pilot]

Sorry, I guess I was vague. IF the company is planning more furloughs and the union leadership is aware of definite upcoming furloughs, then the P2P's were not told.

That is true. It sucks to be treated like a mushroom.

My point was there has been nothing official on the subject. We can sit here and speculate, but the truth is, we just don't know. I hope it doesn't happen.

You are right about that, and my thoughts about the reason for the schedule bid being delayed due to more furloughs is speculation on my part, not anything I was told by union leadership.

If another furlough of 30 or 50 might happen, Some of our union leadership will be cut, so what are the consequences?

Unfortunately, the don't get immunity like the PSM's. Hopefully this will all be short lived.

 

[993_Pilot]

Question, when FLOPS furloughed, did they go by seniority or did they target some of the senior union-rep dudes??

The initial RIF terminations in May were done by arbitrary stats, and appeared to target union supporters. They were recalled with back pay.

The present people on furlough were taken in reverse seniority order, i.e. starting with the highest seniority numbers working towards the lower numbers. If there is another furlough, it will be done the same way.

 

[HSDriver]

If they furlough another 50 they really start cutting into crews that give them a problem. They start getting into the majority of Hawker SIC and a lot of the X SIC's which supposedly they are super short on X crews right now with a lot of guys doing overtime. So they are trying to figure out how to work it out in the upcoming bid is my guess.

 

[CALRepublic]

The initial RIF terminations in May were done by arbitrary stats, and appeared to target union supporters. They were recalled with back pay.

The present people on furlough were taken in reverse seniority order, i.e. starting with the highest seniority numbers working towards the lower numbers. If there is another furlough, it will be done the same way.

WOW, that's screwed up, don't really know what to say. Hope things turn around, in this environment NOBODY is safe....

good luck to us all..

 

[cherry20's]

WOW, that's screwed up, don't really know what to say. Hope things turn around, in this environment NOBODY is safe....

good luck to us all..

I think you misread the post (I think)...

Flops furloughed in seniority order starting at the bottom of the list, ie the highest number, and will do it again that way if there is more.