It's like AT ALPA is trying to burn their undeserved lottery ticket...

[Lear70]

I can see DOH minus 2 because of the retirements on the SWA side.

Depends where you're at with regard to Date of Hire.

I lost DoH + 2 years... unfortunately, that's the two years that SWA hired more F/O's than ever before in their history (mid '06 to mid '08). My 2 year loss cost me almost 1,500 numbers.

There's no "perfect solution".

 

[Music]

This thing sucks for both sides, Music. No more to give on either side. Choose wisely.

I'm not looking for anything from either side at this point. What's in front of me is unfortunately unacceptable. That's what I'm basing my decision on, not if I think anything more can be 'squeezed' from SW/SWAPA. If you knew me, you would know that would be the LAST thing I would hope for.

 

[Sacha]

I'm with ya Gup. I am voting no not because it will affect me because on the surface it won't. However it will affect the guys I am sitting next to and my loyalty is with them. Senior guys at previous airlines always sold the junior ones down the river because for the most part they just didn't care. I always swore I wouldn't be like them when I got some seniority somewhere. Personally I wish the whole thing would just go away. I see more negatives for SWA and all the employees than positives. Arbitration may end up being worse for us but I don't know any other alternatives. What a way to screw up a great airline......

 

[humveedriver]

Depends where you're at with regard to Date of Hire.

I lost DoH + 2 years... unfortunately, that's the two years that SWA hired more F/O's than ever before in their history (mid '06 to mid '08). My 2 year loss cost me almost 1,500 numbers.

There's no "perfect solution".

I see your point. It will be interesting to see what happens. If the MEC sends it out or not. Now that Sacha says he is going to vote no, I don't feel bad at all for wanting to vote no. Hell, let's have both sides do about a 90% NO vote.

 

[humveedriver]

I realize some SWA pilots and other airline pilots are probably confused as to why some of us AT pilots aren't chomping at the bit to get this deal done with the current offer. Turns out; it's really hard to just surrender your seniority on your own. If it goes to arbitration and THEY hand me a 31% loss of seniority, then it is what it is.

 

[Sacha]

I'm with ya brother, tear it up. Start over.

 

[Music]

Music,

Thanks for the rational discussion.

Gup

No problem. It's the least I can do when I at appears that I am pouring gasoline on a fire.

 

[Sacha]

The morning I heard about the air tran merger, acquisition or whatever, I was driving to work and my one of my Delta friends called and told me the news. He asked what I thought was going to happen with the SLI and even though I was half asleep I pondered for about 2 seconds and said "arbitration. Guaranteed.". When he asked why with our pay and decent mgt etc. would they do that? Simple. Any pilot group that votes 98% to strike in this economy with so many highly qualified furloughed or under employed pilots who would cross their picket line in a heartbeat won't even flinch at going to arbitration. They have nothing to lose compared to that. He said I was absolutely right. What I did not predict was how many fellow SWA pilots would be even more p'off.

 

[jonjuan]

The morning I heard about the air tran merger, acquisition or whatever, I was driving to work and my one of my Delta friends called and told me the news. He asked what I thought was going to happen with the SLI and even though I was half asleep I pondered for about 2 seconds and said "arbitration. Guaranteed.". When he asked why with our pay and decent mgt etc. would they do that? Simple. Any pilot group that votes 98% to strike in this economy with so many highly qualified furloughed or under employed pilots who would cross their picket line in a heartbeat won't even flinch at going to arbitration. They have nothing to lose compared to that. He said I was absolutely right. What I did not predict was how many fellow SWA pilots would be even more p'off.

And I thought one had to have at least a State college education to get hired at SWA. Apparently not.

 

[Sacha]

Jj

So I was wrong? Why the insult? I guess this means you are voting yes. Well good for you.

 

[Empennage]

The one thing being left out on all of these threads is what arbitration does accomplish and what it does not accomplish. What is does is a senioirty list. Period.

All the discussion in regards to how complicated the AIP is simply ironic. Especially those stating that is the reason they are voting no. The arbitrated solution, in the end, would be the most complicated and convoluted solution we could ever dream up.

Lets face it, the AIP is a big bill to swallow for both parties. If we want to discuss voting no and continuing to arbitration in a hypothetical sense, than lets discuss any and all implementation post arbitration. To be clear I am not referring to fear tactics and parking airplanes. I am pointing out the implementation process, who handles the implementation, bump and flush, fences, ect.

We need to all be honest here.

 

[dicko]

I think we will be playing Russian Roulette with a pistol not a revolver if this goes to arbitration. The sad thing is you and I will be sitting directly next to Slick and Big Sis when they pull the trigger. I hope I'm wrong...........

Maybe you should leave 'handguns' out of your post. Perhaps velvet and astroglide would suit you better.

 

[dicko]

The morning I heard about the air tran merger, acquisition or whatever, I was driving to work and my one of my Delta friends called and told me the news. He asked what I thought was going to happen with the SLI and even though I was half asleep I pondered for about 2 seconds and said "arbitration. Guaranteed.". When he asked why with our pay and decent mgt etc. would they do that? Simple. Any pilot group that votes 98% to strike in this economy with so many highly qualified furloughed or under employed pilots who would cross their picket line in a heartbeat won't even flinch at going to arbitration. They have nothing to lose compared to that. He said I was absolutely right. What I did not predict was how many fellow SWA pilots would be even more p'off.

You're right. Unfortunately you overestimated ALPA and AirTran pilots. Refer to Kharma Police's post.

The rot is deep .... Real deep.

 

[On Your Six]

Depends where you're at with regard to Date of Hire.

I lost DoH + 2 years... unfortunately, that's the two years that SWA hired more F/O's than ever before in their history (mid '06 to mid '08). My 2 year loss cost me almost 1,500 numbers.

There's no "perfect solution".

You sound like it's a done deal. Is it?


OYS

 

[Khaver01]

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...by